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  1. #1
    Hi All,

    I need some guidance on electrical safety of products rules. I have made a lighting base for a glass sculpture. It is a sealed LED driver and a 20W LED chip on a heatsink. There is a fuse in the mains side and the mains cable and switch are purchased prebuilt. The cable is with an earth wire and the driver is earthed to a common point on the terminal block, which is connected to an aluminium base plate. I cut the base plate on CNC and there are plenty of ventilation holes, but strategically placed so that it is difficult to reach a mains voltage through them. The sculpture base is either bronze or cast iron and it has the base plate bolted to it. I will have the finished units PAT tested, but I am wondering if there is any other official process I have to go through before they are offered to the public.

    The pictures attached gives you an idea of the bases, but one pic was of a failure of the resin embedding of the glass, so doesn't show the base underneath. The second one was a brief test of the lamp.

    Click image for larger version. 

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    Cheers,
    Rob
    It takes all sorts to make a world, I am just glad I am not one of them.

  2. #2
    If you can poke any household item through a vent hole and get at mains your product liability insurance might not pay out in the event of a child poking a straightened paperclip through a hole.
    Most current products use strategically placed mylar or other physical shielding to make access to mains impossible without making a real effort to cause damage,

    - Nick
    If you will not be swayed by logic or experience simply pick the idea you
    like best, but ask yourself why you sought advice in the first place and,
    for a simple life, perhaps consider not doing so in future

  3. #3
    Ta Nick,

    I will put a 3D printed box round the terminal block. I take your point about product liability insurance.

    Rob
    It takes all sorts to make a world, I am just glad I am not one of them.

  4. Quote Originally Posted by cropwell View Post
    Hi All,

    I need some guidance on electrical safety of products rules. I have made a lighting base for a glass sculpture. It is a sealed LED driver and a 20W LED chip on a heatsink. There is a fuse in the mains side and the mains cable and switch are purchased prebuilt. The cable is with an earth wire and the driver is earthed to a common point on the terminal block, which is connected to an aluminium base plate. I cut the base plate on CNC and there are plenty of ventilation holes, but strategically placed so that it is difficult to reach a mains voltage through them. The sculpture base is either bronze or cast iron and it has the base plate bolted to it. I will have the finished units PAT tested, but I am wondering if there is any other official process I have to go through before they are offered to the public.

    The pictures attached gives you an idea of the bases, but one pic was of a failure of the resin embedding of the glass, so doesn't show the base underneath. The second one was a brief test of the lamp.

    Click image for larger version. 

Name:	e2.jpg 
Views:	112 
Size:	231.4 KB 
ID:	19117Click image for larger version. 

Name:	encoill.jpg 
Views:	109 
Size:	181.5 KB 
ID:	19118

    Cheers,
    Rob
    The answer is yes. If it can be plugged into mains and not fed through a commercially available power supply with low voltage then you should not continue with this idea, unless you can certify the product and know what you are doing, which you obviously don't. Even at low voltage there is a risk for causing fire if the used material is wrong, or you make a design error, so even if it is fed with an approved PSU you can still be liable. The regulations concerning electricity are not just some rules and regulations, but law, so breaking those are pretty serious. If your product can't, or won't be certified to follow the regulations then you are not allowed to sell, and if you do then you are taking huge risks. All those rules and regulations can't be explained in a few words on an Internet forum.

    Now, it is no secret that I am not a UK resident, but I am pretty sure your regulations are just as stringent as ours here in Sweden.

    Good luck.

  5. #5
    It's covered in this -

    https://www.gov.uk/guidance/electric...sponsibilities

    You'll need to read the attachments too for the relevant information, I don't assume that smart people can't read and learn things they don't already know! ;-)

    I'd look at incorporating a thermal fuse into the power feed such that excess temperature (you'll have to research and determine that) will cause power cutoff, also consider crimped tubular terminations for the mains wires at the connector block.

    Regards,
    Nick
    If you will not be swayed by logic or experience simply pick the idea you
    like best, but ask yourself why you sought advice in the first place and,
    for a simple life, perhaps consider not doing so in future

  6. The Following User Says Thank You to magicniner For This Useful Post:


  7. #6
    Quote Originally Posted by magicniner View Post
    I'd look at incorporating a thermal fuse into the power feed such that excess temperature (you'll have to research and determine that) will cause power cutoff, also consider crimped tubular terminations for the mains wires at the connector block.
    Thanks Nick, I will look through the site and see what is relevant to my glassblower friend.

    At the moment, he produces an item http://www.stuartakroydglass.com/new...s/?galAlbum=44 which is a glass sculpture in a solid steel base. His idea was to light it from below with a fairly powerful LED chip. We are at a very early stage in development, with one working prototype. It has to be soak tested to see how the temperature rises on the LED, and to see if the driver is suitable etc.
    We hope to get some to show at a Craft Fair in London in 4 weeks time. This will be to gauge interest in the idea. If it flops - well - so be it. If it shines out then we will go further.

    Nick - thanks for your sensible input, when I have made a few more bases, I will post some pictures of the innards.

    Cheers,

    Rob
    It takes all sorts to make a world, I am just glad I am not one of them.

  8. #7
    Rob Have you thought about a 12V or 24V led and feed it from a commercial power brick CE aproved
    ..Clive

  9. #8
    Quote Originally Posted by Clive S View Post
    Rob Have you thought about a 12V or 24V led and feed it from a commercial power brick CE aproved
    Yes, but couldn't find a suitable one. The driver we are using on out test rig is this one http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/2015292070...%3AMEBIDX%3AIT and it has CE marking and IP65 printed on it (???).
    It takes all sorts to make a world, I am just glad I am not one of them.

  10. #9
    Quote Originally Posted by cropwell View Post
    Yes, but couldn't find a suitable one. The driver we are using on out test rig is this one http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/2015292070...%3AMEBIDX%3AIT and it has CE marking and IP65 printed on it (???).
    Can you buy one that is CE rated?

    This might be a good read: http://www.meanwell.eu/ExclusivePDF/...OVALS-NOTE.pdf
    Last edited by Clive S; 02-09-2016 at 05:32 PM.
    ..Clive

  11. #10
    Rob,
    I didn't make it clear but my reasoning for the thermal fuse is to use one rated above the temperature which the light unit might reach in a very warm room under normal operating conditions such that the power would cut before anything got hot enough to melt or burn,
    Regards,
    Nick
    If you will not be swayed by logic or experience simply pick the idea you
    like best, but ask yourself why you sought advice in the first place and,
    for a simple life, perhaps consider not doing so in future

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