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  1. #21
    Quote Originally Posted by superclarkey View Post
    I didn't say I didn't have the time to build it, but didn't want to start from scratch researching every single aspect l if people can offer help in the right direction.
    Nor did I, I offered the right direction, you missed it.

    Quote Originally Posted by superclarkey View Post
    I know in mechanically terms what is required and I don't know where the best place is to get the parts so was again hoping for advice.
    You should/could have said that's what you wanted, I'm not a mind reader.

    Quote Originally Posted by superclarkey View Post
    there has to be common parts people use or software people thing is the best etc.

    i wanted experienced advice, reading people's blogs where they are learning them selfs also doesn't mean it's the best way of going about things etc, how do I know who is doing it right or wrong? I don't know enough to make an educated desision right now, so means I have to learn everything so that I can form that opinion.
    Yea there is, you can see them repeatedly shown and discussed in the build logs of others, you just have to look, read, then look again, obvious I know.

    I pointed you to it, you missed it.

    Typically people running a build log have done the learning already, have a plan of action and so on. Some of the learning takes place in the other non build log discussions I pointed you to, when they start doing something wrong, experienced advice gets posted to help them in the right direction.

    Bummer, I guess your never going to be in a postion to form that opinion then, what with you not having the time to research everything, so you can learn everything.

    Quote Originally Posted by superclarkey View Post
    i was pointed to this forum and maybe I expected that I would be offered some advice, but being told to basically go do a "search" or "buy one new" wasn't what I needed to hear lol (kinda obvious :-p )
    You got what you expected, the problem was in your request, it was vague, contradictory, confused. As such I gave you what I could based on what you gave me, sorry it wasn't what you wanted to hear but the advice is there, you missed it.

    Quote Originally Posted by superclarkey View Post
    thanks anyways, i won't give up on this just looks like I'll have to do it the hard way which I was trying to avoid :-)
    Np, good you shouldn't give up, it can be fun and rewarding but like I said, requires investment.

    Quote Originally Posted by superclarkey View Post
    I asked for advice not a hug lol its a typical non helpful forum response "google it" instead of actually helping, I have already done allot of the ground work just wanted to know best places to look for stuff, lol, even purchased the hypertherm 45.

    i help people each day, and give allot of my own person time to help people, i try and educate and give sound advice, that's what I joined a forum like this for, I didn't realise I had to work it all out first then ask about it hehe

    anyways sorry I posted asking, the forum that sent me he was so helpful and advice was great, so I'll get my coat :-)
    How rude! and even more full of confusion then your first post, like i said above, you got out, what you put in, if "google it" is the definition you would put on what I offered you as advice, then you wont be getting any more help from me! Try looking deeper than just the words I used.

    Yea so do I, so do allot of us here, what do you want a hug?, your lucky you even got a reply from me given my life at the moment and here you are talking about my reply like you even know me and that others cant read it for themselves, who do you think you are rubbishing my effort like that.

    So much for "greatly appreciated".

    If you've done all the so called groundwork, what advice exactly is it your looking for? Ohh wait you said, you just need purchasing advice, DOH! if only your first post had said that to start with!!!

    Quote Originally Posted by njhussey View Post
    I cant remember your exact wording of your post here but to me it smacked of tell me what to buy and where because I cant be bothered to do any research.
    Not a single mention of buying or purchasing in it Neil, if only it had of been that clear.

    Quote Originally Posted by superclarkey View Post
    your right though I should have outlined how much I already knew and that I wasn't looking for the basics etc, just looking to start buying the bits and what to buy
    I cant understand why you didn't if that's all you needed, would have been so much easier.

