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Desertboy
13-10-2017, 01:12 PM
They were the right connectors from rapid online, just got some cable for the signals but still waiting on the CY cable does mean though I can wire the BOB over the weekend, connect the power supply, PC and parallel port so easy job when CY cable comes.

23028

AlexDoran
13-10-2017, 02:44 PM
Looking good mate!

Desertboy
13-10-2017, 02:50 PM
Looking good mate!

I especially like the blood at the bottom of the case (Mine of course)

Decided not to go back today was sent some drawings from a solidworks designer and not happy at all I know I can draw them better in Fusion how we want them but not sure how lol.

Taking a while to get used to not having a co-ordinate system anymore and working from offsets but I'm hoping if I keep my head down I can get the drawings finished today.

Zeeflyboy
13-10-2017, 04:36 PM
I especially like the blood at the bottom of the case (Mine of course)



These things don't work without a blood sacrifice...

Desertboy
16-10-2017, 06:10 PM
These things don't work without a blood sacrifice...

I think in the old days you used to sacrifice someone else's blood.

Started the wiring today ;) Only going to wire up 2 of the stall protections for now (For the dual ballscrew) once it works we'll add in the other 2.

23072

I'm guessing the plus/minus dir don't matter which way round they are wired and can be changed in Mach 3/LinuxCNC

Desertboy
19-10-2017, 01:01 PM
Finally skanked a 2nd hand piece of ply to use for shelves almost having to go buy one there :)

Wired up a little more, now I need the CY cable so I can wire to the motors, limit switchs will go on last as I haven't even decided how to mount them yet past a brief look around the machine for ideas.

I think I might need to use the machine to make the limit switch mounts as I want them to be rock solid out of aluminium rather than 3d print them.

23079

I hope I wired the emergency in correctly (Only 2 of 4 wired in at moment) wired them to a barrier connector block joining the live to live and neutral to neutral than ran 1 wire each to the right inputs on the BOB.

I assume it's similar with the limit switches, wire all the grounds to 1 connector and then from there to the common ground (same as emergency) then wire the limit lives. X&Z to the X input, One Y limit switch to the Y input and the 2nd Y limit switch to the Z?

I did ask before but forgot the answer what power should I feed the BOB
23081

Looks like theres 2 PC live 5v's inputs, with 1 gnd, also 12-24v input and a 5v USB? Which one should I use? I'm going to have this sat next to the pc that will control it and I'll get a 4 pin molex extension to tap a spare output from the PSU so will have both 5v & 12v available.

Chaz
19-10-2017, 01:09 PM
5V comes from USB, 12 - 24V - external PSU. Same BOB was used on my previous Emco lathe.

Desertboy
19-10-2017, 01:52 PM
5V comes from USB, 12 - 24V - external PSU. Same BOB was used on my previous Emco lathe.

But there's 3 pins bottom right marked PC GND and 2 marked PC 5v I was wondering are these inputs? if so do they replace the usb? I'm going to run a 4 pin molex from the PC power supply so have bother 5v and 12v to tap would be neater than USB and possibly more reliable?

It's nice that the BOB came with not even one piece of paper lol I had to google around to find that image or what looks like my board.

Chaz
19-10-2017, 01:58 PM
But there's 3 pins bottom right marked PC GND and 2 marked PC 5v I was wondering are these inputs? if so do they replace the usb? I'm going to run a 4 pin molex from the PC power supply so have bother 5v and 12v to tap would be neater than USB and possibly more reliable?

It's nice that the BOB came with not even one piece of paper lol I had to google around to find that image or what looks like my board.

Perhaps, not sure. Mine used USB power.

Desertboy
19-10-2017, 02:23 PM
Dumb question but the spindle has 4 pins marked 1, 2, 3 & 4 which is the ground? (I think it's 4)

To check if it's grounded do I just undo the bolts at the top and it comes off?

Should I just solder directly to those pins or is there a connector I crimp on?

Chaz
19-10-2017, 02:29 PM
Dumb question but the spindle has 4 pins marked 1, 2, 3 & 4 which is the ground? (I think it's 4)

To check if it's grounded do I just undo the bolts at the top and it comes off?

Should I just solder directly to those pins or is there a connector I crimp on?

Ring it out with multimeter. One of them should respond to the metal casing. If not, measure the resistance between the windings till you are certain you have the 3 phases identified.

Nr1madman
19-10-2017, 03:53 PM
Have the same BOB (not used it yet) and as I understand it you can have either the USB or the bottom connections for 5v.
The 12-24v connection is to be able to use 1-10v regulation for the spindle and perhaps the on/off signal aswell.. Will have to experiment :D

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Clive S
19-10-2017, 05:14 PM
Have the same BOB (not used it yet) and as I understand it you can have either the USB or the bottom connections for 5v.
The 12-24v connection is to be able to use 1-10v regulation for the spindle and perhaps the on/off signal aswell.. Will have to experiment :D

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With these BOB's you need 5v AND 12-24v connected. It needs the 12-24v connected to get the inputs to work the 5V can be either be the usb or 5v I would use 5V.

Nr1madman
19-10-2017, 05:40 PM
With these BOB's you need 5v AND 12-24v connected. It needs the 12-24v connected to get the inputs to work the 5V can be either be the usb or 5v I would use 5V.Clive, you are a champ as always :D

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Desertboy
20-10-2017, 01:59 PM
I understand now, I think I'll use a molex extension cable to run one of power cables out the back of the new PC (Mini tower) then into the chassis with the steppers in it. Then run the 12v to a junction box and the 5v direct to the PC in and PC gnd. The 12v I can then split 3 ways 2 to pc fans to cool the stepper drivers and toroidal transformer and the other to the BOB.

The new PC doesn't have a parallel port (Doh! was watching a 3.4ghz it sold bought a 2.93ghz I7 assumed would be same motherboard and isn't!)

but does have 1 original PCI slot (And the rest PCI-E) so bought this
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/IEEE-1284-DB-25-Pin-Printer-Parallel-Port-PCI-I-O-Card/320890941834?ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT&_trksid=p2057872.m2749.l2649

Do I need a better adapter or will this be ok? The other adapters do seems to have more chips on them lol.

And the PC has a 8400GS 512 meg gfx card will this be enough to run fusion 360, looking around it should do but I'll have to turn shadows and some other effects off. This machine will only be used for CAM and controlling Betty (My name for the router) so don't want to spend any more than I have to on it. My home machine is my cad machine (Got a 760GTX in that, seems to power along fine).

Going to have to slum it with 4gb on the CAM machine for now but want to upgrade my machine to 16 or 32gb next month and then can rob the 8gb from that for the CAM machine.

Chaz
20-10-2017, 02:05 PM
I understand now, I think I'll use a molex extension cable to run one of power cables out the back of the new PC (Mini tower) then into the chassis with the steppers in it. Then run the 12v to a junction box and the 5v direct to the PC in and PC gnd. The 12v I can then split 3 ways 2 to pc fans to cool the stepper drivers and toroidal transformer and the other to the BOB.

The new PC doesn't have a parallel port (Doh! was watching a 3.4ghz it sold bought a 2.93ghz I7 assumed would be same motherboard and isn't!)

but does have 1 original PCI slot (And the rest PCI-E) so bought this
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/IEEE-1284-DB-25-Pin-Printer-Parallel-Port-PCI-I-O-Card/320890941834?ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT&_trksid=p2057872.m2749.l2649

Do I need a better adapter or will this be ok? The other adapters do seems to have more chips on them lol.

And the PC has a 8400GS 512 meg gfx card will this be enough to run fusion 360, looking around it should do but I'll have to turn shadows and some other effects off. This machine will only be used for CAM and controlling Betty (My name for the router) so don't want to spend any more than I have to on it. My home machine is my cad machine (Got a 760GTX in that, seems to power along fine).

Going to have to slum it with 4gb on the CAM machine for now but want to upgrade my machine to 16 or 32gb next month and then can rob the 8gb from that for the CAM machine.

Add on cards are hit and miss. Some work first time, some are a struggle, some never work.

Desertboy
20-10-2017, 03:38 PM
Add on cards are hit and miss. Some work first time, some are a struggle, some never work.

At a pinch I can use another PC for controlling the machine which might not be a bad idea anyways.

AlexDoran
20-10-2017, 03:56 PM
Try it and send it back if not, eBay always sides with the buyer lol.

Desertboy
20-10-2017, 05:27 PM
Try it and send it back if not, eBay always sides with the buyer lol.

I'm happy with the price lol £90 for a 2.93ghz I7 desktop with 4gb of ram will do fusion 360 nicely I think for a CAM only machine. I'm sure I can get the parallel port working just wondering if this cheap ass card I bought works like a winmodem in which case it's probably useless for a CNC machine. If that's the case I might buy another card or more likely just grab another PC for the controller have a few motherboards kicking around with CPU's, ram and parallel ports on them.

AlexDoran
23-10-2017, 11:39 AM
Thats what i meant return the card if it doesn't work :D

Desertboy
23-10-2017, 12:51 PM
Thats what i meant return the card if it doesn't work :D

It was £2 (delivered) for the PCI card lol got PC this morning, just set it up and installing windows 7, then we'll see if the GFX card works with fusion 360.

Still waiting on my 1.5mm CY cable for the spindle (Didn't order enough last time) will be tomorrow.

Itching to get it working, but got 1/2 of it wired now, really need to sort the limit switches out but need to machine to work so I can manufacture the parts (Out of aluminium obviously) as I need to guarantee repeatability for my plan to work.

AlexDoran
24-10-2017, 09:11 AM
It was £2 (delivered) for the PCI card lol got PC this morning, just set it up and installing windows 7, then we'll see if the GFX card works with fusion 360.

Still waiting on my 1.5mm CY cable for the spindle (Didn't order enough last time) will be tomorrow.

Itching to get it working, but got 1/2 of it wired now, really need to sort the limit switches out but need to machine to work so I can manufacture the parts (Out of aluminium obviously) as I need to guarantee repeatability for my plan to work.

Ah ok haha.

I just semi-finished wiring again for the second time, Proximity sensors i had were NPN & not PNP. What are the parts like? I could 3D Print temporary ones for you.

Alex

Desertboy
31-10-2017, 07:19 PM
Little bit more done today, limit switches are fitted directly into the aluminium extrusion

23122 You can just see the red microswitch at the end of the energy chain a Hiwin carriage triggers it, there's identical switch on the other side in same position.

23123 And just under the bolt in the energy is the other switch only one bolt at moment need to find a 5mm piece of aluminium so I can fit the 2nd bolt but the edge is tight against the Hiwin rail so it's solid.

I drilled them tapped the holes, very happy how they came out. There is no Z axis switch yet will rebuild the Z axis so they will be added then.


Power supply is ready to be hooked up to the AM882's

23124

AM882's now have all the stall protection wired in
23125

The PC to control this now has windows 7 and Fusion 360 on it, and a parallel pci card installed. Wiring is in the energy chain just need to connect everything up, earth the spindle and connect solder that up and we can get it running.

Need to get some wiring for microswitch just going to use cheap 2 core a junction box to split the power from the home built PSU to 4 steppers and some connector plugs will pick up on way to work tomorrow.

How should I connect the CY cable to the nema cable, soldering or connectors?

AlexDoran
01-11-2017, 09:28 AM
Looks ace mate good progress! Is there anything special needed in order to enable stall protection on the drivers? I have the same ones but only have them wired normally at the moment, remember seeing in the manual that it said it only works above 300RPM.

I soldered my CY cable to the motor wiring, make it easier for me as i was going 8 wires into 4.

Alex

Desertboy
01-11-2017, 10:36 AM
Looks ace mate good progress! Is there anything special needed in order to enable stall protection on the drivers? I have the same ones but only have them wired normally at the moment, remember seeing in the manual that it said it only works above 300RPM.

I soldered my CY cable to the motor wiring, make it easier for me as i was going 8 wires into 4.

Alex

Just wire the output to the emergency input on your controller board then if it's missing a step the machine shuts down. You can see it's the 2 wires for stall protection next to the direction outputs on the AM882's.

On my controller I had to wire them to a connector and then to the emergency input on my BOB as I have to cram 4 wires into 1 emergency socket, it's worse for the ground I have to cram at least 7 wires into 1 lol.

Desertboy
01-11-2017, 10:53 AM
Quickie question, I'm sure this is ok

I have 3 microswitches at moment 2 on the Y axis (Dual ballscrew) and 1 on the X axis, I want to wire from the Y axis microswitch to the 1 of the X Axis microswitches in series and then to the BOB X input and the other Y axis switch to the Y input is this ok?

Clive S
01-11-2017, 11:06 AM
Quickie question, I'm sure this is ok

I have 3 microswitches at moment 2 on the Y axis (Dual ballscrew) and 1 on the X axis, I want to wire from the Y axis microswitch to the 1 of the X Axis microswitches in series and then to the BOB X input and the other Y axis switch to the Y input is this ok?

I would keep the Y switches on the there own inputs . Can you sketch a circuit of what you intend to do?

Nr1madman
01-11-2017, 11:55 AM
If I understand you correctly it would work but you will only be able to home one axis at a time.. this is something I think about aswell for my build.
The way I think I'm gonna go is with one more bob to get inputs to use them separately :)

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Desertboy
01-11-2017, 05:00 PM
Got the limit switches wired up and the Y axis limit switch cable fed through the energy chain which meant removing it, it's a very tight fit ;)

Spent ages on little bits like making sure the CY cable is well supported, cabling is fed nice and neatly back to the control box.

Also spent 2 hours stripping some copper radiator water cooling units from a massive control box going to keep one to cool my spindle and sell one they're chunky things.

Going to go back in an hour and see if I can get the CY cable and spindle cable on tonight and move the PC down and connect up the power, etc. So tomorrow morning I can start playing, need to think about where to mount my VFD and copper rad.

Nr1madman
01-11-2017, 05:34 PM
Go-go desertboy! :D

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Desertboy
01-11-2017, 06:13 PM
I would keep the Y switches on the there own inputs . Can you sketch a circuit of what you intend to do?

I've run the X axis (Gantry) to the X input and the 2 Y Axis limits to Y & Z, when I add a Z I'll add it to the the same input as the Y but will get better electronics than this BOB soon but have other things I'd rather do first.

