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John S
14-09-2012, 12:22 PM
Yes, which is why you don't use Zapp:

linearmotionbearings2008 | eBay (http://www.ebay.co.uk/sch/linearmotionbearings2008/m.html?_sacat=0&_nkw=sbr16&_sop=15)
4 SBR16-500mm rails+8 bearing blocks | eBay (http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/4-SBR16-500mm-rails-8-bearing-blocks-/130712394633?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item1e6f10db89&_uhb=1)




I'm taking an exception to this post VERY STRONGLY.

I know we all have our own opinions but there is always Pm and Email.

Jonathan has over reached in this case given that he's a moderator and understands the working of this forum.

Zapp is a paying advertiser on this site and for a moderator to post this is wrong. If I were Zapp I'd pull my advertising and demand a refund.

Lee if something isn't done about this then please pull my account or whatever it is called and delete all my posts. I don't want to belong if there are double standards at work.

[PS ] saved this in case it disappears.

WandrinAndy
14-09-2012, 02:24 PM
I disagree with you JohnS.

I would guess that most of any moderator's posts are made as forum-members, same as any of us fellow forum-members, and think it's correct that this forum does not prevent people giving their personal opinions.

Any supplier [forum advertiser or not] gets fair coverage on this forum, and were it necessary would be given the right of reply.

And by the way I would still gladly buy you a breakfast anytime you are in my neck of the woods... or borrow a piece of equipment from you on the never never ...

Rogue
14-09-2012, 03:00 PM
It could have been more subtle (ok, much more subtle) but this is the same advice that has been given many times over, by many different members about many different products - you can get x cheaper from y. If he had said that "there are a few x suppliers you can consider, including y who are quite reasonably priced" would it be an issue?

If a mod wanted to promote or draw attention to a sponsor, fair enough, but I would be much more concerned if they were afraid to give their opinion or present alternatives. As pointed out, the sponsors can also reply.

I do appreciate that the mods might want to display a touch more diplomacy when discussing sponsors than the rest of us, but objectivity is really important.

Web Goblin
14-09-2012, 03:30 PM
While I agree that some of Zapps prices can be expensive Gary helped me loads when I was let down by another supplier out when I was building my machine and I believe he does the same for others. Thats simply good service.
I do think that Jonathan could have worded it better.

JAZZCNC
14-09-2012, 04:40 PM
I know some are going to say I'm just jumping on John's band wagon and probably accuse me of bullying again.!!. . . But " Heigh Oh of the site I may go.!!"

Some things should be said and some shouldn't, equally some that say them shouldn't. John's correct Mods have a responsibility to the forum supporters, just has they are quick to jump on members indiscretions in threads.!

I recall a time when folks got banned/chastised for upsetting forum Business members who weren't "supposedly" even Advertisers. :playful:. . . . . . . " Over priced pile of crap" . .OR. . ." Yes, Which is why we don't use Zapp". . . . Both could be deemed offensive.

I too hope double standards aren't employed.!!

Edit: Those who have been around long enough will understand the "Over priced pile of crap" ref.!!. . . . . Thou Very much doubt this will get apologised for like I did that.?

blackburn mark
14-09-2012, 06:06 PM
if mods are required to show bias then it follows that the interest of the community is secondry to something else and the word of a mod is to be treated as suspect

if anyone wishes post a response to a quandry i have and they cant give their honest open opinion for whatever reason please dont bother posting at all
i offer the best i can in reguards to saving time and money for those that are interested, its whats expected

i would expect you to be offended john if i offered a peice of advise to you that didnt include my "best" infomation for some reason

it may have been more tactful to exclude the trade name, however, i disagree that it should have gone to PM as that just flies in the face of what the forum is built on in my opinion.... people helping each other out for no other reason than the joy of helping each other out.
the conflict of interest is just an uncomfortable truth that we ALL have to live with and you have no grounds to "bagsy" the moral high ground

