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DDSCV1.1 3 and 4 axis offline motion controller
HI,
After being looking at various controllers at the end i decided to test some of the offline ones. Started with one of the cheap ones. As you can imagine it would be great to forget about Windows if possible. So i decided to overview it "officially" here, hopefully sb could find that helpful.
DDSCV1.1, 3 and 4 axis. / note that in the 3 axis version you can not change any axis to rotational , but the 4rth axis variant, has a rotational axis option for A/
Mistakenly bought the 3 axis version / if sb wants that one , PM me/ . I have read the MANUAl from page one to end very carefully and apart from some small questions all looks well.
And yes, i will connect my 2 long axis to one of the controller axis or just one of them and control the other from the servo itself . Will see about that.
Here was the most extensive info in English i found till now
http://www.mycncuk.com/attachment.ph...629033&thumb=1
OK. So it arrived.
-Price paid 165$ for the 3 axis version
-nicely packed
-looks nice
According to me if one knows what he is doing it could be a perfectly self sufficient control for great price. It has spindle control, probing, software limits, separate axis homing, separate axis zeroing, etc.
Instead of writing novels, i made a video overview of it:
Part one, ~20 min introduction, basic functions and settings
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1pN3F04nhZc
Part 2, running program test
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nw1dpYfH-oE
Prt 3 / still to film, when i have more time will set it on my big machine, connect all and see how it moves, homes and so on in real life, otherwise all above is pointless/
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Re: DDSCV1.1 3 and 4 axis offline motion controller
Hi, could you open the case and get a photo of the PCB, I am very interested in seeing the difference between the 4 Axis, if any. There is no problem driving two stepper drivers from one axis. The X on my router has two motors and I use two separate drivers from the X axis signals.
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Re: DDSCV1.1 3 and 4 axis offline motion controller
here is the photo of the board:
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Re: DDSCV1.1 3 and 4 axis offline motion controller
Thanks, thats just the picture I needed.
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Re: DDSCV1.1 3 and 4 axis offline motion controller
These controllers are going to be a game changer for the many people sat on the fence telling themselves CNC is too hard to get into.
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Re: DDSCV1.1 3 and 4 axis offline motion controller
These look great, what Lathe/Mill Post Processor is required to generate code for them?
Most similar things I've seen claim "Standard G-Code" but then don't mention which easily available Post Processors produce "Standard G-Code" as all the PPs I've found have a manufacturer/machine/controller designation.
Mach3 developers had the good grace to work close to a standard for a popular industrial controller rather than a paper standard to which no manufacturer quite adheres.
Quote:
Originally Posted by
John S
These controllers are going to be a game changer for the many people sat on the fence telling themselves CNC is too hard to get into.
Never underestimate the incapability of the masses, there's still all those scary wires to connect ;-)
- Nick
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Re: DDSCV1.1 3 and 4 axis offline motion controller
Quote:
Originally Posted by
magicniner
These look great, what Lathe/Mill Post Processor is required to generate code for them?
Most similar things I've seen claim "Standard G-Code" but then don't mention which easily available Post Processors produce "Standard G-Code" as all the PPs I've found have a manufacturer/machine/controller designation.
Mach3 developers had the good grace to work close to a standard for a popular industrial controller rather than a paper standard to which no manufacturer quite adheres.
Never underestimate the incapability of the masses, there's still all those scary wires to connect ;-)
- Nick
That's the big question before jumping to conclusions
What i found till now:
- Post processor for mach3 definitely does not work, as you could see in second video it runs away from the job coordinates. Who cares, me not. I could save my programs again in the proper format
-It doe not recognise manual tool change code also. So jobs have to be split. Not big deal
-Does not recognise G20 and G21, so program must be in mm to begin with. No problem so far.
-Will run properly G code as of the Gcode and fanuc output from Aspire. Though program was simple. / See video2/ .
As i have not connected it yet to a machine i can not say more. But there is a good chance that all goes fine.
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Re: DDSCV1.1 3 and 4 axis offline motion controller
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Boyan Silyavski
-It doe not recognise manual tool change code also.
Does it support a Tool Changer/Turret etc. ?
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2 Attachment(s)
Re: DDSCV1.1 3 and 4 axis offline motion controller
This is a basic controller. The much more expensive Chinese controllers not only do all but close the loop also, at least the most expensive ones, which makes them really industrial
funny, i see now that it supports G20 and G21 but when i was testing it ?, so maybe i made a mistake somehow with the file. Will check again
That's what it supports.
Attachment 19199Attachment 19200
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Re: DDSCV1.1 3 and 4 axis offline motion controller
Quote:
Originally Posted by
magicniner
Does it support a Tool Changer/Turret etc. ?
No and neither does Mach 3 or LinuxCNC without 3rd party boards and a load of tossing about.
They are basically a cheap foray into CNC without a PC, monitor, licenses etc and all the Mumbo Jumbo that Mach and Linux entail.
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Re: DDSCV1.1 3 and 4 axis offline motion controller
Quote:
Originally Posted by
John S
No and neither does Mach 3 or LinuxCNC without 3rd party boards and a load of tossing about.
They are basically a cheap foray into CNC without a PC, monitor, licenses etc and all the Mumbo Jumbo that Mach and Linux entail.
I'm just trying to get a feel for whether it's a direction in which I should move, it does look like a great first foray into CNC solution, but given that I'm already au-fait and comfortable with Mach's Mumbo Jumbo I was looking for a step up rather than a step sideways and possibly down.