Clive S
01-11-2017, 06:34 PM
I've run the X axis (Gantry) to the X input and the 2 Y Axis limits to Y & Z, when I add a Z I'll add it to the the same input as the Y but will get better electronics than this BOB soon but have other things I'd rather do first.

I thought you was connecting up the home switches before. The limits can all be connected in series together.

Desertboy
01-11-2017, 06:50 PM
I thought you was connecting up the home switches before. The limits can all be connected in series together.

Yes limits/home dual use.

Neale
01-11-2017, 08:15 PM
How are you planning to use the dual home switches (Y axis in your case?). Generally you do this for gantry squaring, but only if your motion controller supports this (and not all do!). I don't think that Mach3 can do this either. I have the same problem on my own machine, by the way, and not trying to pick holes in your design. It's just one of those things that isn't obvious until you come to try to do it...

Personally, I home my dual-axis using just one home switch and manually tweak the other side for squaring purposes as my motion controller is no help at all in this area.

Clive S
01-11-2017, 09:22 PM
I don't think that Mach3 can do this either.Neale I think Mach3 can do dual homing. UNCHECK "Home Slave with Master" in General Config. You may also need to modify your Ref All script to use RefCombination() to get the two sides to move together.

Desertboy
01-11-2017, 09:29 PM
How are you planning to use the dual home switches (Y axis in your case?). Generally you do this for gantry squaring, but only if your motion controller supports this (and not all do!). I don't think that Mach3 can do this either. I have the same problem on my own machine, by the way, and not trying to pick holes in your design. It's just one of those things that isn't obvious until you come to try to do it...

Personally, I home my dual-axis using just one home switch and manually tweak the other side for squaring purposes as my motion controller is no help at all in this area.

I'm going to try linuxcnc which does support gantry squaring (Whether it works with my BOB we'll see) at least in 2.8, a quick google and it appears mach 3 does as well.

I'll try mach 3 as well, I planned a 2 pc setup for the cnc machine just in case with windows 7 & Fusion on one and the other with linuxcnc that way I can try both easily and have convenience of cam next to the machine.

Desertboy
01-11-2017, 09:36 PM
What are they? I first thought they were radiators I have 2 of them, when I stripped them off they were full of water. Came from a large controller box for automated machinery, also recovered a 75amp 3phase RF filter box.

23126
23129

Got more done, finally ready to solder the cy cable to the steppers.
23127
23128

Neale
01-11-2017, 09:58 PM
Neale I think Mach3 can do dual homing. UNCHECK "Home Slave with Master" in General Config. You may also need to modify your Ref All script to use RefCombination() to get the two sides to move together.

I stand corrected! I'm using a CSMIO-IP/M which handles dual-axis and homing, but doesn't handle squaring (i.e. homing each end of the gantry simultaneously-but-separately, if you see what I mean). Because the CSMIO does some stuff internally and Mach3 does the rest, it's not always easy to see what is a Mach3 feature/restriction and what comes from the CSMIO. It's unfortunate that one of the things that drove me towards Mach3 was that LCNC, at the time, didn't support dual-axis properly. Sorry if I've mislead anyone.

Clive S
01-11-2017, 11:21 PM
Sorry if I've mislead anyone.No you have not. That is the beauty of a forum its generally self correcting I certainly need it.:thumsup: and I value your input.

Nr1madman
02-11-2017, 05:42 AM
Just tought of something..
I'd you have the limitswitch like that and get some overshoot you will crush the switch ;)
I.e if the machine is on a rampage and go full speed into the side.. If you have the switch in a way so the machine will only touch the trigger but pass the housing of the switch it should stop in a few mm :D

Make any sense?

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Davek0974
02-11-2017, 09:06 AM
What are they? I first thought they were radiators I have 2 of them, when I stripped them off they were full of water. Came from a large controller box for automated machinery, also recovered a 75amp 3phase RF filter box.

23126
23129



Just a pure guess but they could be part of the supply for an inductive heating setup.

Desertboy
02-11-2017, 10:42 AM
Just tought of something..
I'd you have the limitswitch like that and get some overshoot you will crush the switch ;)
I.e if the machine is on a rampage and go full speed into the side.. If you have the switch in a way so the machine will only touch the trigger but pass the housing of the switch it should stop in a few mm :D

Make any sense?

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Yes that's a good point but the microswitches are cheap and hopefully will reduce the damage when 4mm later the gantry mount crashes into the BK12 fitting lol, I'll see what happens when I start running it I guess.

Should order a selection of button and lever microswitches so I have spares to play with only got 1 left at moment unless I rob the tat off the printer but they're just shit.

Nr1madman
02-11-2017, 11:04 AM
Yes that's a good point but the microswitches are cheap and hopefully will reduce the damage when 4mm later the gantry mount crashes into the BK12 fitting lol, I'll see what happens when I start running it I guess.

Should order a selection of button and lever microswitches so I have spares to play with only got 1 left at moment unless I rob the tat off the printer but they're just shit.I'm wrestling with the pros and cons of different mountings of limits myself. Don't want to loose to much precious travel and don't want to cheap out so a crash will destroy something :)

Because a crash or eleven will happen :D

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Desertboy
02-11-2017, 05:17 PM
Almost, almost there switches are wired to the BOB now, I've took power from the PSU case to a connector block then split it 4 ways to the AM882's.

Quick question my AM882's the power in is marked AC for both inputs which one is the + and which one the -?

23130

I'm using DC obviously.

I have my water cooling feeds in/out installed, just got to connect the motors and the spindle and plug her in ;)

e2a Just realised the alarm is wired wrong on mine, manual makes it confusing, will swap them over

Neale
02-11-2017, 05:30 PM
Quick question my AM882's the power in is marked AC for both inputs which one is the + and which one the -?

Doesn't matter in this case - because the power inputs can handle AC or DC, you can connect the DC either way round.

Clive S
02-11-2017, 06:06 PM
Quick question my AM882's the power in is marked AC for both inputs which one is the + and which one the -?

As Neale has said. But not all AM882 are the same I think you have bought them from different sources so check all of them. I think it is the AM882H that can handle AC or DC and the AM882 is only DC. As usual could be wrong.

Desertboy
02-11-2017, 08:05 PM
As Neale has said. But not all AM882 are the same I think you have bought them from different sources so check all of them. I think it is the AM882H that can handle AC or DC and the AM882 is only DC. As usual could be wrong.

You right the AM882 are DC only they discontinued them now in favour of EM806 which I should have bought. Oh well think it'll be ok anyways ;)

Next time going for a stepper motor, encoder, driver combo all round. Expensive but really the only logical choice.

Desertboy
03-11-2017, 07:01 AM
Morning, quick question.

My PSU is in an old PC case when I run power from mains to the PSU can I drill a hole in the pc case add a bolt and nut then use a round terminal to connect the earth from the mains to the pc case to create a ground?

Is this safe? I'm then going to bolt the PC case with the AM882's to the PSU's case so that's grounded and then I can connect the metal RF shielding from the CY cable to the am882's pc case and it's shielded.

does this all sound good?

Also how I understand it I do not ground the CY cable at both ends (In my case at the stepper driver end) is this correct?

Thanks

She's going to move today fingers crossed ;)

Desertboy
03-11-2017, 07:19 AM
No you have not. That is the beauty of a forum its generally self correcting I certainly need it.:thumsup: and I value your input.


That's true it's a great forum but if you're a know it all kind of guy you better be right lol otherwise you're going to find out about it very soon, the one thing about this hobby is it's always a learning curve no matter where you are on the curve.

Desertboy
03-11-2017, 04:37 PM
At least the PSU works ;)
23132

Nr1madman
03-11-2017, 05:06 PM
At least the PSU works ;)

Nice!
Must feel great :D


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Desertboy
03-11-2017, 05:12 PM
Nice!
Must feel great :D


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Relieved ;) I tested it without the capacitors but since I put it together properly I hadn't tested it will try to remember to test the output voltage tomorrow.

I have no resistor on the output of the PSU so the capacitors remain charged at moment what's the best way to discharge them or should I just shield them so you can't touch the easily instead?

I'm going to wire a 32amp socket to the wall and then from that to the junction box, from there to the PSU, VFD and to a double wall socket.

The PSU and spindle will be fed through a 13amp switch first so I can turn them on/off with a single flip.

For now though it's wired to a 13 amp plug, I don't think it's wise though to run the machine, PC and vacuum cleaner on a 13 amp socket.

Nr1madman
03-11-2017, 05:27 PM
I have no resistor on the output of the PSU so the capacitors remain charged at moment what's the best way to discharge them or should I just shield them so you can't touch the easily instead?

I'm going to wire a 32amp socket to the wall and then from that to the junction box, from there to the PSU, VFD and to a double wall socket.

The PSU and spindle will be fed through a 13amp switch first so I can turn them on/off with a single flip.

The best way to drain the caps is to short them with a screwdriver :D just kidding :D

I have no clue how British electrical distribution works. All this talk of 13 amp rings is just mumbo-jumbo to me.
I have 3 phases with 16 amps each for my shed. Will do control cabinet and maybe vfd on one. Dustextraction on one and air compressor on one so nothing bad happens when it all maxes out :)

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Desertboy
03-11-2017, 05:30 PM
This is at my work (Dad owns it), I have 3 phase but my dad wants me to fit a single phase socket otherwise I'd fit a 32amp 3 phase and tap 1 of the phases.

I have compressed air on tap 24/7 which is nice and one less thing for me to worry about.

I have wired from the AM882 to the BOB incorrectly

is this diagram correct?

23133

I have from dir- and dir+ wired to BOB at moment, I haven't powered the BOB on yet.

For anyone else wondering how to easily get 12v to their BOB

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/USB-5-to-5-9-12V-0-8-1A-5-5x2-1Power-Cable-Converter-Voltage-Booster-Transformer/112309736599?hash=item1a262e9497:m:mCpOIdYM7jN32Rj LOZ7GUXQ

I haven't got time to wait for an order so will go with tapping molex's from the PC to for 12v and to power the fans to cool toroidal transformers and stepper drivers.

Desertboy
05-11-2017, 02:57 PM
Having issues getting PC to talk to machine, first I tried linuxcnc but doesn't see my pci parallel port card, then I tried mach 3 doesn't work on 64 bits windows, the I dug out a spar pc didn't work so went to swap motherboard and discovered new one doesn't have parallel port.

Had enough for now came home to see if I can find my windows Vista cd sure that's 32 bit never thought I'd use that again lol.

Otherwise anyone got a pc with parallel port going to a good home near Leicester ;)

I tested the spindle for the first time today got to work out where to mount the VFD.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=osMfKfQvhGk

Desertboy
08-11-2017, 08:13 AM
A lot of frustrating hours later still no movement but we have discovered that my parallel port pci card only works in serial mode!

After much research I've bought a 2nd hand 2 port PCI parallel port card with a compatible chipset for both mach 3 and linuxcnc, 2 male to male cables and a 2nd BOB. (It's a Netmos)

After Xmas I'm going to get a usb BOB, are these any good?

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/EU-Stock-4-Axis-200Khz-NVUM-USB-CNC-Mach3-Motion-Control-Card-Controller-Board/263292872830?hash=item3d4d7a687e:g:mewAAOSwUchZ-tQN&clk_rvr_id=1358236551857&afsrc=1&rmvSB=true

Or should I plump for a better controller.

I'm going to strip everything out and rebuild it better in another case lol and add in CY cable 2 core for the microswitches.

Nr1madman
08-11-2017, 11:13 AM
A lot of frustrating hours later still no movement but we have discovered that my parallel port pci card only works in serial mode!

We shall see what I can sort today.I feel for you!!

This is why I didn't want to even try the PP-way.
I wanted to find a semi old pc with 32bit OS and PP and make it work on the cheap.
Rejected that idea and bought a motion controller from the start. Hope it was a smart move :D

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Clive S
08-11-2017, 12:58 PM
This is why I didn't want to even try the PP-way.

There are thousands of machines using the pp its just as hard to set up a motion controller the principles are the same

Nr1madman
08-11-2017, 01:12 PM
There are thousands of machines using the pp its just as hard to set up a motion controller the principles are the sameYes, I know.
But with modern pc and add on hardware it's becoming harder and harder.
Just buying a card won't always work.
I only look at this from the Microsoft perspective and that's a bit narrow but that's the only way I feel inclined to go.
And when thinking that way you realise that soon there will even be problems getting your hands on 32bit OS supporting PP...

Of course if you have an older pc/system that works and works standalone without Internet and such it's awsome and don't justify an upgrade. But what happens when something breaks?

I do belive that an motion controller is as/maybe more difficult to set up but much easier to get a electrical connection between pc and cnc hardware.

Since I haven't actually tried both options I could be extremely wrong :D

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Desertboy
08-11-2017, 04:08 PM
Problems my PSU stopped working (Possibly unrelated but one of my AM882 had a solid red light the other 3 flashing green, I wonder if this had something to do with it or if I have a bad AM882).

99% certain it can be traced to a short I caused at weekend when electrician set my ameter up wrong and I shorted across my PSU output never realised it'd done this damage.
23164 They were plugged into the left connectors I just cut the wiring put new terminals and tried it in the terminals next door to see if I had gotten lucky but I hadn;t.

There was a pop/bang and spark from roughly where the capacitors are.

I've ordered 3 new capacitors and a new rectifier (Sure this is fine but £1 so just did it) and replacement barrier terminals.

What's the best way to test the transformers to make sure it's ok? I was thinking unplug the capacitors and then test the voltage going into the rectifier in AC mode to see what I'm getting and then test the output of the rectifier in DC mode to see if that's working does this sound like a plan?

Do you think I might have damaged my AM882's (I really hope not can't afford to replace this side of xmas)? And if I have a bad AM882 will be fun trying to sort with the Chinese (Bought 2nd hand) and will have to put a temp cheap driver to get going whilst I source a replacement.

I can afford to replace one Am882 but not 4.

How do I discharge the capacitors before I unsolder them to replace them and also how do I test which one(s) blown?

I just realised I have a picture of my AM882 that was always red and it was green last week!

Since I have AM882h could I not ditch the rectifier and capacitors altogether and just connect the output of the transformer (50v) to the drivers?

AlexDoran
08-11-2017, 04:38 PM
Ah man bad luck! Not sure about a Solid Red LED...... This is from the manual:

12. Protection Functions

To improve reliability, the drive incorporates some built-in protection functions. The AM882 uses
one RED LED to indicate what protection has been activated. The periodic time of RED is 5 s
(seconds), and how many times the RED turns on indicates what protection has been activated.
Because only one protection can be displayed by RED LED, so the drive will decide what error to
display according to their priorities. See the following Protection Indications table for displaying
priorities.