    Quote Originally Posted by superclarkey View Post
    when you are not helped with constructive information
    I hope you plasma right through the main structure of the machine and it ends up as a pile of sections on the floor

    .Me
    Last edited by Lee Roberts; 19-09-2016 at 07:51 PM. Reason: i heart cake
    .Me

  2. #22
    Quote Originally Posted by SuperClarkeyLee Roberts View Post
    I would like to build a cnc plasma table but I don't have the time to sit in front of the computer for hours to research everything, so if you guys can help pointme in the right direction that would help save me allot of time :-)
    I went through this. I went to cnczone and noticed that everyone made the same mistakes. Have they changed?
    They weld up enormous constructs in steel, find the tool does not fly in the way they expected then try and fix it with THC.
    The torch Z axis is invariably driven by an enormous stepper motor because stepper motors seem to come in packs of 3 and they cannot see any other way to do pierce and cut height. The THC then has to convert analogue to digital so everything becomes tortuously complicated controlling stepper coil current when all the cables are next to a plasma arc.
    Apparently the only possible plasma unit is the Hypertherm because it has a very nice head for cutting thin stuff. Being Americans they cannot possibly buy a matching low power tool it has to cut 2" armour plate or nothing.
    Mostly they will cut plates about 1 to 2 feet across but they make huge water tables and pump tons of polluted water because they can.
    I nearly overcame all this, but at the last moment I discovered that the 5M pitch pulleys I had based it around had enormous backlash. I got disheartened after all that work,it got put on a back burner and is still waiting.
    Anyway, there are a few snags you might want to think about, assuming you are still here

  3. #23
    I'm still here, thanks for the advice :-)

    i dont want to build anything over kill, seems pointless when I see the most important factor being control and precision, it's not driving any force so I fail to see why stepper motors are the choice for so many plasma tables when they draw so much current regardless of work done, closed loop servo seems the way to go and I don't think they need to be very big.

    be interested to know if people run servos direct drive or step them down with ratio to give more accuracy, I would like to reduce it to so that I have no backlash in the drive.

    is there a go to liner rail with screw drive already built in for the X and y?

    That was a question i wanted to know, why can you not pump the water down the drain?

    And yes guys take it on board I pissed you all off, sorry :-)

  4. #24
    JAZZCNC's Avatar
    Lives in wakefield, United Kingdom. Last Activity: 15 Hours Ago Forum Superstar, has done so much to help others, they deserve a medal. Has been a member for 5-6 years. Has a total post count of 5,720. Received thanks 892 times, giving thanks to others 35 times.
    Quote Originally Posted by superclarkey View Post
    Are you saying you don't want a slice of the im sorry cake I'm baking?
    Nope sorry I'm not bought that cheaply, now throw in a few Guiness and I might be persuaded to join you.!! . . . I'll Still tell you F@& All like. .

  5. #25
    You are worrying about all the wrong things. Maybe you have to build the plasma table in your head and get it out of the way first.

    The water is polluted by the green guck you put in it to stop the bed slats from rusting.

  6. #26
    Quote Originally Posted by superclarkey View Post
    I'm still here, thanks for the advice :-)

    i dont want to build anything over kill, seems pointless when I see the most important factor being control and precision, it's not driving any force so I fail to see why stepper motors are the choice for so many plasma tables when they draw so much current regardless of work done, closed loop servo seems the way to go and I don't think they need to be very big.

    be interested to know if people run servos direct drive or step them down with ratio to give more accuracy, I would like to reduce it to so that I have no backlash in the drive.

    is there a go to liner rail with screw drive already built in for the X and y?

    That was a question i wanted to know, why can you not pump the water down the drain?

    And yes guys take it on board I pissed you all off, sorry :-)


    OK. if you are serious from now on, you will be helped.

    Lets start from the beginning:

    -How big you will like the plasma table to be? working area
    -Z travel?
    -do you plan to cut square tubes? Round tubes? if yes how long?
    -aluminum , welded steel, mixture or aluminum profile structure?
    -only dedicated plasma machine or you will try to do other stuff also?



    Some answers:

    -Hiwin 20 rails is best, same price as 15 size but easier to mount and overall engineer. There is one other rail i like better but is more rare- MGW Hiwin, though its ideal if you use only one rail on Z and X. Which you could do with the HGR also

    -1605 ball screw for Z, 1610 for X. Nope, better design them yourself and order them from China. later we will point you from where. Y? still not clear until you say what length will be your longest axis. If you want to cut 2500mm long - rotating ball screw nut both sides is best
    So yes, if you dont go bigger than 2500mm on one axis it could be all ball screw machine which simply put is much better than any other option.