Although I've yet to have a PC fail I have upgraded my controller machine a few times to the point where it will hapily run my CAD/CAM. One very nice feature with Mach3 is that for approximately £60 I am able to have a fully configured, 100% functional backup PC with a new HDD on the shelf and any keyboard or monitor from my other systems can replace the ones on the CNC in the event of failure.
With any luck these all-in-one boxes will take off in the starter CNC market and grow with their customer base to offer enhanced capabilities,
- Nick
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1 Attachment(s)
Re: DDSCV1.1 3 and 4 axis offline motion controller
Quote:
Originally Posted by
magicniner
I'm just trying to get a feel for whether it's a direction in which I should move, it does look like a great first foray into CNC solution, but given that I'm already au-fait and comfortable with Mach's Mumbo Jumbo I was looking for a step up rather than a step sideways and possibly down.
Although I've yet to have a PC fail I have upgraded my controller machine a few times to the point where it will hapily run my CAD/CAM. One very nice feature with Mach3 is that for approximately £60 I am able to have a fully configured, 100% functional backup PC with a new HDD on the shelf and any keyboard or monitor from my other systems can replace the ones on the CNC in the event of failure.
With any luck these all-in-one boxes will take off in the starter CNC market and grow with their customer base to offer enhanced capabilities,
- Nick
NIck, its true if all is working as its meant. Reality have shown otherwise.
For example:
Right now in machine i have LPT board from my old machine that was working perfectly there. But not here. Now probe will not work , spindle output will not work with correct PWM, from that results that my mach3 screen /MachStdMill / is not working 100%. All that why? because board is near the servo drives in the box, and not so near mind that.
But hey, before that i had the Pokeys that is Ethernet and 24v powered but 5v on inputs and outputs, so what? Same problems. Wait, i had the galil 8 axis board/ 600euro second hand/ even before that, but no support,DIY plugin and communication with pc good for the 80ies...and so on.
Do you know how much time i spend playing with boards and make them work? And when i did sometimes, it happens that after Ethernet board i had to change back to x86 windows, cause-hey mach3 will not work on a x64 machine with LPT. When all was fine then PC crashed ... I have 3 PCs for that purpose and thought like you think.
I would have bought one of the CSMIO rigth from the start , 24vdc, shielded, etc. But they made them so that they don't work with MachStdMill +the cheap one would not square at homing and is not so cheap at 300 euro. And the other one is quite steep at 800euro. And at that moment i cared about that, because i love that screen.
Now i care only to start machine and to work. What i am saying is that for a production, even if its home production, most important is when you start the machine -to work 100%. And yes, i could say the same- controller burns and i put another one inside it, program it for 1/2 and thats it. is not that the same?
In other words if i was happy with a combo for which i have payed 200 euro for software and 100-800euro for hardware, Why on earth would i be researching other possibilities and reading Chinglish manuals?
FIY i am looking now at the "next step" as you say it. So the answer is: yes there is, but not for 150 euro from china like the one we are discussing here. For the moment i have narrowed things to 980-990MDc overview and manual , there are even better ones - 1000 and 1500, but are priced near the model numbers and i think are out of scope for normal retrofit or DIY machine.
Attachment 19201
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Re: DDSCV1.1 3 and 4 axis offline motion controller
Small update with video to follow:
Controller is mounted in my enclosure and after i spend yesterday all day playing with it, i could say- I like it and i am very happy with it.
Machines moves smoothly as ever at 10000/min and 3000 acceleration. Spindle speed is stable. Program time execution- same as using Mach3 or 4.
Manual has some confusing Chinglish elements as to be expected.
Probing works very well but needs some clarification:
First of all there are 2 types of probing:
Where tool position is at the moment or in Machine Coordinates the probes place on the machine could be predefined and probe or another probe mounted there.
Now the trick. It should be done once only.
Put a tool in collet, tighten it at hand but leave it a bit untightened so that if machine pushes it towards bed it will move inside the collet but at same time is not loose.
One must go to probing settings and make sure probe thickness is set to 0.000 and if not set it so and make sure probing is enabled and " at current tool position".
Then go back to control screen and start moving Z towards table. When you hit Z in table, bit will move a bit into collet. So now you are 0 to table in Working coordinates. Use commands and set Z to 0 in Working Coordinates on screen
M0ve Z up more distance than the probe is thick / by the way Z up is + and down is -, toward you Y is - and away from you is +, X left is -, X right is +, the so called right cartesian coordinate system/
Lay probe on table surface / current Z0/ . + of probe is connected to conductive probe material, minus to spindle body or bit, +should be isolated by other material like plastic from below/
hit "MODE2" then "-A" x 2 times and probing starts . When bit touches plate Z goes up depends how much you have predefined in probe settings. If you look now at probe setting you will see a number that may not be your probe thickness. DO NOT CHANGE THAT NUMBER. Its not wrong.
Now you can probe normally, control knows your real probe thickness, even if there is a loss of power.
PRECAUTIONS:
1. When changing G54 with other WCS you lose your probe thickness so you must do that again. Be Careful! Until you figure all out, raise the probe on a sponge.
2. If you program one of the external buttons that could be connected as 0 instead of "start" / when you hit it it zeroes all in WCS / , then when you zero from it, after that you again gave to repeat the probe thickness setting like from the start. I will investigate further but its start to seem that when you probe and 3 axis are zeroed right before that, that means it comprehends it like you want to set probe thickness, not like setting your Z WCS zero.