Over-current Protection

Over-current protection will be activated when continuous current exceeds the limit or in case of
short circuit between motor coils or between motor coil and ground, and RED LED will turn on once
within each periodic time (5 s).

Over-voltage Protection

When power supply voltage exceeds 90±1 VDC, protection will be activated and RED LED will
turn on twice within each periodic time (5 s).

Phase Error Protection

Motor power lines wrong & not connected will activate this protection. RED LED will turn on four
times within each periodic time (5 s).

Sensorless Stall Protection

The AM882 can detect the motor stall status using if motor shaft speed is above 300RPM. When the
detection is active, RED LED will blink five times within each periodic time (5s).
Attention: When above protections are active, the motor shaft will be free or the LED will blink.

Hope you dont have to replace it

Nickhofen
08-11-2017, 04:39 PM
One easy way to discharge a capacitor is to cross the two cap legs with a screwdriver that has an insulated handle, prior to do that you must remove the plug from the wall. Another way is to connect a consumption at the capacitor leads, like a resistance or even a light bulb, prefer the light bulbs with the wire inside no the neon light or led.
If you want to measure a capacitor and you do not have a capacitance meter, but you have a voltmeter,first disconnect at least one of the cap legs,then put the multi meter at resistance measurement place the leads of the meter on the leads of the capacitor and see the resistance measurement at the meter screen rise until it shows infinity , this gives you an idea that the cap is ok if ohms start to rise and then stop at a low indication the capacitor is grounded. Other way is to place a 9volt battery at the cap leads and then measure the voltage with your voltmeter, if the voltage drops rapidly this shows a bad cap.For

Clive S
08-11-2017, 04:40 PM
The pic shows a block with the red wires connected but to my eyes the black wires are not connected as one of them appears to be in the wrong connector.

shorting the output of the PS with an amp meter would probably wreck the meter.

I doubt you have blown the caps or the rectifier. If you want to discharge them put a small value resister across the caps temporally like 220 ohms or a mains light bulb across them.

put your meter on the AC range and check the voltage on the input and output of the transformer.

Have you checked the fuse on the input?

Lets see a good pic of the PS

Desertboy
08-11-2017, 04:41 PM
Ah man bad luck! Not sure about a Solid Red LED...... This is from the manual:

12. Protection Functions

To improve reliability, the drive incorporates some built-in protection functions. The AM882 uses
one RED LED to indicate what protection has been activated. The periodic time of RED is 5 s
(seconds), and how many times the RED turns on indicates what protection has been activated.
Because only one protection can be displayed by RED LED, so the drive will decide what error to
display according to their priorities. See the following Protection Indications table for displaying
priorities.

Over-current Protection

Over-current protection will be activated when continuous current exceeds the limit or in case of
short circuit between motor coils or between motor coil and ground, and RED LED will turn on once
within each periodic time (5 s).

Over-voltage Protection

When power supply voltage exceeds 90±1 VDC, protection will be activated and RED LED will
turn on twice within each periodic time (5 s).

Phase Error Protection

Motor power lines wrong & not connected will activate this protection. RED LED will turn on four
times within each periodic time (5 s).

Sensorless Stall Protection

The AM882 can detect the motor stall status using if motor shaft speed is above 300RPM. When the
detection is active, RED LED will blink five times within each periodic time (5s).
Attention: When above protections are active, the motor shaft will be free or the LED will blink.

Hope you dont have to replace it

Yeah my flashing red lights were the nema phases wired wrong which was nice it told me, going to go back to test the drivers in a minute one by one, forgot I've got a 24v PSU which will power the AM882's up.

AlexDoran
08-11-2017, 04:43 PM
The pic shows a block with the red wires connected but to my eyes the black wires are not connected as one of them appears to be in the wrong connector.

shorting the output of the PS with an amp meter would probably wreck the meter.

I doubt you have blown the caps or the rectifier. If you want to discharge them put a small value resister across the caps temporally like 220 ohms or a mains light bulb across them.

put your meter on the AC range and check the voltage on the input and output of the transformer.

Have you checked the fuse on the input?

Lets see a good pic of the PS

I thought that too but i think its just an illusion lol

Clive S
08-11-2017, 04:47 PM
Yeah my flashing red lights were the nema phases wired wrong which was nice it told me, going to go back to test the drivers in a minute one by one, forgot I've got a 24v PSU which will power the AM882's up.

Why don't you just fault find your main PS after all you will need it.

Desertboy
08-11-2017, 05:24 PM
Right going back to check it out in a minute, will get some pics.

The probe on my meter was black and the spark was large it was only a £5 meter as well and still seems to work fine. I have the PSU wire to a junction box I tested the power at the junction box a steady 247 volts.

Desertboy
08-11-2017, 10:56 PM
Not good, I pulled the PSU out tested the capacitors they read 45v I discharged them with a light bulb setup. Then tested unplugged the capacitors from the recitifer and turned it back on and tested the output of the transformer diddly squat. There's 240v going in but nothing coming out.

I tripled checked the soldering whilst not neat there's no shorts and it's all on very tightly no possibility of loose connection.

Tomorrow I will test each coil individually but I have no hope.

My AM882's turned on with the 24v but one of them is still permanently red led so I think that will need replacing.

It's just a disaster!

I was looking forward to it moving tomorrow now at best I can get the PC to talk to the machine and move the gantry and the Z axis on 24v only, one at a time.

23165

Not sure why it went bang which puts me off buying another one and if it had anything to do with malfunctioning AM882.

The only way I'm going to get this cutting before January is if I buy a cheap stepper driver to replace the AM882 for now no way I can afford both the AM882 and transformer before Xmas.

Can't see there being much warranty on the transformer and looking at the listing for the AM882 I might as well forget it.

I did have the wires going to the output on terminals but cut them off just make sure was good connection hence the bare wires going in now.

Clive S
08-11-2017, 11:31 PM
Not good, I pulled the PSU out tested the capacitors they read 45v I discharged them with a light bulb setup. Then tested unplugged the capacitors from the recitifer and turned it back on and tested the output of the transformer diddly squat. There's 240v going in but nothing coming out.

Well that shows the caps are OK.
Now check to see if you have continuity between each winding pair on the transformer after you have disconnected it fro the rectifier
I doubt the AM882 has blown the transformer. Did you have it working at one time or is this the first time you powered it up

Desertboy
09-11-2017, 11:10 AM
Hi, right I have continuity on only 3 of the 4 coils one of the primaries has no continuity I assume this means thhe thermal fuse blew and I'm pretty screwed. Going to get another multimeter to test it with to be sure but not looking good.

Nickhofen
09-11-2017, 12:06 PM
Can you take a resistance measurement at the coil that you do not have continuity? If you put your multimeter at continuity scale you get a bazing sound of a reading only if resistance is low,I think up to 10 ohm but I am not sure if it is a little higher or change between the brands of the meters,if resistance is higher you have to take a measurement with the ohmmeter.

Desertboy
09-11-2017, 01:34 PM
Can you take a resistance measurement at the coil that you do not have continuity? If you put your multimeter at continuity scale you get a bazing sound of a reading only if resistance is low,I think up to 10 ohm but I am not sure if it is a little higher or change between the brands of the meters,if resistance is higher you have to take a measurement with the ohmmeter.

I've ordered another transformer, will check the existing transformer though

https://www.maplin.co.uk/p/2x50v-1000va-toroidal-transformer-a74qj

It's 50v per output core

I hope there's no issue going oversized with a 1000va transformer but I didn't realise they had 625va one and this was 1/2 price same make as rapid.

Saved enough cash on the transformer that I just managed to buy a new AM882 as well with fast shipping.

Normal version not am882h.

One good bit of news the new parallel port card came I fitted it and parport recognises it so linuxcnc should at least work and I bet mach 3 does to.


23166

I got it wrong before there's no continuity between blue and grey OR violet and brown but there is continuity between grey and violet I guess this means both thermal fuses are blown.

One question about the new transformer I know I wire on the input side the brown and blue to the mains, the grey and violet together as before. On the output I wire the orange to the black and the yellow to the red then wire them to the the rectifier is that correct?

Would wiring a 5amp plug fuse to the PSU input give some protection to without tripping out in normal usage?

Nr1madman
09-11-2017, 05:06 PM
Omg that's some low price transformers :D
Good find and I'm happy that you are back on track!

Wish they delivered to Sweden ;)

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Nr1madman
09-11-2017, 05:08 PM
For the fuse question.. think it might blow when charging the caps..

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Neale
09-11-2017, 05:55 PM
Would wiring a 5amp plug fuse to the PSU input give some protection to without tripping out in normal usage?

I suspect that 5A might be a bit small and might blow on switch-on, although you will probably get away with it. Typically, a standard fuse will blow within 10sec with a 2x overload, so that might be OK. For normal running, you are unlikely to be drawing anything like 1000VA (which is a touch over 4A in practice) most of the time, if ever, so that's well within the fuse rating. I use a 10A MCB on my own machine feeding all the PSUs (although the stepper driver PSU is the most power-hungry) and I haven't had it trip yet.

Unfortunately, the fuse is very unlikely to protect the equipment and that's not really why it's there. In practice, the fuse blows just after the equipment fails! It's really there so that in the event of a serious fault that draws excess current, the wiring isn't going to burst into flames. In the case of elecronic components, it's well-known that the transistor is the fastest fuse on three legs...

Desertboy
09-11-2017, 08:39 PM
Right I'll get 1 of these mcb's tomorrow to wire the PSU through
https://www.toolstation.com/shop/p26107

and 2 10 amp ones, one for the spindle and one for the twin 3 pin wall sockets.

I am going to wire 32amp to the junction box soon so might as well plan for the future.

Clive S
09-11-2017, 10:15 PM
Right I'll get 1 of these mcb's tomorrow to wire the PSU through
https://www.toolstation.com/shop/p26107

and 2 10 amp ones, one for the spindle and one for the twin 3 pin wall sockets.

I am going to wire 32amp to the junction box soon so might as well plan for the future.

I think you might want a D rated one with that big transformer:beer:

Neale
09-11-2017, 11:12 PM
I think I use a C type MCB - more surge-resistant than a B (the usual domestic type) but trips a little more easily than a D. But that's with a 650VA transformer. However, without analysing in too much detail, I doubt that the transformer difference is that significant and it's the size of the capacitors that matters more. I would tend to go with C type, I think.

Davek0974
10-11-2017, 09:27 AM
Just an observation - are you running the primaries in series (240v) or parallel (115v) ??

If series the you need to connect supply to blue and brown with grey/violet joined.

If parallel then connect blue/violet and grey/brown then connect supply to to those pairs.

Just an observation as said but easy to ignore those little dots on the transformer winding pictures ;)

Desertboy
10-11-2017, 10:32 AM
Just an observation - are you running the primaries in series (240v) or parallel (115v) ??

If series the you need to connect supply to blue and brown with grey/violet joined.

If parallel then connect blue/violet and grey/brown then connect supply to to those pairs.

Just an observation as said but easy to ignore those little dots on the transformer winding pictures ;)

I had it wired blue and brown to mains 240v, grey and violet joined on the input side. On the output side orange and red to the rectifier, yellow and black joined. This was a dual 25v output core.

This time with the 1kva transformer I'm going to wire the input the same (it's a dual core 115v input). The output I will join the orange and black and then wire to rectifier, join the yellow and red and to rectifier. (Dual core 50v output, I want 50v out to feed into the rectifier so I get my 68-70v out for my drivers.)
23183

Desertboy
10-11-2017, 11:17 AM
If I add a precharge circuit to this, could I use a type B mcb I guess the capacitors have a large inrush which might trigger the type b mcb but when charged you would have better protection with a type b than a type c? I have some adjustable time delay relays (0-30mins) 10amp I could use so the precharge circuit always comes on say 1 minute before the PSU powers on.

If so how the hell do I make one I read something about precharge resistors but have no idea where to start.

Desertboy
10-11-2017, 05:05 PM
Came today but missing the top metal plate! I think the one on my old transformer will work fine but still poor maplins I do have both rubber protectors.

I was hoping it would straight swap but not so sure it will I might just get away with it and a hammer ;)

23184

Not going to wire it up until I have an MCB, replacing the rectifier as well, going to leave the caps in place.

Think I traced the problem to a poor crimp causing the initial problems and we think my friend reconnected the bridge rectifier backwards on the output but no one can be sure.

m_c
10-11-2017, 09:01 PM
There's a reason transformer manufacturer's usually recommend slow blow/time delay fuses, and this thread has just proven why.

Fit a 10A MCB to a 1KVA transformer, and there is a high probability the transformer winding will fail before the MCB trips.
1KVA roughly equals 4 amps, so taking a type B MCB, it takes a minimum of 6 seconds at double the rated current for it to trip. So taking that 10A MCB, that's 20A, 5 times the transformer rated current, or over 4KW flowing for 6 seconds. Do you still think that MCB will do much good?

I personally just use a time delay fuse rated around 120% of the transformer rating. If you blow it, you're doing something majorly wrong, and it's far cheaper than a MCB.

As for cheap multimeters, they rarely have a fuse for the amp setting, which is likely what will of caused the problems. A sudden short on the power supply, as well as causing the transformer to fail, will of likely burnt something out in the power side of the AM882. If you were to strip it down, you could at least check the main power supplies are still functioning.

Also, if you strip the outer covering of the transformer, you might find the fuses near the outside of the windings, so it could potentially be a relatively easy repair.

Desertboy
11-11-2017, 06:44 AM
I am going to have a look at fixing the transformer, there's a good vid on you tube it doesn't look that hard if the fuse is near outside but at £41 for a 1kva I couldn't resist. Maplins still have a new 625va transformer (50v) for £30 which I'm seriously tempted (Have enough bits to make a 2nd PSU) and also try and fix the original one or they have an 800va (45v) for £35. I have 7 caps now and 2 new rectifiers so it's cheap PSU for betty bigger sister Already planning ;)

Would these be suitable slow blow fuses?
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/5-CERAMIC-SLOW-BLOW-FUSES-5A-5AMP-T5AH-20-x-5mm-250V/121721155041?hash=item1c57256de1:m:mte0CVXYmA3euIm kU3PFBZg

These look plug compatible in which case I'll put the PSU on a plug for ease.