    -dedicated THC is a must, i dont know whats new this year, but last year Neuron was best here in EU. It controls directly your Z axis and has all the necessary functions, like pause at corners and so on. I have one but not the time to make the plasma table. Avoid cheap THC which are not dedicated/ can not control axis directly/

    -even cheap servos with 2500 encoders have enough resolution at 1:1 at one revolution 1610 screw will move 10mm so 2500/10=250 ppr so 1mm/250=0.004mm resolution at speeds 30m/min, which is really fast
    depends on design probably 200W or 400W servos for the machine. I will point you from where to buy cheapest in internet.

    - I don't like water bed machines. Too much hassle if not a heavy production . When i make my plasma cutter it will be air, sucked and vented into the table

    Most importantly- don't rush buying until you have completed the design. If you are lazy or don't have time to design, search for designs to buy, then show us so we could help you choose. I do also bespoke designs these days. Post a job request in relevant forum section . Dean and maybe others make custom machines.


    So as you see, there are options. I for once was very busy today and just sat down to respond you but was amazed at the development of your thread. So lets take life easy and see what we can do here.


    If machine is meant small size, there are other options. Thats why you were pointed to read build logs. There are modular designs with elements from china, that are quite suitable for 1x1m machine.


    Hope that helps
    project 1 , 2,Dust Shoe ...

  7. The Following User Says Thank You to Boyan Silyavski For This Useful Post:


  8. #27
    And yes guys take it on board I pissed you all off, sorry :-)
    Ok that takes guts its a bit like letting the magic smoke out of the drives.

    Not sure what you mean by high precision when talking about a plasma. What sort of precision are you looking for.
    Steppers are very easy to setup unlike servos and are cheaper and will also provide more than enough
    precision
    for a router or plasma.
    How about starting a build log to keep all the questions in one place and start with (if possible) some cad drawings so as the forum can see what you are trying to build.
    ..Clive

  9. #28
    JAZZCNC's Avatar
    Lives in wakefield, United Kingdom. Last Activity: 15 Hours Ago Forum Superstar, has done so much to help others, they deserve a medal. Has been a member for 5-6 years. Has a total post count of 5,720. Received thanks 892 times, giving thanks to others 35 times.
    Quote Originally Posted by Boyan Silyavski View Post
    -1605 ball screw for Z, 1610 for X. Nope, better design them yourself and order them from China. later we will point you from where. Y? still not clear until you say what length will be your longest axis. If you want to cut 2500mm long - rotating ball screw nut both sides is best
    So yes, if you dont go bigger than 2500mm on one axis it could be all ball screw machine which simply put is much better than any other option.
    Did you miss the word PLASMA.!! . . . .Ballscrews with rotating nuts.???????????????????????

  10. #29
    Quote Originally Posted by JAZZCNC View Post
    Did you miss the word PLASMA.!! . . . .Ballscrews with rotating nuts.???????????????????????
    I did not. what do you suggest for 4x8 table? belts or RP? Same price. So why not ball screws?

    That's why i asked him what length. Did you check recently prices for *belts and pulleys* or *RP+pulleys and belts* . Exactly same as for ball screws. Until we don't know what exactly he intends to use the machine for it irrelevant to discuss further.


    I personally say for Z belt, for X ball screw and for Y -RP, but that will confuse him and others who read further. There are many ways to make a plasma machine. Did i tell you that the big commercial plasmas use Ballscrew on all and RP on Y, and mind that - 2 motors with brushes on each side of gantry, so they brush rails for dust not to damage Hiwin seals
    project 1 , 2,Dust Shoe ...

  11. #30
    JAZZCNC's Avatar
    Lives in wakefield, United Kingdom. Last Activity: 15 Hours Ago Forum Superstar, has done so much to help others, they deserve a medal. Has been a member for 5-6 years. Has a total post count of 5,720. Received thanks 892 times, giving thanks to others 35 times.
    Boyan we know exactly the use it's in the title "PLASMA TABLE". Also have you seen the crap that comes off plasma machine.? What do you think that will do to ballnut rotating at high speeds along static rod effectively covered in grinding paste.???

    You'll be hard pushed to find many commercial plasma cutters using ballscrews other than on Z axis. 99% will be helical R&P with more than enough resolution and easily achieve high feeds without stressing anything.!

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