I will continue later with my findings. Now back to work.
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Re: DDSCV1.1 3 and 4 axis offline motion controller
Thanks for the update Boyan, look forward to the video.
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Re: DDSCV1.1 3 and 4 axis offline motion controller
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Boyan Silyavski
Right now in machine i have LPT board from my old machine that was working perfectly there. But not here. Now probe will not work , spindle output will not work with correct PWM, from that results that my mach3 screen /MachStdMill / is not working 100%. All that why? because board is near the servo drives in the box, and not so near mind that.
But hey, before that i had the Pokeys that is Ethernet and 24v powered but 5v on inputs and outputs, so what? Same problems. Wait, i had the galil 8 axis board/ 600euro second hand/ even before that, but no support,DIY plugin and communication with pc good for the 80ies...and so on.
Do you know how much time i spend playing with boards and make them work? And when i did sometimes, it happens that after Ethernet board i had to change back to x86 windows, cause-hey mach3 will not work on a x64 machine with LPT. When all was fine then PC crashed ... I have 3 PCs for that purpose and thought like you think.
It's poor workman that blames his tools.!! . . . . There are many 1000's of people using these products with no trouble and even more using Mach3 very succesfully.
So maybe you might want to look at what your doing wrong if things are not working as expected.?
Now don't get me wrong on this I'm not beating up on you Boyan or saying don't buy these standalone controllers. What I'm saying is don't be so quick rubbish products that work perfectly fine for others.!
My take on these controllers is they make perfect sense in that they remove the PC side and all that goes with it. However they need much more testing before they can be fully trusted and hailed better than rest.! (Which I'm in the process of doing on the higher end controllers)
Mach3 is and always will be like Marmite.!!!!
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Re: DDSCV1.1 3 and 4 axis offline motion controller
Jazz, nothing you say applies to lathe.
Lathe in Mach 3 or 4 just doesn't work.
Dan Malch has managed to get it working in M4 but he's lost 3 months of his life. Is that worth it ?
Me I can't even get M4 to run, error message after error message and not one reply to forum posts.
http://www.stevenson-engineers.co.uk...error%2015.jpg
Error message at the bottom, Line 42: I word given for arc in YZ plane.
Now correct me please but in line 4 does it not say G18 ?
And according to Mach's published list of G-Code G18 is XZ plane for lathe.
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Re: DDSCV1.1 3 and 4 axis offline motion controller
Quote:
Originally Posted by
JAZZCNC
It's poor workman that blames his tools.!! . . . . There are many 1000's of people using these products with no trouble and even more using Mach3 very succesfully.
So maybe you might want to look at what your doing wrong if things are not working as expected.?
My cabinet is steel. Line cables are 3 wire with ground connected. Every bit inside is connected to its own regulated power supply, no sharing. All PSU are shielded and grounded. With line filter before them to separate from servos or VFD eventual RFI /removed now as no help/. Signal and PSUs cables are Twisted, Shielded, Grounded. . Hell, even my Ethernet cable was CAT7 . How many people use cat7 cable to boards? My LPT cable to board and inside cabinet was shielded too.
My garage PC on other side is good for graphic design, i have all versions of Windows and even some you maybe have not heard of / custom builds made for fast processing / and i am around PCs from 1995 and repaired PCs and laptops for quite some years for other people.
In short - All here is prepared for connecting a HF plasma torch to machine so i highly doubt its my fault .
I dont trash. I say things how they are. Some boards were working fine, some half, some even not half. None 100%. When i pay 100 or 500 to sb, mentally i expect 100% but in real life i am happy with 90%. things to work. But 50%? Thanks but no. By the way 2 Pockey boards and 2 relay boards are on the way back right now to them. Had high hopes for them being made in EU, but no.
So i don't have your experience, that's why i am testing all on market which intrigues me. Next are some other controllers. And nope, i will not pay 800euro for CSMIO when i could buy a dedicated controller for that price
If i am doing something wrong, hows that the chinese board works now well and the other ones did not? In the same enclosure and same PSU. Its not shielded and by the way i had packed my previous board like a sandwich with aluminum foil at one moment just to check if that could be the problem.
And the time spend with boards were because of their crappy manuals also i must say. Pokeys for example. take a look at their Mach3 forum section. How many times the same bloody question Spindle and Probe. Not a word in the manual. I had to ask them also. Its like swimming against the current with some people.
So, no. Offline controllers may be at the moment a bit short of what could do, but when that shortcomings are ironed, i bet in the DIY world no one will buy anything else . And this controller we are speaking here for less than Mach3 / 4 licence is a no brainer . The red is not for you Dean but for the people who will read that post
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Re: DDSCV1.1 3 and 4 axis offline motion controller
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Boyan Silyavski
And the time spend with boards were because of their crappy manuals also i must say. Pokeys for example. take a look at their Mach3 forum section. How many times the same bloody question Spindle and Probe. Not a word in the manual. I had to ask them also. Its like swimming against the current with some people.
This is the bit I feel for.
On another forum it was pointed out to me that PlanetCNC andd UCCNC can now do threading and rigid tapping so last night I wasted another hour to take a look, here is a copy of the post.
*******************************
It seems that PlanetCNC and UCCNC now support fully synchronised threading as well as rigid tapping.
Martin.
.
Thank you for those links Martin, I wasn't aware that either could do threading on lathe.