When I first got the Am882 it had a dodgy connection I changed the plug and it was fine but I do wonder if the connection is dodgy on the board open it up couldn't see anything from the top need to take it out properly and look underneath

I am going to complain to Chinese I bought it off as they "offered" 1 year warranty but also got it on my CC so will see if I can get a refund through them.

At the moment this is going to a normal plug socket which is connected to an MCB in the board (16amp) on a side note my shitty 24v psu tripped it so I chucked the PSU in the bin was £7 ebay special. But it didn't trip whenthe psu blew in fact it didn't even blow the 13amp fuse in the plug and my pc stayed on connected to same power in.

Davek0974
11-11-2017, 11:53 AM
I would not bother with pre-charge, this supply is not big enough to need it, as long as the rectifier is big enough to take the inrush as well as a slow-blow fuse in the input it should work fine.

Pre-charge is easy with a resistor in the output before the rectifier, maybe 10r 25W and a timer relay which shorts out the resistor after maybe 2s would do it but i wouldn't bother myself. Pre-charge is more used with supplies that have very large capacitors/higher voltages.

Desertboy
11-11-2017, 01:03 PM
I would not bother with pre-charge, this supply is not big enough to need it, as long as the rectifier is big enough to take the inrush as well as a slow-blow fuse in the input it should work fine.

Pre-charge is easy with a resistor in the output before the rectifier, maybe 10r 25W and a timer relay which shorts out the resistor after maybe 2s would do it but i wouldn't bother myself. Pre-charge is more used with supplies that have very large capacitors/higher voltages.

Desertboy
11-11-2017, 06:11 PM
Right wired up properly and tested 78.2v out so a little high what's the best way to reduce this voltage my AM882's 80v is max input.
23190

I daren't plug it in to the AM882's.

Got it wired to a 13 amp switch finally so I can turn it on/off without killing power to pc.
23189

Got a free enclosure some damage to the front but better than what I have, will transfer the AM88's and BOB's across PSU will stay in PC case.

23191
23192

Davek0974
11-11-2017, 07:02 PM
Right wired up properly and tested 78.2v out so a little high what's the best way to reduce this voltage my AM882's 80v is max input.



If it were my supply i might unwind a couple of turns off the transformer secondary, but thats just me ;)

Not too many ways to fine tune the voltage really.

Maybe also look at an autotransformer in the primary circuit - a multi-tapped primary only transformer with the input going to the normal 240v tap and then take an output from the neutral and a tapping a little lower like 220v.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Autotransformer

Just an idea though. ;)

Desertboy
11-11-2017, 07:11 PM
Or just run it at 78v's and hope ;) I turned it on off a few times and tested the voltage each time, and I noticed my input was 250v at the time it seems to vary at work from 238 to 250v this is the highest reading I've had so far and I think the max allowable is like 252v.

I need to check what the ac voltage going into the rectifier is didn't think that but was gutted as I was expecting to get something like Joe Harris 68v giving he has 25v output coils in series and I have 50v in parallel.

I wonder why I'm getting such a high reading is it because I have a high input voltage? This is mains fed, to an industrial unit, is it possible other things could affect voltage on the line? I'm going to have a dedicated line put in for the machine I seem to remember getting 240v when I was working on the 3 phase sockets (I tapped 1 phase for my plasma cutter)

Could I be getting a high reading because it's Saturday and the demand is lower on the estate?

Davek0974
11-11-2017, 07:59 PM
Or just run it at 78v's and hope ;)

I wonder why I'm getting such a high reading is it because I have a high input voltage?



Yes, output is directly related to input, that is a very high input.

Desertboy
11-11-2017, 08:02 PM
Yes, output is directly related to input, that is a very high input.

Will have to check Monday morning see what it reads.

Nr1madman
11-11-2017, 08:11 PM
I think the voltage will drop when you connect a load on the secondary side. Now you only have the caps connected right?

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m_c
11-11-2017, 10:30 PM
Assuming input voltage is at rated 230V, your output voltage open circuit is going to be at 52VAC (rated output voltage plus the regulation rating of 4%).
Multiply that by root 2, gives 73.5V peak voltage.

Now if your input voltage is at 250, which puts it around 8% above the rated voltage, so your output voltage will be proportionally higher, at 79.4V peak.

Now all you need is a sudden deceleration on a couple axes, and the energy dump back into the DC side can potentially push everything overvoltage.

If you search for my Triac retrofit thread, there's a big post there explaining all this.

Davek0974
12-11-2017, 08:14 AM
Now all you need is a sudden deceleration on a couple axes, and the energy dump back into the DC side can potentially push everything overvoltage.



Thats the important bit, i would get this voltage down before connecting drives.

Desertboy
12-11-2017, 08:02 PM
Have ordered a 45v 1kva which will solve the problem whilst I'm waiting I took the time to start stripping out the box and recovered some nicer wiring conduits. Also fitted a proper stop switch to it.

Friend is going to fibreglass repair the damage for me I might even paint it ;)

23193
23194
23195

There's loads of space in here should I put the transformer in here as well and fit a 4 120mm pc fans two blowing in across the am882's and two sucking out the side of the transformer and leave a nice gap so the air can flow, I want to make sure the caps get good air flow over them.

It would be good to fit the transformer at the top of the box but it weighs 8kg making the box top heavy so it'll go at the bottom if i do fit I think the key will be good air flow and lots of it. I have a better on/off switch which is rated to 2hp (I think might be 3) ac3 so I think should be ok for the PSU.

Clive S
12-11-2017, 08:08 PM
Have ordered a 45v 1kva which will solve the problem whilst I'm waiting I took the time to start stripping out the box and recovered some nicer wiring conduits. Also fitted a proper stop switch to it.

Friend is going to fibreglass repair the damage for me I might even paint it ;)

23193
23194
23195

If you can cancel the order and reorder a 625Va as it should suite you better 45V is a good choice

Davek0974
12-11-2017, 08:32 PM
None of my CNC modules get hot, i would think one fan would be ok, filtered inlet then fan with a vent at other side of cabinet.

Caps will/should not get hot or even warm.

Clive S
12-11-2017, 09:00 PM
None of my CNC modules get hot, i would think one fan would be ok, filtered inlet then fan with a vent at other side of cabinet.

Caps will/should not get hot or even warm.

They won't get warm until you put a load on them. I have two control boxes the router with 4 drives does not have any fans in the box is 500x500x250 and is fine.

Neale
12-11-2017, 09:27 PM
It's easy to worry about overheating but in practice, it's not a big problem on our size machines. On mine, I have two 12V fans just so that they cover a larger area and push a bit of breeze across the stepper drivers but I have wired them in series so that they run fairly slowly. Moves more than enough air. Similarly, I run the 12V spindle cooling pump on 5V and that works fine as well.

I also bought a 50V transformer for my machine (from Rapid Online), then realised that it was going to be a bit too high. Once you take into account the fact that input voltage can be some way above nominal, and the output voltage is a few per cent high to allow for voltage drop at full load, then it's easy to start nudging that 80V. In my case, I rang Rapid the day after the transformer arrived and they were happy to swap it for 45V, and even arranged a courier to pick up the old one. Good people to deal with. I'm now running at a nominal 68V which is bang on the money.

Desertboy
12-11-2017, 10:45 PM
I'm going to fit a inrush current limiter ntc thermistor
https://www.ametherm.com/blog/inrush-current/toroidal-transformer-inrush-current-issues-got-you-down

I think this is suitable
https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/282728849186

as far as I can tell I just wire this inline to the mains, anyone had any experience of them?

m_c
12-11-2017, 11:07 PM
I wouldn't bother, unless the power on surge is a problem, as it's just something else to give potential problems.

Desertboy
16-11-2017, 03:40 PM
Looks like I'm going to have wait at least another day the AM882 will come from China quicker lol

23211
Been on phone will either be redelivered tomorrow (If it's ok which it will be of course, things are like house bricks) or new one sent out for Monday

Desertboy
18-11-2017, 03:05 PM
My Hermes claimed they tried to deliver it today although I was there with the roller shutter door open so they are lying bastards, have to wait till Monday, would have been quicker to order from China lol.

Using the 50v transformer as a pattern (the 45v will be identical) so started to think about kitting out the box, anyone see any issues having the transformer under the stepper driver? I am going to fit 2 pc fans one sucking in and 1 extracting.

23218

Going to use new capacitors as I have them and am going to need to fit everything a bit tighter.

You can just see the breakout board in the corner on a bit of ply will fit it roughly there and chop a hole with a cutting disc for the parallel port and USB to stick through.

Not sure I will fit the other BOB as I really don't need extra the input pins, good to have a spare though.

What's everyone set there AM882's microstepping up at?

Desertboy
20-11-2017, 10:15 PM
Transformer came finally! didn't get round to soldering it but will have it up and running tomorrow ;)

23225
Damn just realised I wired this up wrong lol but turned it on yet. The orange and black should be joined as well as the red &yellow.

Was tired this evening only just come home from work glad i decided to leave it till morning.

Desertboy
22-11-2017, 04:35 PM
Almost there, got some connectors on a din rail for sorting out the wiring to the BOB, still need to solder the capacitors but will get that done tonight. Looking for my holesaw set at moment so I can make the fan holes in the enclosure.

23226

The non working AM882 isn't bolted down just there for reference.

I have got a current inrush thermistor which hopefully is the right one if it cause problems I'll ditch it but it was £2 so I thought worth a punt. Hopefully with one fitted I can then use a type B mcb which I can just fit in the box ;)

I now feel it's starting to look like cnc electronics ;)

Desertboy
23-11-2017, 03:56 PM
Got the capacitors soldered on a 2nd time, ready to test output voltage, need to get my mate tonight and borrow his hole saw so I can fit the fans and he's helping mount the box and the wires can be connected ;)

23227

Now I need the new AM882 was quoted 10 working days delivery tomorrow is the 10th day :(

Ordered
one of these
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/230689466731

So I can fit it inside the box and take the mains in from the same feed as the transformer. Then I can wire first to a junction then on to the pc fans and BOB. This way if the toroidal transformer is one then the fans are running and less leads coming into the box.

I hope 1amp is enough, PC fan's are ~0.2amp I guess it doesn't need much to generate the control signal for the vfd.

Desertboy
23-11-2017, 08:51 PM
Can I wire the stall detection output from 1 AM882 to the next then the last AM882 in the chain to the BOB?

Neale
23-11-2017, 09:15 PM
Short answer - no!

Longer answer - the AM882 use an open-collector output. Think of it as being a normally-open switch that closes when there is a fault (like a stall). What you can do is wire them all in parallel and then to the BOB input. I do this with the EM806 on my machine and it works fine.

Desertboy
24-11-2017, 05:38 PM
23229

A little bit closer, ready to mount the box and start running the motor's and home switches. Need to mount the VFD as well so I can run the wiring 12v adapter won't be here till Monday.

Need holesaw for the fans mate has my cheapo set so going to see him tonight little bastard keeps forgetting it.

Desertboy
24-11-2017, 07:18 PM
Does this look correct it's the pulse and dir +'s connected to BOB pc 5v

23237
23238
23239

Nr1madman
24-11-2017, 07:23 PM
I keep forgetting.. did you plan on using separate 5v psu or power it from usb?

If using psu then it looks tight to get that connected there as well...

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Desertboy
24-11-2017, 08:03 PM
I keep forgetting.. did you plan on using separate 5v psu or power it from usb?

If using psu then it looks tight to get that connected there as well...

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The BOB is powered by usb, need to get 12v PSU in there yet ;) If I'm reading the BOB properly it can only be powered by USB unless you solder your own connections. If you have the same BOB get your male to male usb cable now ;) although you can hack something together at a push I originally powered it up with a hacked 4 pin molex (Hard disk power cable) to USB.

I hope the AM882 is a straight swap for the AM882h as I used the broken one as pattern for setting up whilst I'm waiting for the new one.

Nr1madman
24-11-2017, 08:07 PM
The BOB is powered by usb, need to get 12v PSU in there yet ;) If I'm reading the BOB properly it can only be powered by USB unless you solder your own connections. If you have the same BOB get your male to male usb cable now ;) although you can hack something together at a push I originally powered it up with a hacked 4 pin molex (Hard disk power cable) to USB.

I hope the AM882 is a straight swap for the AM882h as I used the broken one as pattern for setting up whilst I'm waiting for the new one.

Omg what have I missed now!!
I thought you could supply it with 5v on the connections you connected to the drivers... have you tried that? :D

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Clive S
24-11-2017, 08:12 PM
Omg what have I missed now!!
I thought you could supply it with 5v on the connections you connected to the drivers... have you tried that? :D

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You need 5v + 12-24v for this bob the 5v can be supplied by the usb or by the bottom right hand terminals marked 5v PC

Nr1madman
24-11-2017, 08:14 PM
You need 5v + 12-24v for this bob the 5v can be supplied by the usb or by the bottom right hand terminals marked 5v PCYeah that's what I thought but Mr desert seems to say something else? :)

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Desertboy
24-11-2017, 08:15 PM
You need 5v + 12-24v for this bob the 5v can be supplied by the usb or by the bottom right hand terminals marked 5v PC

I have them connected to the dir/pulse +'s for the AM882's is this correct? 5v coming in from usb.

23244

All I need to do is supply the AM882's 5v+ to both these pins? It wouldn't matter where it came from.

Nr1madman
24-11-2017, 08:18 PM
I have them connected to the dir/pulse +'s for the AM882's is this correct? 5v coming in from usb.

23244Looks exemplary ;)

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m_c
24-11-2017, 09:40 PM
Short answer - no!

Longer answer - the AM882 use an open-collector output. Think of it as being a normally-open switch that closes when there is a fault (like a stall). What you can do is wire them all in parallel and then to the BOB input. I do this with the EM806 on my machine and it works fine.

I'm not sure about the AM882s, but with the software you can configure the EM806 so the fault output is active when ok (i.e. switched on), and goes inactive on fault (i.e. open circuit). That's how I configured my EM drives, which would allow you to loop through all the fault outputs and create a failsafe circuit.