John S
14-09-2012, 07:27 PM
By all means post alternatives otherwise how do we know they exist but to start a post slagging a main advertiser off by name means the poster has no morals.
Read Jazz's post above. He made the mistake of saying Routout piles of shit were shit and got banned for it because Routout were advertisers at this time. He wasn't even a God -- sorry Mod

m_c
14-09-2012, 07:49 PM
I agree with John on this.
The way Jonathan worded it makes it sound as though Zapp should never be used. I'm all for alternatives being suggested, but to say "don't buy from" sounds as though there's some major reason not to use that supplier.

blackburn mark
14-09-2012, 08:30 PM
By all means post alternatives otherwise how do we know they exist but to start a post slagging a main advertiser off by name means the poster has no morals.
Read Jazz's post above. He made the mistake of saying Routout piles of shit were shit and got banned for it because Routout were advertisers at this time. He wasn't even a God -- sorry Mod

it may be subjective: the way I see it, it doesn't qualify as a "slagging off"

the reason I don't use said supplier if I can help it is...... price, so i would be one of those included in the "reason WE don't"
besides that i'm guessing plenty of us have spent money where needs must :)

the ONLY reason i show any reverence to said supplier is he is an active contributor on the "forum" the same as everyone else


I'm all for alternatives being suggested, but to say "don't buy from"
that's stretching it a tad.... what would you have us say ?
"buy from linearmotionbearings because he is cheaper than our honourable friend"?
or should we say
"don't buy from our honourable friend because he is more expensive" LOL

ill assume you would have me save you money MC.... please correct me if im wrong :)

John S
14-09-2012, 08:41 PM
By all means put a link on the Linear motion bearings or whoever you want to highlight but no need to say A is better than B.

Anyway I'm obviously wrong on this - sorry, I must be just too old fashioned.......................

blackburn mark
14-09-2012, 09:03 PM
A is cheaper than B
how old fashioned do you need to be for that to be an insult ?

Jesus John!! I don't want to cross swords with you, under normal circumstances I would have nothing but good things to say about you.... your one of the main men.... pissing you off is like pissing my mum off, its just not done
I just think you have got your knickers in a twist over this one

don't hold it against me for locking horns with you John
xxxxxxxxxxx

WandrinAndy
14-09-2012, 09:26 PM
It looks to this newbie like there is some "history" that you old timers know that I don't.... and don't need to know... It's always good to see folk debating different views politely!

As an aside, I personally like what I think is the Yank approach to freedom of speech... that anything goes, except directly inciting people to violence or summat like that... come to think of it I actually thought it was fairly close to that here in deepest Yorkshire?

EDIT - Just to add that I suppose that each of us interprets the written word differently, and I interpretted the original post as being purely price-related in the context of whatever thread it was in. I have bought, and will be buying plenty of, stuff from Zapp as Gary seems to me to have a great reputation and provide quality goods and service!

Robin Hewitt
14-09-2012, 09:52 PM
Nowt wrong with Zapp!

Gary managed to ship me one 2.7 meter length of skinny HiWin rail which arrived unbent. Plus it was the threaded from behind variety I wanted. Plus I had a choice of 3 preloads on the block and advice so I got exactly what I needed and no need to comromise my design.

I bought 3 of his 220 Volt stepper drivers and they are freakin' amazing, the speed and power is borderline scary.

His stepper motor spec sheets have the torque versus speed graphs so I never have to buy a pig in a poke.

He sent me spare balls when I managed to spill a ball nut and lose some.

Can't say I have ever bought anything from Zapp that I have regretted and Gary actually seems to care that I am a happy bunny.

I can see that if you have a shoe string budget you may have to shop around and take a chance on the best price, perhaps I am lucky that I don't have to risk it.

Lee Roberts
14-09-2012, 10:37 PM
Read Jazz's post above. He made the mistake of saying Routout piles of shit were shit and got banned for it because Routout were advertisers at this time. He wasn't even a God -- sorry Mod

Morals?, double standards?....do me a favor.