However having spent nearly an hour perusing both websites and down loading both hardware and software manuals for both I'm non plussed at what they can do. This is starting to get familiar ??
Planet CNC first.
The board says it can take spindle encoder in but in the 35 page manual of which 7 pages are spent telling you how to wire all the different types of limits switch [ which aren't actually needed for the machine to run] but no explanation of how to wire the encoder in and not even is it just index pulse or multi line. I suspect it's index pulse only which is not a lot of good for accurate work
UCCNC next
Again hardly any information other than a video of threading with a felt tipped pan. The hardware manual is 21 pages long 19 of which tell you how to connect it up to the ethernet port, [ is it THAT hard ? and if it is WHY ? ]
Then the last two pages tell you what the terminals are in flowing terms like output 1, 2,3 etc for Port 1, poert 2 is identical but no a clue where to connect to ?
So please excuse me if I don't throw 215 Euros for the UCCNC board and software plus breakout board and another 263 Euro for the Planet offering.
I don't think the shelf can stand any more white elephants.
Seriously lads it's this total lack of support that is killing this. They know if or how good it works but it's a closely guarded secret.
***********************************************
The reference to the shelf and white elepants is the fact that the shelf above the bench where I do all the CNC work is literally full of controllers, breakout boards etc etc that either don't work, are no longer supported etc, etc to the tune of somewhere between £1500 and £2000 and I for one have now decided after the Mach 4 fiasco above that enough is enough.
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Re: DDSCV1.1 3 and 4 axis offline motion controller
Quote:
Originally Posted by
John S
Jazz, nothing you say applies to lathe.
Lathe in Mach 3 or 4 just doesn't work.
Dan Malch has managed to get it working in M4 but he's lost 3 months of his life. Is that worth it ?
Well wasn't really talking about Lathe John as it's not my thing as you know. Also I'm not defending Mach3.
You know because we've spoke several times on phone ranting about Mach4 and 3 that I'm also looking at these controllers. Mostly to eliminate the PC. Mach3 does good job for what I need for routers/mills. It's also massively flexible in what it can be made to control for one off custom jobs.
Like you I've also got box full of boards that have been tested and judged Crap. But this is same for any hardware, there's good and bad eggs so you need to crack few open n smell em.!!
My point to you Boyan was others are using them without issues so maybe given your having trouble with several it might be something your doing or Not doing that's causing your troubles. Or something around you.?
The fact you have fitted this controller and appears to be working ok out the box doesn't mean it won't show other issues or is masking the issue which will appear at later date.? . . . Like 8hrs into 10hr job so to me it's still too early to call. Thou agree it's good start.
However there are many potential pot holes it could fall down on like Canned cycles etc, long cycle times etc.
Lack of memory is also another issue. Even the higher spec controller is memory limited. 32Mb or even 64mb isn't enough for Large 3D programs and will require DNC to drip feed the code. For some 32Mb may seem plenty but I can tell you some the people I help have 3d files in the Gb's. Pauses or temp locks while dripping code, even if position is not lost, is problem on 3D surface because it leaves mark which wreck the job or at best cause extra work hand finishing.
Dripping from USB isn't always reliable and RS232 just defeats the point of stand alone Controller. All these things have to be tested and influence the final outcome.!! . . . . Unfortunately again we are back to Cracking open the Good or Bad Egg.? . . . Could smell sweet or Stink like John's week old under crackers. . :encouragement:
Soon I'll have the 4 axis 1000Mdc to play with and I'll report how it stinks.? And NO I'm not stiffing John's under crackers to compare . .:stupid:
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Re: DDSCV1.1 3 and 4 axis offline motion controller
Dean,
I absolutely agree with you. Sometimes i have/had the tendency to over excite from happiness how i am cheating destiny but now i am taking great care this not to happen when i am evaluating sth objectively.
So there was a moment with the Pokeys, when i thought, hmm, cheap, multi functional and well tested for a month. This must be it. But the first job when i had to do 500 pieces, i found that every 8-10th piece it makes a mistake and f%%ks the work. Which errors cost me in money exactly what this little board cost me.
So to say a controller works properly, time is needed to do all scenarios. premature conclusions as you say are not good.
Why did you choose the 1000 board for the test? I am looking at many boards now and just making a spreadsheet , because i am a little baffled what are the differences. I read some manuals and at the moment am between the 1000 board you choose and the 235 or the 990 / another manufacturer.
Meanwhile i am officially searching for the manufacturer of the DDCSV .if sb knows sth., PM me.Web and emails from manual does not work. Also searching for latest software. If sb knows from where to download it, please a link. I tried some chines sites, but links not working.
If i continue to be happy with the board, next step is find the supplier, buy in quantity and start selling in EU,offering support, with possible rewriting or just adding details to manual, and one good day even correcting, customising and upgrading the firmware to suit better our needs. I already have some ideas.
I would like to do also with one of the more expensive boards. I am already discussing with manufacturers some details. These recent problems with various boards, lead me to believe i could offer in EU market 1 cheap, one middle priced and one lathe controller, support for them, and as i said, with the earnings, even customise them for the better. I know nothing for lathe, but will start at the moment with the other 2.
I would like to share that now i have a very funny feeling when i go to workshop, touch the mouse and move it, waiting for the screen to wake up. Then i realize that -no, no more PC. And I just push the start button on the enclosure and go out without looking back.
Luckily i have about 500 pieces from wood to cut from now on, so it will be quite a serious test. Also have to design some large 3d job and see what will happen. Does the 3d job make the largest file or what?