Clive S
24-11-2017, 11:13 PM
Yeah that's what I thought but Mr desert seems to say something else? :)

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Yes but Mr Desert has not got it working yet:devilish:

Neale
24-11-2017, 11:24 PM
I'm not sure about the AM882s, but with the software you can configure the EM806 so the fault output is active when ok (i.e. switched on), and goes inactive on fault (i.e. open circuit). That's how I configured my EM drives, which would allow you to loop through all the fault outputs and create a failsafe circuit.

You are probably right about the AM882 also being software-configurable, but it looks as if getting a cable to be able to reprogramme the 882 and making all the configuration software work is another can of worms (judging by the experience of other people). I know it shouldn't be, but I didn't need to use the fine-tune facilities available through software and could manage with just the DIP switch options, so I chose not to change the factory setting for the alarm. That way I avoided any need to play with the configuration software. My thinking in this case was that normally you would be a bit more paranoid about NC connections, but here all the connections are hard-wired inside the box and so rather more reliable than anything going via plugs and sockets and around the machine itself.

Your recommendation is the better one; I chose to use a very slightly inferior option, and one that would be easier for the OP to use. Connecting in the fault outputs at all is a big leap forwards!

Clive S
25-11-2017, 09:39 AM
For the avoidance of doubt I use AM882's on the router, they are programmable with the RJ11 socket on the end.

You can make a lead up from an old phone then chop the end off and fit a D9 plug on using just 3 wires. Then use a USB to D9 adaptor to connect the RJ11 lead to the PC.23247

phill05
25-11-2017, 11:09 AM
Short answer - no!

I do this with the EM806 on my machine and it works fine.

Sorry to jump in on this thread Neale would the wires from the EM806's go to the E stop on the BOB?

Desertboy
25-11-2017, 12:55 PM
Sorry to jump in on this thread Neale would the wires from the EM806's go to the E stop on the BOB?

That's how I have it setup the black cables are the stall protection
23253

Powered on today ;) can't test it because I took the Z axis plate off and it's still with engineering firm although ready to collect Monday.

Nr1madman
25-11-2017, 12:59 PM
Its getting close now :D

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Nickhofen
25-11-2017, 06:51 PM
Carry on,you are close now!

Neale
25-11-2017, 07:16 PM
Sorry to jump in on this thread Neale would the wires from the EM806's go to the E stop on the BOB?

May sound daft but actually, I don't know! I use a CSMIO-IP/M, partly because it includes BOB-style functionality (i.e. it provides plenty of input and output connections, and doesn't need a separate BOB). One of these inputs can be defined as something like "servo fault", and the hardware is set up to stop all motion immediately if this signal occurs. That means that Mach3 doesn't get involved directly, so I haven't had to define an input in Mach3 for it. I'm sure that someone out there knows the answer as this is a very common setup, it's just not the particular one I use. This is also why it was very easy for me to use the factory-default "NO" rather than "NC" on the drivers.

If you reconfigure the 882/806 using the software configuration tool so that the fault outputs are now "NC", then you should be able to wire them in series with the e-stop switches and take them to the e-stop input on your BOB. However, I haven't tried this myself, although it's what I would investigate doing if I were in your position.

m_c
25-11-2017, 07:48 PM
Sorry to jump in on this thread Neale would the wires from the EM806's go to the E stop on the BOB?

It depends on your controller.
If you configure them NC, and your e-stop kills power to the drives, then you need someway to override the fault outputs in order to activate the e-stop relay, so the drives can power up, and activate the fault outputs to complete the e-stop loop, at which point the override can be disabled. If you run them NO, then to have them as part of the e-stop loop, you'd need to use the outputs to control a NC relay, so when the output activates, it powers the relay and breaks the E-stop circuit.

I'm aware the CS units have some kind of fault input, which although not part of the e-stop circuit, will disable things in the event of a fault being triggered, and is capable of ignoring the fault signal during reset, so things can be reset/powered up without having to override the fault signal.

Me personally, as I'm using a KFlop, I just have the fault outputs going to standard inputs. I've programmed the KFlop to continually monitor those inputs, and in the event of a fault, the KFlop disables everything, halts the software, and displays a message to tell me why everything has just ground to a halt.

I know some people just rely on Mach to handle faults, however I personally would never rely on Mach to handle critical faults.

Desertboy
26-11-2017, 06:08 AM
I was going to to wire the stall protection to the estop on the BOB. Then I'll wire the physical estops to a contactor and the PSU and spindle to the contactor.

Originally was going to use a latched relay but I think a contactor will do as all my estops will be the twist to release type.

Not got my Stop's yet they're still on a conveyor belt but after xmas it's being scrapped and I'm having all 4 stops off the machine ;)

They have NO and NC contacts on all of them.

Desertboy
26-11-2017, 06:54 AM
I need to work hardwoods with the machine, Predominately Oak, Walnut and Mahogany. I'm hoping it's strong enough.

I am planning to swap the gantry over to shortest span (Unless I have 0 issues with flex in which case I will keep it this way as it makes loading the router easier.). Originally I was going to have SBR25 on the bottom which is why I made the gantry the longest span with the hiwin's but since that has changed to Hiwin's all round I need to buy another ballscrew 1400mmm to swap it over.

I thought though it'd be best to use it for a bit to decide if when I do buy a new ballscrew if I should just change all 3 ballscrews to 1610's instead and upgrade the 2nm nema's to 3nm ones at the same time.

I've also been toying with when I swap the gantry over buying another set of 1500mm 15mm clone hiwins and having 2 rails per side on the bottom axis. Then making new plates all round and increasing the Z travel to 35cm! This would mean some serious rebuilding which I wonder if it's worth it at some point in makes more sense to build a new steel framed router then upgrade the old aluminium one.

Nr1madman
26-11-2017, 06:58 AM
Hahaha :D

Just try your first one before building a new.
Find the "weak" spots and plan a solution or upgrade..
Might be that you are satisfied with the one you got? ;)

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Desertboy
26-11-2017, 07:32 AM
That's the plan, but I have a project that needs the extra Z travel I should have 12cm now but to get any more I need to rebuild it as the gantry height is the limiting factor. I'm going to use my machine for this project if I find the Z travel to be a limiting factor then I will have to sort it. I have a few ideas how to carve it up so I can get away with 10cm travel but until I start carving I won't really know what I need lol.

The next month or 2 is learning how to cut with it and then tests cuts, I have no illusions the more complicated stuff I want to do is going to take me months to work out how to make lol. The woods are very expensive to work on so lots of test cuts and scale models first ;)

What I have no idea is what bits to use to mill the woods, was planning to use 2 flute router cutters for the roughing and ballnose end mills to smooth off.

What I really need is a 5th axis and 40cm of Z but that's not happening but I can dream ;)

Nr1madman
26-11-2017, 07:36 AM
Wow :D

My mind is more limited.
I can't for the life of me come up with a project that requires a 5th axis :)

Well.. if I were to start building engines and stuff maybe..

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Desertboy
26-11-2017, 07:52 AM
Wow :D

My mind is more limited.
I can't for the life of me come up with a project that requires a 5th axis :)

Well.. if I were to start building engines and stuff maybe..

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What sort of things do you want to make with your router?

Nr1madman
26-11-2017, 07:57 AM
What sort of things do you want to make with your router?I foresee alot of signs in the beginning. Wood and lit up acrylic ones.
As I learn feeds and speeds for my machine I plan on doing boxes, cabinettes, giftpackages and such.
I'm just doing a hobbymachine, should I come up with a sellable product it would be awesome :)


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Desertboy
26-11-2017, 05:02 PM
23258 that's with input voltage 252v today so happy with that ;)

Added 2 shelf brackets and setup the monitor, keyboard and mouse in a comfortable standing up position.23259

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O4_u5ov-9cc

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eFB8hWiRiVI

Need to set the jumpers yet on the drivers so the Z axis motor was running hot lol need to setup them up tomorrow and going to try setting the bottom axis up need to work out how to set linuxcnc up for 2 motors for the 1 axis.

Then homing of course, come on AM882 I'm ready for you now and machine is itching to get cutting'

Desertboy
27-11-2017, 11:53 AM
Back's killing me today so not a lot is going to happen but did pick the spindle mount and Z axis plate up ready to refit I now should have the full 13cm Z travel I originally planned.

23265

Desertboy
28-11-2017, 04:33 PM
Trying to work out how to setup the bottom axis something to do with joints in the .hal file I think or .ini

my 12v PSU came fits perfectly in the bottom right corner (White box) and fitted another barrier terminal for power in, have the current limited thermistor as well will get that hooked this evening.

23271

Where's my AM882 Mr Postman starting to wish I'd ordered EM806 instead but thought I might as well stick with AM882's all round and was 1/2 the price for what appears to be identical driver.

Desertboy
29-11-2017, 05:01 PM
The current limiter thermistor came so hooked it up and turned on the PSU came one OK although need to test it with load of course.

Now need to wire it through the mcb type b then through the resistor and to the transformer and see if it works ok, now we get to see if I got the right one lol was quite confusing which one to get.

23281

Can't do a lot more until the last AM882 comes although getting it to move the dual ballscrew axis would be good, have got the fan holes drilled now.

Desertboy
30-11-2017, 01:11 PM
Got the MCB hooked up and the current limit thermistor and it all works perfectly ;)

MCB 6amp type b, trips without the thermistor doesn't trip with it. PSU appears to be running fine have to wait for the AM882 to come so I can test it under load but should be fine. The resistor is rated to 5amp once it's up to temp.

Is there any point adding a slow fuse as well now I have working MCB type b protection?

The 12v PSU doesn't go through the MCB only the toroidal transformer.

23286

This is the correct current limited thermistor for a 1kva toroidal transformer

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/2x-NTC-10D-15-Inrush-Current-Limiter-Power-Thermistor-10-ohm-5Amp-ref-341/282728849186?ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT&_trksid=p2057872.m2749.l2649

If anyone else is interested.

I notice when you turn the transformer off the AM882 stay lit for about 5 seconds and when you test the capacitors when you've turned it off they're ready 7v's so it's good to know the capacitors are mostly discharged by the AM882's at switch off although I might still add a resistor.

Nr1madman
30-11-2017, 06:18 PM
Nice work with the thermistor!

Just have one question.. do you still know where all those cables go :D
Lots of connections in a very small space ;)

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Desertboy
30-11-2017, 06:34 PM
Nice work with the thermistor!

Just have one question.. do you still know where all those cables go :D
Lots of connections in a very small space ;)

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The Nema's are wired in at moment which makes it a little more crazy, they need to be unwired and will go through the top of the box just above each driver through glands. The limit switches will travel through the wiring conduit which ends where they need to be, the 12v feed will travel through there before going to the BOB. The fan feeds I will run directly on the inside of the box.

It's confusing but it's a million times better than it was lol, can't finish the box until the last driver comes as I need access to the back of the plate to bolt it in. 21st day since I ordered it grrr, it was sent Epacket which is 10 days tops normally bloody Xmas, bahh humbug.

Nr1madman
30-11-2017, 06:38 PM
The Nema's are wired in at moment which makes it a little more crazy, they need to be unwired and will go through the top of the box just above each driver through glands. The limit switches will travel through the wiring conduit which ends where they need to be, the 12v feed will travel through there before going to the BOB. The fan feeds I will run directly on the inside of the box.

It's confusing but it's a million times better than it was lol, can't finish the box until the last driver comes as I need access to the back of the plate to bolt it in. 21st day since I ordered it grrr, it was sent Epacket which is 10 days tops normally bloody Xmas, bahh humbug.Just wait till I start wiring :D
Will need to mark everything to know what goes where!

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Desertboy
30-11-2017, 06:54 PM
Just wait till I start wiring :D
Will need to mark everything to know what goes where!

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It's not as bad as you think because by the time you have it wired you'll know every pin on that board better than you know the back of your hand lol.

The biggest pain is getting all the limit switches, Estop & 4 stall protection gnd's into the 1 socket that 1 wire barely fits it lol you also have to get 5 inputs into the Estop if you have stall protection. You also need to run 8 wires to your 5v on the BOB.

I have no idea what they are called but they are a godsend, look just under the BOB and on a bit of DIN rail I have those connectors. I found them in a scrap control box we have in the yard, the cable conduit was recovered as well with the din rail.

I see others on here using them maybe they can link you to what they're called they make the job a lot lot easier.

Nr1madman
30-11-2017, 06:58 PM
I thought about that problem to!
Going to use wago connectors. Love them! At least the wago 222, not al that fond of the 221. Don't think the spring is as good!

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Desertboy
30-11-2017, 07:12 PM
https://www.ametherm.com/inrush-current/transformer-inrush-current.html

This is where I found the info on the thermistor, I then checked the spec out on the part number for a 1kva transformer and sourced an equiv EU solution as it was £15 surcharge for ordering US stock from Farnell then there delivery charge for a sub £1 thermistor lol I bought 2 for £2 delivered.

Mine has a continuous current ratings of 5amp, I wonder what would happen if it tried to draw more than 5amp I assume it would fail due to overheating.

Neale
30-11-2017, 09:34 PM
Is there any point adding a slow fuse as well now I have working MCB type b protection?

I don't think so. The MCB should trip after a sustained overload, i.e. at something like twice the rated current, they should both trip within a minute (roughly). The B curve/C curve thing is about how much of a short-duration overload they can take to cope with switch-on surge and so on. That's not so different from a slow-blow fuse, so the only reason for fitting a fuse as well is in case the MCB doesn't work. How much should you trust safety devices? My machine has a couple of fuses on the PSU (commercial item) and one of those blew once. The PSU was operating well within its rating; it was just that the fuse was tired and didn't want to play any more. I'm not sure that I don't trust the MCB more than the fuse, but I don't have much experience of them in this kind of situation. On the other hand, all your house wiring is probably protected by a bunch of MCBs, so the people who make the rules trust them.

Desertboy
01-12-2017, 11:15 AM
Mr Postman arrived with a package from China for me can be only one thing ;)

Won't be back at work till 1pm but shouldn't take long to fit it, test it. Then drill the box and fit grommets for the nema's, limit switches, mains input & spindle output's, fit the box, fit the plate in the box and finally fir the wiring to the board lol. Hoping to get it all done today then tomorrow, get a sheet of mdf for the bed and start configuring the machine. Be nice to get the bed milled flat and vacuum holes drilled over the weekend.

I have a a few things I would like to build out before the end of the year and I'm starting to believe I might just get at least some of them built ;) Not long now.

e2a was my AM882 in the post dropped it on the machine and tested it works fine ;) I know have 4 moving axis and my Y axis is linked up. Took me some head scratching in Linuxcnc and editing the .hal and .ini files probably click a button in Mach 3 lol.