No he never he asked to leave the site, just before i was about to ban him for telling me and everyone who didnt like the way he was speaking to them, somthing to the effect of "tuff shit", what he didnt no was the people he told that to where also the people he then called mates in the next sentence and who also expressed a problem with the way he was talking to people, what do you know?

And just to put the facts on the table, that Jazz is well aware of!, Routout have never advertised on this site and never will. They sent me an email suggesting that they would be intrested in advertising but wouldnt unless i removed the thread in question. So that is the truth on that!

If you want to believe gossip because you trust the person spreading it then thats fine by me, BUT DONT EVER! BRING MY NAME OR MORAL CREDIBILITY INTO IT.


I agree with John on this.
The way Jonathan worded it makes it sound as though Zapp should never be used. I'm all for alternatives being suggested, but to say "don't buy from" sounds as though there's some major reason not to use that supplier.

That's because interpretation of the sentence isn't what was intended or meant, if you go and read the thread you can clearly see that JB's comment is in the context of the discussion. You will also note that he never used the word Never, you have. In the same amount of time it has taken some of you to post, you could have just as easy asked JB what he meant by his comment, then made your own judgement.

Its to easy to think the worst of people, second guess them, then hold them at fault. When its just as easy to speak to them first.


By all means put a link on the Linear motion bearings or whoever you want to highlight but no need to say A is better than B. Anyway I'm obviously wrong on this - sorry, I must be just too old fashioned.......................

Right, but JB hasn't said A is better than B, look i dont want to drag this on any more then it needs to. I've reviewed JB's comment and im fine with it, i dont want to see you or any one leave the site John - but i will, that's just the nature of what i'm doing here.

If you no longer wish to have a membership to the site/forum please use the "contact us" form and make it official.


I would guess that most of any moderator's posts are made as forum-members, same as any of us fellow forum-members, and think it's correct that this forum does not prevent people giving their personal opinions.

100% on the money with that Andy, you will notice that our moderator's have a small statement below their post's. It's their for a reason.

There is somthing else here that keeps poping up, i think i've said this to some of you before but i think it keeps falling on deaf ears, i'll try again. What being a Moderator means to one person isn't the same as what it means to me, JB and the others do a Job for me and they do that Job exactly how i've asked them to do it. That job, title and/or meaning has nothing to do with any opinions they express when representing themselves as members of the forum.

No one cares more about the success of this site/forum and what is to come more than me, so please, let me do the worrying and make the decisions on what is right and not right for the site, just like i have so far and in gettting us this far.

You just enjoy the site, if i cant please you all and every time, sorry but it's just tuff there is nothing i can do about it.

.Me

Lee Roberts
14-09-2012, 10:55 PM
EDIT - Just to add that I suppose that each of us interprets the written word differently, and I interpretted the original post as being purely price-related in the context of whatever thread it was in.

My feelings were the same, confirmed by asking JB.

EDIT: My post has been sat on the desktop for a good hour now, im visiting my mum in milton keynes for my 30th on sunday. So not just copying what Andy has said because it "fits", i dont want to spend my time trying to sort this out this weekend guys, i dont get to see my family more than 1 or 2 times a year, so be good and sort this out between yourselves, ill hope for the best and speak to you on tuesday.

Have a good weekend,
Lee

JAZZCNC
01-12-2012, 05:56 PM
Nowt wrong with Zapp!

I bought 3 of his 220 Volt stepper drivers and they are freakin' amazing, the speed and power is borderline scary.

He sent me spare balls when I managed to spill a ball nut and lose some.

Can't say I have ever bought anything from Zapp that I have regretted and Gary actually seems to care that I am a happy bunny.

Can't Agree more Robin I like those drives has well thou never needed Gary's spare Balls.! . . . Thou he's a top Bloke so sure he would if I needed them. .. Lol . . certainly deserves more respect for his efforts.!