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Re: DDSCV1.1 3 and 4 axis offline motion controller
Quote:
Originally Posted by
JAZZCNC
Lack of memory is also another issue. Even the higher spec controller is memory limited. 32Mb or even 64mb isn't enough for Large 3D programs and will require DNC to drip feed the code. For some 32Mb may seem plenty but I can tell you some the people I help have 3d files in the Gb's. Pauses or temp locks while dripping code, even if position is not lost, is problem on 3D surface because it leaves mark which wreck the job or at best cause extra work hand finishing.
Dripping from USB isn't always reliable and RS232 just defeats the point of stand alone Controller. All these things have to be tested and influence the final outcome.!! . . . . Unfortunately again we are back to Cracking open the Good or Bad Egg.? . . . Could smell sweet or Stink like John's week old under crackers. . :encouragement:
I start to feel after reading a coupler of control manuals that its important what speed USB pen drive or card is fitted there, hence they sell the controller with certain USB card .
What you make of that / that's the 1000 series controller/:
l Be able to process up to 1000 blocks of program per second, which makes the high-speed & mini-line cutting available.
l Equipped with U-disk port through which CNC systems provide the following functions: store and recover systems’ software and machining data, perform DNC machining by executing a program in U-disks.
U disc must be USB disc/ In Chinglish/
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Re: DDSCV1.1 3 and 4 axis offline motion controller
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Boyan Silyavski
I start to feel after reading a coupler of control manuals that its important what speed USB pen drive or card is fitted there, hence they sell the controller with certain USB card .
What you make of that / that's the 1000 series controller/:
l Be able to process up to 1000 blocks of program per second, which makes the high-speed & mini-line cutting available.
l Equipped with U-disk port through which CNC systems provide the following functions: store and recover systems’ software and machining data, perform DNC machining by executing a program in U-disks.
U disc must be USB disc/ In Chinglish/
Boyan I never assume anything.! . . . More important I take what is written with pinch of salt, esp if written by the Chinese.! Which is why I have box full of cards etc.
When I get hold of the controller and fitted to working machine I'll give report back.
To answer your question from before the reason for the 1000 series was because I asked for controller best suited to Router and this was recommended.
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1 Attachment(s)
Re: DDSCV1.1 3 and 4 axis offline motion controller
Hi folks,
Today i managed to make a short video of very interesting combination. DIY CNC +ESTL CAM trochoidal path + HSMAdvisor + DDSCV1.1 motion controller .
Mind me that it's first the time ever i use trochoidal toolpath, am testing the vacuum fixture and the board at the same time. So i was a bit afraid and limited the plunge rate, so i could react, cause i had the camera at my left hand. Thats why at the moment of entering the program i was trying to make sure i do not make a mistake.
All was perfectly calculated by HSMAdviser and executed by ETSL Cam. Thumbs up to the makers of these 2 programs. Look at that nice chips. So CAM +motion control here together cost less than 200 euro. At the moment ESTL cam starts showing properly the toolpaths as a list - as any normal program, I will be extremely happy to say:" Why pay more for Vectric?" . Even so its an excellent program. If only for the V carving and the Trochoidal toolpaths.
So i am more than happy. Freud 2 flute 19mm bit, 11mm depth pocket, then full depth 19mm profile . Both at 16000mm/min feed 5.8% or 27.8% degrees HSM width of cut
Attachment 19267
I was really excited to see the machine move and cut so smoothly at 16000mm/min, i dont know if you will get to feel it from the video, but it was super smooth. Mass of gantry is around 200kg!
OK. here is the video. I show how the board copes with probing also. Lower the volume and enjoy, when you feel bored from watching the pocketing, at min 7:15 start the slotting at full depth:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6red66CDLxo
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Re: DDSCV1.1 3 and 4 axis offline motion controller
That looks very good Boyan.Must admit I have been looking at some of the videos from ESTL Cam.
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Re: DDSCV1.1 3 and 4 axis offline motion controller
I switched from cambam to estlcam and for what I do its brilliant.
Sent from my HUAWEI VNS-L31 using Tapatalk
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Re: DDSCV1.1 3 and 4 axis offline motion controller
Quote:
UCCNC next
Again hardly any information other than a video of threading with a felt tipped pan. The hardware manual is 21 pages long 19 of which tell you how to connect it up to the ethernet port, [ is it THAT hard ? and if it is WHY ? ]
I'm moving from Mach3 to UCCNC for my next router, and just got my UC300ETH the other day. Connecting to the ethernet was very simple. Just go into the adaptor settings on the PC, and enter the UC300 address (10.10.10.10) and subnet. That was all I had to do to connect.
TP from the Mach3 forum is pushing CNC Drive to bring UCCNC to be comparable to Mach3 feature wise. It's already close, and getting better with each release.
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Re: DDSCV1.1 3 and 4 axis offline motion controller
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Ger21
I'm moving from Mach3 to UCCNC for my next router, and just got my UC300ETH the other day. Connecting to the ethernet was very simple. Just go into the adaptor settings on the PC, and enter the UC300 address (10.10.10.10) and subnet. That was all I had to do to connect.
TP from the Mach3 forum is pushing CNC Drive to bring UCCNC to be comparable to Mach3 feature wise. It's already close, and getting better with each release.
What breakout board with it? Their own or sth 24VDC?