Tomorrow I can get the box finished and start with homing.

Desertboy
02-12-2017, 02:54 PM
Long time coming but finally she moves using the AM882's and the Toroidal PSU from linuxcnc ;)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JH7ISQcmeUM

At the moment I auto tuned the steppers (Hopefully, flick the SW4 switch on/off/on with rotation knob in 0 position) and set microstepping to 2 just to get it working but will get it set it properly next couple of days.)

What microstepping do others use for their AM882's? I was thinking X16.

Nr1madman
02-12-2017, 03:53 PM
Must feel amazing :D
What's going into the cutter first?

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Desertboy
02-12-2017, 04:05 PM
Must feel amazing :D
What's going into the cutter first?

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MDF bed ;)

23295

With 16mm holes in it, I have 16mm plastic plugs, 1000's of them so I can block off the holes as needed. Then going to use a vacuum cleaner for now but will upgrade to a vac pump and use a couple of air tanks for extra capacity. Clamping would do my head in, although I may still need to clamp lol.

Then have a play with some scrap wood before I start cutting expensive stuff lol, also want to check out how much flex I have in the middle so will try cutting hard woods in the centre

Nr1madman
02-12-2017, 04:49 PM
Smart stuff!
Any worries about soundlevels when running vacuumpumps?
Have never used one so I don't know but I'm worried :D

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Desertboy
02-12-2017, 04:52 PM
Smart stuff!
Any worries about soundlevels when running vacuumpumps?
Have never used one so I don't know but I'm worried :D

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Vacuum cleaners are a lot louder than vac pumps for reference.

No issues for me it's in an industrial unit so can make as much noise as I want 24 hours a day ;)

Neale
02-12-2017, 05:09 PM
What microstepping do others use for their AM882's? I was thinking X16.

I use x8, with EM806. That's with NEMA23 3Nm, 5mm lead ballscrews, 1-1 pulleys. Seems like a good compromise between smooth running, resolution, and maintaining torque. Gives me about 5000mm/min rapid, which is slower than some people but the max I can manage with my ballscrew length.

Desertboy
03-12-2017, 07:22 PM
8X it is ;) do the motors get quieter the more microsteps you have? When I first ran them one of the motors was virtually silent.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O4_u5ov-9cc

Ordered a 720p webcam to set a timelapse up so I can record my mistakes ;)
Did you use the auto tune function on the EM806? Wondering if I did it right, flicked the SW4 switch on/off/on you hear some minor buzzing sound for a second and it's done. Does this sound correct?

Neale
03-12-2017, 09:18 PM
Certainly a non-microstepped motor seems to run really roughly. I haven't studied it that closely, though - that was on a different machine which had been set up without microsteps for initial testing. The other thing to take into account is the pulse rate you can get out of the driving PC, though. Too many microsteps and you can't drive the pulses fast enough for decent speed. However, most people seem to be using external motion controllers these days which takes that whole issue away.

I did play with the autotune, although I was never quite clear about whether it should be done on load, and if so how you handled the case of a master/slave axis setup. Not a lot seemed to happen, though, and I have no idea whether or not it made a difference! I just use the machine, and it seems to work fine as it is. Might not be optimum, but I'm not sure what difference tuning makes. No apparent resonance over the speed range I use (typically cutting at around 3000-3500mm/min in wood or polythene) and 5000mm/min rapid. I guess that the ideal tune might allow slightly higher accelerations, but like a lot of people I just tweaked and tested until I had reasonable and reliable results.

Good luck - you seem to be getting close now!

Desertboy
04-12-2017, 11:25 AM
I forgot to mention I fitted the BK12 fitting the wrong way round on the X axis and it was squeaking when I tried to move it, lubricated the hiwin's and ballbscrews a couple of times before I realised lol.

Swapped the BK12 fitting opposite way round and all good ;)

Nr1madman
04-12-2017, 11:27 AM
I forgot to mention I fitted the BK12 fitting the wrong way round on the X axis and it was squeaking when I tried to move it, lubricated the hiwin's and ballbscrews a couple of times before I realised lol.

Swapped the BK12 fitting opposite way round and all good ;)Damnit! Is there a wrong way :D I have one squeaking ! Have to check orientation.. good find hehe

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Desertboy
04-12-2017, 11:47 AM
23312

This is the correct way at least mine doesn't squeak when fitted like this and does when the BK12 fitting is the opposite way round.

I think the Chinese might be off with 500mm though lol.

Nr1madman
04-12-2017, 12:14 PM
Aah.. thats the way I have it and still squeaking ;)
Have it reversed on z but that works fine haha

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Desertboy
04-12-2017, 12:20 PM
Aah.. thats the way I have it and still squeaking ;)
Have it reversed on z but that works fine haha

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I would try taking it off and reseating it as it shouldn't be squeaking, sounds like it's not sat in the bearing straight and maybe just reseating it will be enough.

Desertboy
04-12-2017, 07:08 PM
Got the spindle back on was nice to see it move with the spindle on and test the water cooling hoses for kinks, etc during movement.

I am going to put the limit switches sideways on like someone suggested maybe 3cm away from the original switches, ordered a couple of roller type ones and have 1 spare. The original ones going to leave in place as hard limits so when I do get a latched relay I can wire it to that with all my other emergency stuff.

Desertboy
06-12-2017, 10:00 PM
Water cooling works ;)

Still waiting on roller limit switches, box is 90% finished now.

Desertboy
09-12-2017, 02:45 PM
Still no roller switches but found a spare one so i can fit 2 for the Y axis over the weekend, getting it fitted in place finally.

23370

Nr1madman
09-12-2017, 03:14 PM
Awesome! :D

What type of rollerswitches did you get?

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Desertboy
09-12-2017, 03:21 PM
Awesome! :D

What type of rollerswitches did you get?

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https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/1PC-Micro-Switch-Spdt-Hinge-Roller-Lever-15A-V-156-1C25-Hot-Sale-STHW/152805882165?ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT&_trksid=p2057872.m2749.l2649

I got 2 of these and have 2 honeywells same type already.

Now I've found the missing one I can sort the Y out which is the most important anyway as I'm going to use the switches to square the gantry when homing. This is going to take me a little while to work out in linuxcnc lol.

Nr1madman
09-12-2017, 03:35 PM
https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/1PC-Micro-Switch-Spdt-Hinge-Roller-Lever-15A-V-156-1C25-Hot-Sale-STHW/152805882165?ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT&_trksid=p2057872.m2749.l2649

I got 2 of these and have 2 honeywells same type already.

Now I've found the missing one I can sort the Y out which is the most important anyway as I'm going to use the switches to square the gantry when homing. This is going to take me a little while to work out in linuxcnc lol.Was thinking about that type aswell.. have some somewhere :D but Im probably gonna buy this kind https://m.ebay.co.uk/itm/Blue-ME-8108-Momentary-with-Roller-Arm-Limit-Switch-For-CNC-Mill-Laser-Plasma-RT/391863406946?epid=24007743509&hash=item5b3ce11162:g:qWIAAOSwIgNXjh-v



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Clive S
09-12-2017, 03:58 PM
Was thinking about that type aswell.. have some somewhere :D but Im probably gonna buy this kind https://m.ebay.co.uk/itm/Blue-ME-8108-Momentary-with-Roller-Arm-Limit-Switch-For-CNC-Mill-Laser-Plasma-RT/391863406946?epid=24007743509&hash=item5b3ce11162:g:qWIAAOSwIgNXjh-v



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I personally would go with this type https://www.ebay.co.uk/i/222564671841?chn=ps&adgroupid=49962971442&rlsatarget=pla-380395540690&abcId=1129946&adtype=pla&merchantid=107663274&poi=&googleloc=9046435&device=c&campaignid=974960578&crdt=0

No moving parts to go wrong.

Nr1madman
09-12-2017, 04:19 PM
I personally would go with this type https://www.ebay.co.uk/i/222564671841?chn=ps&adgroupid=49962971442&rlsatarget=pla-380395540690&abcId=1129946&adtype=pla&merchantid=107663274&poi=&googleloc=9046435&device=c&campaignid=974960578&crdt=0

No moving parts to go wrong.To tell the truth Ive bought that kind for my home switches, was thinking about going mechanical for my limits because of all the forum threads I have seen about connecting proximity switches and different types (npn, pnp) and the problems people have in connecting them. I guess its not complicated and if I get confused I could always get my multimeter and figure out whats going on.
But I just dont want anything more complications right now :)

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Clive S
09-12-2017, 04:30 PM
Yes you are correct they don't need to be accurate for limits and easier to connect in one loop.

Desertboy
09-12-2017, 04:42 PM
Am I right in thinking it's pointless to use limit switches if you're only going to wire them to the Estop as the home switches can do the same job? They become useful when fitted to an external override like a latched relay?

Is this correct?

Nr1madman
09-12-2017, 04:52 PM
Am I right in thinking it's pointless to use limit switches if you're only going to wire them to the Estop as the home switches can do the same job? They become useful when fitted to an external override like a latched relay?

Is this correct?You are thinking of wireing them to the estop input on the bob only?

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Desertboy
09-12-2017, 05:22 PM
You are thinking of wireing them to the estop input on the bob only?

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at moment yes I have crashed into the side of my machine already lol it's doesn't do a lot just fires a stall protect didn't meant to was see how close I needed to get to the microswitches. Something like Thor you got big issues but with 2nm and AM882's it seems a non issue.

since all my switches with wired NC if the machine fails to stop machines probably crashed and stuck in a loop which is probably extremely rare in linuxcnc.

Nr1madman
09-12-2017, 05:49 PM
at moment yes I have crashed into the side of my machine already lol it's doesn't do a lot just fires a stall protect didn't meant to was see how close I needed to get to the microswitches. Something like Thor you got big issues but with 2nm and AM882's it seems a non issue.

since all my switches with wired NC if the machine fails to stop machines probably crashed and stuck in a loop which is probably extremely rare in linuxcnc.I know lots of people trust bob inputs and software and do similar installations like you are planning. It was this forum that made me question this and think more industrial ;)
But almost all of the time your way will work haha

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Desertboy
09-12-2017, 05:54 PM
I know lots of people trust bob inputs and software and do similar installations like you are planning. It was this forum that made me question this and think more industrial ;)
But almost all of the time your way will work haha

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When I got steel things will be different

Nr1madman
09-12-2017, 06:28 PM
When I got steel things will be differentWell.. if you use latching relay option that might fuse aswell as software.. you are never totally safe :D

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Desertboy
09-12-2017, 06:51 PM
Well.. if you use latching relay option that might fuse aswell as software.. you are never totally safe :D

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I'm not even vaguely safe at any one time lol.

Desertboy
11-12-2017, 03:36 PM
Quick question the 12/24v spindle input on my BOB which is + and which is -? I assume left would be - and right +

23377

Got a 2nd hand 3d connexion space pilot from Ebay for a good price and condition is excellent it doesn't look or feel like the one I have has ever even been used lol.

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/IBM-3DConnexion-40K9206-USB-Space-Pilot-3D-Mouse-40K9204/232572608676?ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT&_trksid=p2057872.m2749.l2649

Was slightly fiddly to setup as it's not supported by the latest software from 3d connexion but download the legacy software from there site and works 100%, just remember to restart fusion 360 if you install it whilst fusion is open. Lol spent 20 mins before I realised a simple restart of fusion was all that was needed nothing to configure to get it working.

It's weird! But I like it I can see I'm going to get on with it very well but it's going to take a little while to get used to it I can already navigate fusion 360 300% better in 2 mins of using it without trying the trainer yet lol.

Need to work out how to configure the 1-6 buttons as well for most optimal workflow but undo and redo have to be on that list ;)

Clive S
11-12-2017, 04:06 PM
Quick question the 12/24v spindle input on my BOB which is + and which is -? I assume left would be - and right +
have you looked under the board on one of those that I have it is printed on the pcb. On mine +ve is third from the cap and -ve is forth. I am talking about the power supply input.

Desertboy
11-12-2017, 04:12 PM
have you looked under the board on one of those that I have it is printed on the pcb. On mine +ve is third from the cap and -ve is forth. I am talking about the power supply input.

No I didn't before I bolted the BOB to the plate and the plate into the box lol, but I have an identical BOB luckily spare so will check that one ;)

Nr1madman
11-12-2017, 04:14 PM
I think its like this
https://image.ibb.co/kag1jb/mach3_breakout_board_5_axes_cnc_breakout_board_wop tical_coupler_for_mach3_stepper_motor_drive.jpg

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Desertboy
11-12-2017, 09:30 PM
That's my board so we'll see tomorrow ;)

Really liking the 3d mouse gives you so much more control over how you view your model.
23380

Desertboy
12-12-2017, 06:20 PM
Going down to south park ;)

23396

23397

Nr1madman
14-12-2017, 06:59 AM
Going down to south park ;)

23396

23397Make it, show it, love it!

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Davek0974
14-12-2017, 07:17 AM
The southpark figures are 3d illustrations?? The wood grain looks wrong to be real cuts?

Chaz
14-12-2017, 07:36 AM
The southpark figures are 3d illustrations?? The wood grain looks wrong to be real cuts?

Renders from within Fusion 360. Shows how good they are, the need to check / question :-)

Desertboy
14-12-2017, 10:06 PM
The southpark figures are 3d illustrations?? The wood grain looks wrong to be real cuts?

Chaz is right there Fusion 360 models I then "coloured" using different woods in physical material.

I was playing with different ways of making cad models from bitmaps

The South Park figures were a simple spline trace over a canvas, Obey from They Live (Cracking film) I used Inkscape trace bitmap function to vectorize the image then used the SVG to extrude from.

23405

This is one I did from a photo of a friend this took a fair bit of processing in both gimp and Inkscape before I could get a usable extrusion will need cleaning up before I make it.

Also going to check out image2gcode built into linuxcnc to see what engraving fun I can have ;)

Desertboy
16-12-2017, 01:03 AM
Was playing in fusion only took 40 mins but not sure how I'd drive the long axis, I think needs to be R&P but have no idea how to set up a dual pinion anti backlash setup. The other choice 2* 2.7m 2510 ballscrew's with rotating ballnut's as at the length it's going to be a skipping rope if I try and rotate the screw.