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Re: DDSCV1.1 3 and 4 axis offline motion controller
I've got the UC300 in an M44 motherboard from CNC4PC, and I'll be using their C62 breakout board which works with 24V inputs. If needed I can add an additional 24V input and output board (M27/M28 I think).
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Re: DDSCV1.1 3 and 4 axis offline motion controller
What is the cost of that lot ?
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Re: DDSCV1.1 3 and 4 axis offline motion controller
The UC300, M44 and C62 is about $370 US. The other two boards are an additional $40 each.
The UCCNC license was free with an introductory offer on the UC300ETH until Oct 15, or the first batch runs out.
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Re: DDSCV1.1 3 and 4 axis offline motion controller
Quote:
Originally Posted by
John S
Interesting.
When you lit it up did it have Rattm motor logo or the Digital Dream? I some how doubt that it's in fact an upgrade. More of a copy or rebranded. John,please take photos, you know how interest i am in that controller. And by the way many more people, as i constantly answer email about the youtube video.
I think my agent have found the original manufacturer. According to her and another agent who did the same job, this is sth like a cooperation between 3 separate people or sth. So truth be told i could not achieve a great price from them, even after a week of juggling back and forth and pressing them with serious quantities quote. So for now best option is 160 euro from China. And i must say it - this is really a great price for what is offered here.
Dean, you can criticise me if you want, but you can not persuade me not to say it "officially" : " This is the best bang for the buck from the time of introducing the water cooled spindle, so i highly recommend it" . Even if it breaks after an year, even if there is no support or no software adjustment to our desires.
Anyway, as i said in the other thread is that the controller dealt without a problem with 280MB file, 10 000 000 line file. Plus it reads it from the USB even if the more expensive offline controllers still can not do that and have limit of memory and so of the file size as Dean pointed. It can home well, then fine home second time or even 5th time. Its good soft limit to be disabled, when homing as sometimes it will cause a problem if you homing speed is set high, it will bypass sensor and soft limits will stop the homing procedure.
The only glitch i encountered was using cheap pen drive USB memory stick, every 15 min it will skip a step or 2. So use the original USB or some original USB for avoiding troubles. My advise is to use micro SD to USB adaopter, test the SD card on modern phone with 4k video, if it works, it will work on the controller also. Or buy from reputable seller.
PS. Just to clear things up. I make no profit of that controller and may be will not make any in the near future. I just like it especially for the reason that it puts to shame almost everything in the mach3+BOB+PC combo. I was negotiating buying a batch of controllers with the idea of selling them in EU. Making some cash meanwhile bringing them here in EU so no taxes was not the main reason behind this.
The main reason was that i wanted to make them more popular and by maintaining contact with manufacturer make the controller better suited to our needs and making a real well written manual. I see at least a couple of things that can and must be changed by simple re programming so the controller fits better to the needs of the community. Unfortunately at the moment i am not very tempted to continue this line as the makers of the controller are hard to reach and to deal with, the wholesale price of the controller is ridiculously near the 1 piece price and they are hiding their programmer and simply said they don't care about making it better. Until i can get a conversation with the programmer, i don't care much about that controller
Even so, as i said it's a very good controller.
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Re: DDSCV1.1 3 and 4 axis offline motion controller
Boyan,
Will do but be either late tomorrow or Monday as dog and house sitting and the controller is at the other place.
I just want these simple controllers to power first a couple of simple 3/4 axis desktop machines that would have gone onto Mach3 with a parallel port or USB card, - very simple.
Secondly to convert 15 older Denfords and a couple of Boxford CNC training machines onto new controllers and electronics. If I had offered PC's and Mach they would not have accepted the job.
I do also have one of the more expensive NEW990TD-b controllers which is earmarked for an Orac lathe conversion for me personally. We brought two into the country and one is already up and running on another Orac as shown in earlier video's.
The reason for this one is it's the only controller that can thread out of the box.
Forget Mach 3 and Mach 4 and CS Labs. Their controller can thread with Mach3 after a fashion but it's so slow and clunky. When asked about threading with Mach 4 they were totally non committal and said it it did get ported to Mach 4 it would probably work the same as in Mach 3. Plus it's expensive. No expense shouldn't be the be all and end all if it works but for threading it doesn't.
I know we all have different goals. Dean wants high speed, large files for 3D work on routers, Me ? I want simple 3/4 axis on desktop mills and one lathe. High speed, large files do not come in my remit so we do have different goals.
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Re: DDSCV1.1 3 and 4 axis offline motion controller
Quote:
Originally Posted by
John S
I know we all have different goals. Dean wants high speed, large files for 3D work on routers, Me ? I want simple 3/4 axis on desktop mills and one lathe. High speed, large files do not come in my remit so we do have different goals.
My goal is also simple:
Push the button, leave the machine work and and i watch TV or read a book meanwhile. Electricity stops? Push the button and continue. No PC, no Windows, no special x32 editions so LPT works, no special LPT cables and special PCI cards, no drivers, no special Mach tricks, no strange behaviour, no hidden costs... So in a way i put reliability first of all.
Thanks for answering and helping here with information.
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Re: DDSCV1.1 3 and 4 axis offline motion controller
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Boyan Silyavski
Dean, you can criticise me if you want, but you can not persuade me not to say it "officially" : " This is the best bang for the buck from the time of introducing the water cooled spindle, so i highly recommend it" . Even if it breaks after an year, even if there is no support or no software adjustment to our desires.
Boyan rest assured I certainly would criticise you if felt the need but I don't. You are doing a good job of showing the controller.
However I do have my concerns and IMO you or anyone else known to me have not tested these for extended periods or stressed them enough to be highly recommending and calling them better than other setups.
Like John says we all all have different needs and wants.?
For instance I cannot say to my customers that this controller is the dogs danglers, however I'm not exactly sure how long it will last.? Could be hours could be years who knows.??
Oh and if the USB stick gets lost it may or maynot work with the replacement you buy. . . . Oh ye and if there any glitches in the software well I'm afraid it's tuff luck because we can't update it. Infact we have no clue to who to ask for help.!!
Thou on the good side it's cheap as chips.!! . . . Provided it doesn't break in first year. In which case I'll have to stand this anyway because the chinese warrenty is much use chocolate fireguard.
CUSTOMER: . . What about the cost of down time.? . . .Oh well I'm afraid that's the price you pay with cheap as chips controller.!
Now before you say this is hobby controller and not for professional machine you should consider that you have been comparing with and calling the high price of other controllers like CSLabs.!! . . There's reason they are Higher priced.?
They are high quality units which don't fail without good reason.
They can be repaired or replaced under warrenty.
They do have support and backup.
They have Firmware updates and we can talk to the programmers if required.
Now get this.! . . .The majority of my customers or people I help are not Professional high earning business's.
They are small cottage industry man or lass's in sheds who are hard working types of people that cannot afford to be fixing or replacing controllers 13mths after buying.
Even at this lower slower level of business Down time is problem. They cannot afford to wait 2-3wks for replacement from china then pay me to travel several hundred miles to replace. Even if I kept replacements, which I would and do even with Cslabs, there is still certain amount of down time which at best could be 1 -3 days if I'm not busy.(Ahh I wished.!!)
Even the wise Man in shed playing for fun doesn't want expense/down time and hassle that could or will at some stage I'm sure come from them.!! . . . . Which is exactly my point in that they haven't yet been tested enough for reliabilty, functionality or ruggedness. Well certainly not long enough to be called "The Best Bang for Buck" before knowing how long before the "Bang" turns into "Magic smoke".!!
Come back in 2yrs time then tell me it's worked perfectly without any glitches and I'll be impressed. But until this as happened then don't try telling me they are "Best bang for Buck".
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Re: DDSCV1.1 3 and 4 axis offline motion controller
Are these controllers CE marked? Can't see any mention of it on the listing, or a CE mark on any of the pictures.
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Re: DDSCV1.1 3 and 4 axis offline motion controller
Quote:
Originally Posted by
bikepete
Are these controllers CE marked? Can't see any mention of it on the listing, or a CE mark on any of the pictures.
CE marking is a declaration of conformity only. Nothing more
Quote:
CE marking
The letters ‘CE’ appear on many products traded on the extended Single Market in the European Economic Area (EEA). They signify that products sold in the EEA have been assessed to meet high safety, health, and environmental protection requirements. When you buy a new phone, a teddy bear, or a TV within the EEA, you can find the CE mark on them. CE marking also supports fair competition by holding all companies accountable to the same rules.
By affixing the CE marking to a product, a manufacturer declares that the product meets all the legal requirements for CE marking and can be sold throughout the EEA. This also applies to products made in other countries that are sold in the EEA.
There are two main benefits CE marking brings to businesses and consumers within the EEA:
- Businesses know that products bearing the CE marking can be traded in the EEA without restrictions.
- Consumers enjoy the same level of health, safety, and environmental protection throughout the entire EEA.
CE marking is a part of the EU’s harmonisation legislation, which is mainly managed by Directorate-General for Internal market, Industry, Entrepreneurship and SMEs. The CE marking for Restriction of Hazardous Substances is managed by Directorate-General for Environment. Comprehensive guidance on the implementation of EU product rules can be found in the so-called Blue Guide.
This website provides information for manufacturers, importers and distributors on their responsibilities when placing a product on the EEA market. It also informs consumers about the rights and benefits that CE marking brings them.
If you’re looking for information on CE marking in your country, contact the Enterprise Europe Network or check the list of contact points in the EEA.
How to reproduce the CE mark
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https://ec.europa.eu/growth/sites/gr...es/ce-mark.gif
Download image files:
IMPORTANT NOTE:
Not all products must have CE marking. It is compulsory only for most of the products covered by the New Approach Directives. It is forbidden to affix CE marking to other products.
Please note that a CE marking does not indicate that a product have been approved as safe by the EU or by another authority. It does not indicate the origin of a product either.
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Re: DDSCV1.1 3 and 4 axis offline motion controller
Also not a lawyer although most on the internet are BUT these could fall into the low voltage directive and be exempt ?
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Re: DDSCV1.1 3 and 4 axis offline motion controller
I've had some dealings with CE marking (via a completely different industry). As has been said it involves a declaration of conformity issued by the manuf or importer, but that really needs to be backed by technical documentation in case of challenge (the possibility is remote that this would occur, sure...).
For sale within China there's clearly no need for any CE marking.
But if the controller had been developed with the intention of export to EU markets, then the manufacturer would likely have designed it with that in mind (e.g. using lead free solder) and conducted the relevant tests (e.g. EMC) etc. to ensure that it will comply with the relevant EU directives.
An importer (other than for personal use) can self-certify the DoC as you say (and must also place a CE mark on the product before placing it on the market in the EU), but they should have sound grounds for stating it complies with the relevant directives, and would need evidence of this compliance if ever challenged by the authorities.