Does anyone know how I invert the axis in linuxcnc? Using the beta dual ballscrew on the Y so need to edit the hal or .ini to do it as the wizard doesn't support dual motors.
23414

Alright Fusion buffs when I copy an object how do I break the association so my edits to the new object do not effect the original?

Davek0974
16-12-2017, 11:43 AM
Man, do i need to brush up on Fusion, 40 minutes? would have taken me a week :) Thats if i could figure out where to start

Nr1madman
16-12-2017, 12:21 PM
Are you sure you need dual pinions if using r&p?
I think the more common option is to spring load the pinion against the rack.. have you checked cncrouterparts design with a pivotplate or the mechmate as it uses similar design.

And I agree about your fusion skills! Impressive!
I find solidworks much more intuitive but I have a really old version so I guess fusion tutorials are on that to-do list ;)

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Clive S
16-12-2017, 12:48 PM
Does anyone know how I invert the axis in linuxcnc? Using the beta dual ballscrew on the Y so need to edit the hal or .ini to do it as the wizard doesn't support dual motors.Dave

For twin screws you need Linuxcnc V 2.8 master if you want independent homing. I you want to reverse on of the motors then you can just swap the phases around on the motor.

What version are you using?

Davek0974
16-12-2017, 12:50 PM
If using R&P, yes spring load the pinion against the rack - this takes out 99% of the backlash, but also fit a stop to the motor/plate to stop it being able to disengage or jump the rack if overloaded, a jumping pinion will chew both rack and pinion instantly meaning an expensive fix, far better to stall the stepper.

I use R&P on my plasma table and its been flawless so far.

Desertboy
16-12-2017, 01:09 PM
Dave

For twin screws you need Linuxcnc V 2.8 master if you want independent homing. I you want to reverse on of the motors then you can just swap the phases around on the motor.

What version are you using?

It's not Dave it's me ;) I'm using the beta I've enabled the master repositories so should be bang up to date, it's does read 2.8 something on boot.

I was hoping it was just an option in the ini to invert them you can do it from the stepconf but that's no good for setting up dual ballscrews.

I guess swap the wires around will be the easiest solution.

My brother asked me what I want for Xmas was going to ask for a 3nm nema 23 which I'll fit to the gantry and swap the 2nm from the gantry to the Z.

Desertboy
16-12-2017, 01:16 PM
If using R&P, yes spring load the pinion against the rack - this takes out 99% of the backlash, but also fit a stop to the motor/plate to stop it being able to disengage or jump the rack if overloaded, a jumping pinion will chew both rack and pinion instantly meaning an expensive fix, far better to stall the stepper.

I use R&P on my plasma table and its been flawless so far.

I was thinking a dual pinion setup to remove the backlash, if I build this I'll put servos on it.

When the time is right I should come down and give you fusion 360 lessons and you can help me with my R&P ;)

Ordered myself a new phone

https://www.banggood.com/Elephone-S8-6_0-inch-2K-Display-4GB-RAM-64GB-ROM-MTK6797T-Helio-X25-Deca-core-4G-Smartphone-p-1208551.html?cur_warehouse=HK

Cheap Chinese of course have better things to spend money on.

Clive S
16-12-2017, 02:17 PM
It's not Dave it's me ;) I'm using the beta I've enabled the master repositories so should be bang up to date, it's does read 2.8 something on boot.

I was hoping it was just an option in the ini to invert them you can do it from the stepconf but that's no good for setting up dual ballscrews.

I guess swap the wires around will be the easiest solution.

Sorry Me:confusion: Can you post your ini and hal files and I will take a look, you can invert them in hal. I am In Spain again but back on Tuesday but I might be able to do it from here.

Desertboy
16-12-2017, 02:44 PM
Sorry Me:confusion: Can you post your ini and hal files and I will take a look, you can invert them in hal. I am In Spain again but back on Tuesday but I might be able to do it from here.

Enjoy the sangria & sunshine ;)

Desertboy
18-12-2017, 02:00 PM
Got my MDF bed on now I need to make it a vac bed ;)

I used an 18mm sheet

Nr1madman
18-12-2017, 02:14 PM
Got my MDF bed on now I need to make it a vac bed ;)

I used an 18mm sheetPics or it didnt happen :D

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Desertboy
18-12-2017, 06:10 PM
23431

Nr1madman
18-12-2017, 06:15 PM
Looks neat ;)

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Desertboy
18-12-2017, 06:18 PM
Looks neat ;)

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It just fits and I mean just lol I had to tap it in the corners which is the fit I wanted was stressed about this cut as I had to outsource the cut and I knew it would be a bastard luckily I got a friendly a wood guy to help me out.

As soon as you say i want 135.1cm *100cm people look at you funny lol.

Desertboy
18-12-2017, 08:02 PM
I'm going to make a frame from 2*1 on ply wood so the router sits on the frame, then drill a hole in the ply for the vac bed. I can very easily drop the router onto anti vibration mounts or sit it on 20cm thick rubber bump stops.

Is there any point?

Desertboy
19-12-2017, 11:08 AM
My wiring is dodgy on the spindle, luckily I didn't damage it!

I need to resolder properly but I decided today I was in disaster mode and anything I do will break things even more lol. Asked my electrician mate to come help me sort it.

Tripping out RCD so it's earth related.

But we did do a test cut ;)23438

Chaz
19-12-2017, 11:09 AM
My wiring is dodgy on the spindle, luckily I didn't damage it!

I need to resolder properly but I decided today I was in disaster mode and anything I do will break things even more lol. Asked my electrician mate to come help me sort it.

Tripping out RCD so it's earth related.

But we did do a test cut ;)23438

Congrats, the first movement is always the sweetest.

Desertboy
19-12-2017, 11:13 AM
Congrats, the first movement is always the sweetest.

The first movements I had a dead spot on my router where the ballscrew was catching but quickly traced to my motor mounts. Under one of the mounts on one side was a washer but not the other. Removed the washer and all was good ;) Struggling to fit my limit switches lol, broke 3 cobalt drill bits so far bloody M3's far too flimsy.

Nickhofen
19-12-2017, 11:19 AM
So...the first cut is the sweetest!

Desertboy
19-12-2017, 11:23 AM
So...the first cut is the sweetest!

until the power goes out lol, since it tripped the rcd (doing this cut) I bet it's the earth connection I obviously need to redo it properly.

Desertboy
19-12-2017, 05:31 PM
Felt brave so I fixed it :) was a dodgy earth

Nickhofen
20-12-2017, 08:38 PM
Nice, I feel your relief...hmmm that didn't sound right!

Desertboy
21-12-2017, 11:02 AM
Nice, I feel your relief...hmmm that didn't sound right!

You saucy swedes lol.

I'm going to make this first (As an engraving) to put on the wall next to the machine as no one at work thought I could build this so a nice little F you for them to see daily ;)

23455

Nr1madman
21-12-2017, 11:06 AM
You saucy swedes lol.

I'm going to make this first (As an engraving) to put on the wall next to the machine as no one at work thought I could build this so a nice little F you for them to see daily ;)

23455Hahaha :D

Nick is from greece!

Love the sign

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Desertboy
21-12-2017, 11:35 AM
Hahaha :D

Nick is from greece!

Love the sign

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Ah a greecy greek, a batty brit and a saucy swede at least there's no filthy french ;)

Nickhofen
21-12-2017, 12:57 PM
Ah a greecy greek, a batty brit and a saucy swede at least there's no filthy french ;)

Lol!
The sign Rocks, the F community approves,haha!!!

Desertboy
22-12-2017, 05:06 PM
I made a simple clamp today, whatever I made it from came from Krypton lol.

We broke 4 drill bits (With cooling, low speed, bosch cobalts) 3 of them brand new and tried drill press, dewalt and snap on cordless to drill the hole.

We made it about 1mm so far lol, will get photo tomorrow but when I find the kryptonite I need to drill the 2 holes I will have a clamp solution but am going to do a vac bed solution as well.

Desertboy
23-12-2017, 12:42 PM
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6Qb5sx65kRE

Nr1madman
23-12-2017, 08:50 PM
I made a simple clamp today, whatever I made it from came from Krypton lol.

We broke 4 drill bits (With cooling, low speed, bosch cobalts) 3 of them brand new and tried drill press, dewalt and snap on cordless to drill the hole.

We made it about 1mm so far lol, will get photo tomorrow but when I find the kryptonite I need to drill the 2 holes I will have a clamp solution but am going to do a vac bed solution as well.Wtf! :D

Expensive clamp!

I say kill it.
Kill it with fire

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Desertboy
28-12-2017, 02:47 PM
Wtf! :D

Expensive clamp!

I say kill it.
Kill it with fire

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I'm going to ask my engineer mate to drill it he won't charge a lot (Like £5 for both holes) and probably know what it's made of.

I'm going to make a vac bed so the clamps will very rarely be used but it's better to have a clamp and not need it than need a clamp and not have it ;)

Started playing with cam ;)
23490

But unsure the about anything :) I think it's a case of having a play and lot of scrap wood lol.

Nr1madman
30-12-2017, 11:35 AM
Do you like the cam in fusion? Does it feel intuitive?

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Desertboy
30-12-2017, 11:59 AM
Do you like the cam in fusion? Does it feel intuitive?

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Not tried generating code and running in linuxcnc yet, I don't have the homing switches on yet I did fit one set badly lol so I've decided to put roller type sideways on as someone recommended originally lol. I have the switches just keep snapping drill bits need to get a 3.2mm for the switches.

I feel confused but for most of the build I've been confused it's a feeling I'm getting used to lol. I hadn't realised when i started the build quite how much you're going to have to learn especially Fusion although I'm so glad I did now.

I have just purchased the mock exams for fusion 360 certification (Going to get certified next year just for kicks) you would laugh if you saw how easy they were lol I'm going to be embarrassed if I fail the certification lol but I'd also be surprised.

Linuxcnc also has some great plugins for generating gcode, image2gcode (which is built in) is something I'll have to check out.

Nr1madman
30-12-2017, 12:46 PM
Not tried generating code and running in linuxcnc yet, I don't have the homing switches on yet I did fit one set badly lol so I've decided to put roller type sideways on as someone recommended originally lol. I have the switches just keep snapping drill bits need to get a 3.2mm for the switches.

I feel confused but for most of the build I've been confused it's a feeling I'm getting used to lol. I hadn't realised when i started the build quite how much you're going to have to learn especially Fusion although I'm so glad I did now.

I have just purchased the mock exams for fusion 360 certification (Going to get certified next year just for kicks) you would laugh if you saw how easy they were lol I'm going to be embarrassed if I fail the certification lol but I'd also be surprised.

Linuxcnc also has some great plugins for generating gcode, image2gcode (which is built in) is something I'll have to check out.I know the confused feeling :D
There are 200 sidesteps to complete an otherwise straight forward cnc build haha.

The cam bit is something I dont look forward to.
I know its gonna be a mental battle with lots of rage for my part while the software will be laughing at me ;)

For CAD i actually like solidworks better.. but Im not really good at it yet hehe.. my laptop is not powerful enough to run it without quirks and protest! Will have to invest ;)

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Desertboy
30-12-2017, 01:06 PM
I know the confused feeling :D
There are 200 sidesteps to complete an otherwise straight forward cnc build haha.

The cam bit is something I dont look forward to.
I know its gonna be a mental battle with lots of rage for my part while the software will be laughing at me ;)

For CAD i actually like solidworks better.. but Im not really good at it yet hehe.. my laptop is not powerful enough to run it without quirks and protest! Will have to invest ;)

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What are you intending to control your machine with?

I went with linuxcnc over mach 3 because
1. I believe in open source
2. More real time kernal than windows which is important when using a PP BOB. If you're using the BOB I have with Mach 3 you need to run windows 7 or below 32 bit edition. Linuxcnc still needs to be 32 bit edition for PP BOB's.
3. It's FREE!!!

I worked the assumption that linuxcnc will be more difficult to setup but once working properly neither would have an advantage over the other for a simple router like mine.

Nr1madman
30-12-2017, 01:18 PM
What are you intending to control your machine with?

I went with linuxcnc over mach 3 because
1. I believe in open source
2. More real time kernal than windows which is important when using a PP BOB. If you're using the BOB I have with Mach 3 you need to run windows 7 or below 32 bit edition. Linuxcnc still needs to be 32 bit edition for PP BOB's.
3. It's FREE!!!

I worked the assumption that linuxcnc will be more difficult to setup but once working properly neither would have an advantage over the other for a simple router like mine.You make good points!
Im gonna use uccnc..
Bought a second hand uc300 controller and got the uccnc license included.
Read alot of positive comments about uccnc so it feels good.
If I was gonna use PP like you I would probably run dual boot win with mach3 and linuxcnc ;)
Have a feeling I would be switching back and forwards trying to decide whats better :D

Oh and about your limitswitches, hope you get them mounted in a good manner :D
Im still planning where mine should be.
I want travelling switches with static targets.. kind of hard thinking about where they should be on each axis without limiting travel or crashing into anything haha



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Clive S
30-12-2017, 04:35 PM
Linuxcnc still needs to be 32 bit edition for PP BOB's.Not so sure about that:whistle:

Desertboy
30-12-2017, 06:45 PM
Not so sure about that:whistle:

It is very possible I made it up lol but swear I read that somewhere. I know they broke the PP in 64 bit windows.

Ordered a 6mm compression bit for ply ;)

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/6mm-x22-Compression-UP-DOWN-Cutter-Tool-Solid-Carbide-CNC-Cutters-Wood-Cutters/302539727256?ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT&_trksid=p2057872.m2749.l2649

Nickhofen
31-12-2017, 08:18 AM
Do you have a ballnose also ,for the finishing?

Desertboy
31-12-2017, 08:44 AM
Do you have a ballnose also ,for the finishing?

I don't have many bits yet, I have a cheap router set from Aldi lol and I ordered from China (I have them now) some 2 flute carbide endmills in 6mm and 8mm, selection of ballnose cutters and a engraving set.

Compression bits are for cutting laminates like ply they don't need (I think) ballnose cutters for finishing if just cutting if you're 3d milling ply maybe different.

Nickhofen
31-12-2017, 08:57 AM
I get it,I thought you were going to use it to curve the F label you design,to do the rough cut !

Desertboy
31-12-2017, 09:25 AM
I get it,I thought you were going to use it to curve the F label you design,to do the rough cut !