(Not an expert) but I think the controller in question falls under:
- EMC Directive (electromagnetic interference)
- RoHS (covers things like lead in solder)
Just possibly the Machinery Directive if it controls safety logic e.g. e-stops.
Also presumably the General Product Safety Directive if selling to end users. Not sure if that applies to B2B sales.
I don't think it's affected by the Low Voltage Directive as despite the name that's for 50V AC or 75V DC upwards.
For enthusiast importers supplying it for DIY shed use all this may not matter much, given it's a pretty low risk sort of item all in all.
But if these were to be imported commercially by e.g. one of the main model engineering suppliers, they'd probably want to make sure it was all above board. And if the manufacturer can't provide the necessary evidence/assurances, that could prevent such suppliers taking it on. Which might keep sales numbers down and reduce the manufacturer's incentive to improve it...
Re the larger £400ish jobbies - not looked too hard but didn't see anything on the web pages saying they are CE-ready & EMC/RoHS compliant either.
None of this will stop me getting one (£140 job initially) when my machine eventually gets finished enough to be ready for it - am just waiting until the last possible moment before ordering to ensure I get the latest version.
Cheers
Pete
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Re: DDSCV1.1 3 and 4 axis offline motion controller
Dean is correct up to a point in that these controllers are still a work in progress and until they have some time under their belt there will be a question mark over them.
This is the DDSCV controller I am talking about.
This doesn't apply to the higher end one as GSK has been making these for about 8 odd years and they power the majority of Chinese CNC's used in China to product what we buy in the west and as such are proven.
Now to muddy the waters further and this is the cheaper DSCV controller.
Modern electronics are quite good these days. Take the average DRO reader. I have had DRO's for well over 20 years, had the odd scale go down mainly due to crap and age but NEVER had a read head go down and how many out there. ?
They are powered by an ARM processor which is what is in the majority of mobile phones which have been made in the billions. In fact Intel and AMD have announced that this last batch of processors for PC's and laptops will be the last batch as both are moving over onto ARM processors as better and more powerful.
From someone far more knowledgeable than me who has been inside one they are running Debian as an operating system so basically it Linux at the core of this and being open sourced means it can be hacked or modified.
Whilst playing around with this Joules managed to wipe the operating system but as he'd backed the files up previously he was able to restore the OS. So that isn't the problem that Dean feels it is.
As regards reliability I feel that isn't the problem that Dean feels it is. I am in exactly the same boat in the mill conversions I do but so far all my problems have been computer related, a few mach related but by far the most problems have been with third party controllers and breakout boards etc.
Two trips to Hull to replace two blown up System 3 boards on separate occasions plus two drivers that took took out.
Two trips to Darlington to replace Spindle 3 boards that didn't work right.
One trip to Bristol for another breakout board problem and other trips for roughly the same problems.
TBH I got real fed up of acting as unpaid R&D for certain manufacturers especially when they didn't listen to what the problem was and just ran out the same old "well we have sold 100's and you are the first person " etc, etc, yada, yada.
Like most projects out of those 100, 90 are still on the bench as a work in progress. You test a job, cut sample parts etc, send it out and it doesn't work because one model HP computer cannot generate the charge pump signal.
OK Deans customers are mom and pop operations and can't afford the downtime which I except but in a case such as this when I spec a job out, knowing that drivers are always the weak link once a system is up and working I cost a spare driver into the job and send it out with the job. It's all about piece of mind.
In a case like this and when the Oxford jobs comes off then i will have costed a spare controller into the sum. At the most it's 15 to 20 wires to swap over. Even though about fitting them on plug in headers but 15 v 1 isn't good odds so they are skilled enough to swap one over inside 1/2 hour, no having to send spares or run 200 - 300 miles.
I will have less components into the mix that at the moment when I'm shipping Mach3 with a computer, monitor, keyboard, mouse, breakout board and possibly an external controller.
Will it change overnight ? no it won't but change will come. I am good friends with Art Fenerty who wrote Mach 3, we talk for about an hour every couple of weeks on the phone. I have immense respect for Art and what he can do.
Only last week he said that a problem had come up where W10 couldn't read one of the ocx files required by Mach3 as it was old technology and his concern was that up to W10 would be the end for Mach 3.
Now we all know that older computers will be around for years but it proves that change will have to come about or more problems will surface as all computers are different.
Dean has his concerns and is right to have them whilst he's supplying a service but not everyone can afford Deans services and anything that can simplify setting up the controller side of a CNC will help the hobby.
For me on 3 / 4 axis mill I'm happy to take the chance, not a big outlay, in fact over a PC it's a saving on equipment and licenses and I can always go back if necessary.
On lathe then for me only the NEW / GSK type £400 controller will work as no one has yet to show me anything that can thread correctly with the minimum of setting up and not having to rely on at least two vendors of hardware / software who most of the time don't talk to one another.
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Re: DDSCV1.1 3 and 4 axis offline motion controller
Pete, Very grey area but controllers fall into the exempt area for lead free as they are controlling critical equipment unlike say a washing machine or radio.
However I know what you are saying.
Having had dealing with a few UK main model engineering suppliers I can't see any wanting to carry these units.
For one the sale would be very low and for every sale make in the UK 3 would buy direct from China to escape the markup, taxes and VAT etc so there would be no reason to even look for a supplier in China.
Both Zapp and Arceurotade have stopped selling ball screws as everyone is going direct and it won't end there.
Arc is to stop selling drivers and steppers when the current stock has run out for the same reason.