I've designed a few things I want to make I'm going to prototype in marine ply first (£80 a sheet for the best stuff) before I move on to real wood. Got a price for metre cubed of walnut almost had a baby lol.

At the moment also thinking about varnish's and Polyurethane ;)

I'm going to get a 1/2" cutter for roughing with wood

https://www.screwfix.com/p/erbauer-straight-router-cutter-12-7-x-63mm/39994?tc=CB4&ds_rl=1248184&ds_rl=1245250&ds_rl=1247848&gclid=EAIaIQobChMIv_Gix_ez2AIVg7vtCh2hRwBTEAQYASAB EgLBXPD_BwE&gclsrc=aw.ds&dclid=CNaK09L3s9gCFSUS0wodlRwBBg

Glad I'm not into aluminium although seeing the quote others are getting for plates you start to wonder if you should get into aluminium lol.

m_c
31-12-2017, 11:30 AM
It is very possible I made it up lol but swear I read that somewhere. I know they broke the PP in 64 bit windows.


Nobody 'broke' the PP in 64 bit. Microsoft just increased security.
Mach is essentially a virus that hooks onto the main windows core, which prior to 64bit or Win8, was unencrypted.
With the advent of 64bit, or Win8, Microsoft moved to a protected/encrypted core, so although Art did say it would be possible to hack it (I think he actually did try..) and still have the PP work, MS changed the encryption regularly with updates, so what might work today, could quite quickly be killed by an update.
He came to the conclusion that it just wasn't worth the hassle. Even though it was possible, it would be a minefield to install, get working reliably, and to stay working. External controllers are far cheaper than they used to be, eliminate a whole host of problems, and should give far better performance.

Linux on the other hand, the core is open source, so you can do pretty much whatever you want.

Desertboy
31-12-2017, 11:46 AM
Hmm Interesting on the 64bit windows ;)


Linux on the other hand, the core is open source, so you can do pretty much whatever you want.

Having access to the source for the kernel helps ;) There's a few real time kernels which you can use with linuxcnc not sure if any have an advantage or difference over the stock kernel included with the livecd but I do love the fact that there are several options. I remember reading the linuxcnc real time kernels are again hacks and not true real time kernels but good enough for the machines to work ok. Real timish was the term I saw being used which I love ;)

My obvious upgrade path is Mesa 7i73 which I'm eyeing up ;) I think I need to invest in a decent table saw (Or a vertical panel saw like in B&Q) first so I can process the wood into usable pieces.

Desertboy
31-12-2017, 12:43 PM
Since I'm only working wood/mdf/ply can I leave the spindle at 24000rpm/400hz all the time for now? I haven't connected the vfd to the BOB yet although I put the 12v power to the BOB in place so easy connect.

Desertboy
01-01-2018, 09:56 AM
Happy new year!

My resolution is to learn a lot more this year than I did last ;)

Nickhofen
01-01-2018, 10:21 AM
Happy 2018!

Desertboy
02-01-2018, 08:18 PM
Ordered myself a stop button living it up in the new year ;)

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/132443180667

Desertboy
03-01-2018, 01:08 PM
My elephone S8 came today not bad 2 weeks no import tax as well which is always good. £185 can't grumble it's lovely and at a price that when I break it in 6 months I can live with it lol.

I won't have the spindle so low in the mount I only have it that way until I fit a physical limit and limit switch so I can't run the Hiwin's off the rail on the Z axis.

I intend to put a bolt through the bottom Hiwin fitting that sticks out so it's blocked off and the carriages cannot come off.

23533

This is a photo with my elephone better than my fuji camera so happy with it ;) You can see my make shift clamps but also going to have a vac bed

Davek0974
03-01-2018, 01:11 PM
Nice, that phone does look good, I'm struggling with a dying iPhone6 and can't afford the new apple stuff so i'll probably look at one as well.

Desertboy
03-01-2018, 01:29 PM
Nice, that phone does look good, I'm struggling with a dying iPhone6 and can't afford the new apple stuff so i'll probably look at one as well.

The elephone is lovely but I would also consider this one instead and it's cheaper!

https://www.banggood.com/Oukitel-K6-6_0-inch-Face-ID-6300mAh-5V3A-6GB-RAM-64GB-ROM-MT6763-Octa-Core-4G-Smartphone-p-1239447.html?rmmds=detail-left-viewhistory__5&cur_warehouse=HK

Massive battery, pretty much the same screen more ram and space, slightly slower processor. Decent camera's but no gorilla glass unlike the elephone.

If you batter your phones get an elephone S8 if you look after them get a Oukitel ;) If you just need cheap get a cubot cheetah for ~£100 from germany they're really good for the price range got one for my brother surprising how good it is although Cubot photoshop the pics lol.

I paid £185 for my elephone but they £180 now you could get stung for £50 in import tax and fess I got lucky, I bought mine from banggood who I highly recommend.

Nickhofen
03-01-2018, 02:04 PM
I have the Oukitel K6000 plus 4Gb ram 64 Gb ROM, I bought it from tinydeal European wearhouse, for 154 euros with gorila glass and case ,the phone is a killer !

Desertboy
03-01-2018, 02:47 PM
I have the Oukitel K6000 plus 4Gb ram 64 Gb ROM, I bought it from tinydeal European wearhouse, for 154 euros with gorila glass and case ,the phone is a killer !

I stand corrected ;) The battery is what would swing it for me to the Oukitel but I'm still very happy with the elephone and so glad I went Chinese ;)23535

Desertboy
05-01-2018, 08:07 PM
23547

Compression bits are funky

Nickhofen
05-01-2018, 08:25 PM
Art!

Desertboy
05-01-2018, 08:33 PM
Art!

let's see how she cuts ply next ;)

BobenhamHotspur
14-01-2018, 08:53 PM
Hi
Are you aware of this CNC device http://www.maslowcnc.com/ ?

Desertboy
14-01-2018, 10:17 PM
Hi
Are you aware of this CNC device http://www.maslowcnc.com/ ?

Yes it doesn't do what I want to do but they do look kind of funky, I saw them before I ever started to build my router I can see them appealing to a certain market but I'm not that market.

I would think most people on here aren't that market.

Desertboy
15-01-2018, 02:11 PM
Having linuxcnc issues

23594

Also the pc is too slow to be useful I need to change to a faster pc but I have a core I7 with fusion at work so will make that a dual boot and pop the pci parallel port card into that.

When I had it set to 64 microsteps machine ran ok in manual mode but set the drivers to 8 and nothing happens even though I changed the scale to be correct.

Neale
15-01-2018, 02:36 PM
At a quick glance, that looks like a soft limit problem. When you configured LCNC you should have set up min and max limits for each axis, and those error messages say that you are trying to move beyond one (or more) of them.

Alternatively, you say you changed the scale. Do you mean you changed the steps per unit settings? 8 microsteps is the right sort of number - did you change the "steps per" the wrong way, by any chance?

Desertboy
15-01-2018, 02:49 PM
At a quick glance, that looks like a soft limit problem. When you configured LCNC you should have set up min and max limits for each axis, and those error messages say that you are trying to move beyond one (or more) of them.

Alternatively, you say you changed the scale. Do you mean you changed the steps per unit settings? 8 microsteps is the right sort of number - did you change the "steps per" the wrong way, by any chance?

Hi, I have all my min limit set to -0.001 and max limit 1200 on the X, 600 on the Y and 100 on the Z which I used stepconf (Wizard) to generate. Then I edited the ini to get my dual ballscrew working.

In Linux cnc scale is the amount of microsteps per mm you define it for each axis in the .ini so in my case using 8 microsteps = (8*200)/5==320 for my 1605 screws and (8*200)/4 = 400 for my 1604's.


# Generated by stepconf 1.1 at Sun Jan 14 20:24:44 2018
# If you make changes to this file, they will be
# overwritten when you run stepconf again

[EMC]
MACHINE = Test
DEBUG = 0
VERSION = 1.0

[DISPLAY]
DISPLAY = axis
EDITOR = gedit
POSITION_OFFSET = RELATIVE
POSITION_FEEDBACK = ACTUAL
ARCDIVISION = 64
GRIDS = 10mm 20mm 50mm 100mm 1in 2in 5in 10in
MAX_FEED_OVERRIDE = 1.2
MIN_SPINDLE_OVERRIDE = 0.5
MAX_SPINDLE_OVERRIDE = 1.2
DEFAULT_LINEAR_VELOCITY = 2.50
MIN_LINEAR_VELOCITY = 0
MAX_LINEAR_VELOCITY = 25.00
DEFAULT_ANGULAR_VELOCITY = 36.00
MIN_ANGULAR_VELOCITY = 0
MAX_ANGULAR_VELOCITY = 360.00
INTRO_GRAPHIC = linuxcnc.gif
INTRO_TIME = 5
PROGRAM_PREFIX = /home/cnc/linuxcnc/nc_files
INCREMENTS = 5mm 1mm .5mm .1mm .05mm .01mm .005mm

[KINS]
JOINTS = 4
KINEMATICS = trivkins coordinates=XYYZ

[FILTER]
PROGRAM_EXTENSION = .png,.gif,.jpg Greyscale Depth Image
PROGRAM_EXTENSION = .py Python Script
png = image-to-gcode
gif = image-to-gcode
jpg = image-to-gcode
py = python

[TASK]
TASK = milltask
CYCLE_TIME = 0.010

[RS274NGC]
PARAMETER_FILE = linuxcnc.var

[EMCMOT]
EMCMOT = motmod
COMM_TIMEOUT = 1.0
BASE_PERIOD = 100000
SERVO_PERIOD = 1000000

[HAL]
HALFILE = Test.hal
HALFILE = custom.hal
POSTGUI_HALFILE = postgui_call_list.hal

[TRAJ]
COORDINATES = X Y Z
LINEAR_UNITS = mm
ANGULAR_UNITS = degree
DEFAULT_LINEAR_VELOCITY = 36.00
MAX_LINEAR_VELOCITY = 25.00

[EMCIO]
EMCIO = io
CYCLE_TIME = 0.100
TOOL_TABLE = tool.tbl

[AXIS_X]
MAX_VELOCITY = 25.0
MAX_ACCELERATION = 750.0
MIN_LIMIT = -0.001
MAX_LIMIT = 1200.0

[JOINT_0]
TYPE = LINEAR
HOME = 0.0
MIN_LIMIT = -0.001
MAX_LIMIT = 1200.0
MAX_VELOCITY = 25.0
MAX_ACCELERATION = 750.0
STEPGEN_MAXACCEL = 937.5
SCALE = 320
FERROR = 1
MIN_FERROR = .25
HOME_OFFSET = 0.0

[AXIS_Y]
MAX_VELOCITY = 25.0
MAX_ACCELERATION = 750.0
MIN_LIMIT = -0.001
MAX_LIMIT = 600.0

[JOINT_1]
TYPE = LINEAR
HOME = 0.0
MIN_LIMIT = -0.001
MAX_LIMIT = 600.0
MAX_VELOCITY = 25.0
MAX_ACCELERATION = 750.0
STEPGEN_MAXACCEL = 937.5
SCALE = 400
FERROR = 1
MIN_FERROR = .25
HOME_OFFSET = 0.0

[JOINT_2]
TYPE = LINEAR
HOME = 0.0
MIN_LIMIT = -0.001
MAX_LIMIT = 600.0
MAX_VELOCITY = 25.0
MAX_ACCELERATION = 750.0
STEPGEN_MAXACCEL = 937.5
SCALE = 400.0
FERROR = 1
MIN_FERROR = .25
HOME_OFFSET = 0.0


[AXIS_Z]
MAX_VELOCITY = 25.0
MAX_ACCELERATION = 750.0
MIN_LIMIT = -100.0
MAX_LIMIT = 0.001

[JOINT_3]
TYPE = LINEAR
HOME = 0.0
MIN_LIMIT = -100.0
MAX_LIMIT = 0.001
MAX_VELOCITY = 25.0
MAX_ACCELERATION = 750.0
STEPGEN_MAXACCEL = 937.5
SCALE = 320
FERROR = 1
MIN_FERROR = .25
HOME_OFFSET = 0.0

Neale
15-01-2018, 04:01 PM
Unfortunately I can't help much more with the LCNC side of things - I switched to Mach3 around a year ago and even then I was using a machine with single motors.

Could you possibly post the gcode, or at least the first few dozen lines, just so we can see what is triggering the error messages?

Clive S
15-01-2018, 04:35 PM
Ok some questions. Do you have dual homing working? How are you homing the machine?
I don't see a HOME_SEQUENCE = in your ini file.

In [TRAJ] you have COORDINATES = X Y Z I think it should be X Y Y Z Not sure on this now!!

Have a good read through this thread https://forum.linuxcnc.org/49-basic-configuration/33007-more-help-with-two-steppers-on-one-axis-please?limitstart=0

Desertboy
15-01-2018, 06:47 PM
Ok some questions. Do you have dual homing working? How are you homing the machine?
I don't see a HOME_SEQUENCE = in your ini file.

In [TRAJ] you have COORDINATES = X Y Z I think it should be X Y Y Z Not sure on this now!!

Have a good read through this thread https://forum.linuxcnc.org/49-basic-configuration/33007-more-help-with-two-steppers-on-one-axis-please?limitstart=0

No homing yet was homing by pressing the home button in Axis for each one and I also tried no forced homing as well. I've only just drilled for the limit switches and am waiting for M3's to come through the post to fit them. I've put them sideways on now with rollers before I have the switches at the end bad idea as someone pointed out and I was like it'll be fine lol.


As often happens I was wrong.

I would like to get a controller that does step generation on board so PC specs are irrelevant, linuxcnc compatible and of course Ethernet is there such a controller?

Clive S
15-01-2018, 11:21 PM
I would like to get a controller that does step generation on board so PC specs are irrelevant, linuxcnc compatible and of course Ethernet is there such a controller?Yes Mesa 7i76e

I think you should take a step back and start with baby steps with Lcnc. Start by getting the homing sorted etc.
I have read your posts on the Linuxcnc forum and seen your ini and hal files they are different to the ones you have posted here try and be consistent with what you are asking.

I think your limits problem is that the machine does not know where it is, so get it homing first. I know where there is a working config for the 7i76e but it is for a plasma but is near enough.

edit : And just to keep you sane https://www.youtube.com/watch?time_continue=255&v=bAdqazixuRY