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  1. #11
    Quote Originally Posted by Neale View Post
    I managed to find a ground glass trivet in a local discount hardware place which gives very good adhesion with no more effort than the occasional wipe with acetone.
    I keep wondering about frosting it with a waft of hydrofluoric acid, trouble is HF really does everything H&S warns you about for everything else. It really does kill you and all the hospital can do is make you a cup of tea and contact your next of kin. Back in my youth the chemistry books told you how to frost glass by dissolving old teeth

  2. #12
    Dont know, am i lucky or what? had no idea whatsoever before 1 month , decided a 3d printer before 2 weeks, 3-4 days to learn software and from one week ago i am non stop printing on my friends Legio / a Spanish knockoff of Prusa 3/

    He told me he needs hours if at all to level the bed and that the machine is super flimsy/ it is/ . Last week he gave me the machine. I did not know how to operate it at all.

    First thing i tightened properly the belts. Took from garage the hot glue gun and a precision square. Hot glued all that i did not like / ALL / . Hot glued machine to a kitchen board/ not best but i am going to weld a base/ . Hot glued the belt ends to the belt plates. As i said -all.

    Then leveled the bloody bed for 2 min and it would have been faster if people were aware that 3 screws leveling is easier than 4 screws leveling.

    Did some prints and 1 print f%%%d up cause unglued from bed. So i sat down infront of google and after 10 min i knew the magic. Went to garage, took a bottle of C200/ white wood glue. diluted it 1:1 in a small hermetic jar and tapping gently a sponge primed the glass bed. From then on glues like a ...you know the saying. Only thing is i have to wait 5 min for the bed to cool a bit from the 55C i print. Then it comes off easily. I see the hotend or the hotend extruder combo is not perfect, but i print always from then with rafts and skirt so no problem at all with the crappy breathing bed.

    I printed PLA and from a couple of days only pla 3d850 which i intend to be the main material as its stronger than ABS when cured, very detailed prints, and hi temp resistant when cured. Its Ingeo but made in Spain so at 19euro per kg is a no brainer that i master it.

    The only problem till now was to master the material which i did in a day, had problems and it made me learn Simplify3D up and down , at the end it was bloody material being 1.69mm thick, but when logic was implemented it took me only 2 hours to find the bug.



    What i am saying is PVA glue is the way. Rafts also. No need to hurry and try to save 5 min or 0.05 cents of material. No need for special stuff. Or to use my wifes hair spray.



    Ok, i dont know if you guys are aware but on a properly designed DIY CNC when head hits the table or gantry hits the end or similar, if steppers are used the machine just stops and thats it. Plus if you use digital drives most probably stall detection will happen and alarm signal will stop the machine.

    So if the printer is properly designed i dont see what will happen apart from stopping.

    I am still not there and will ook into that but: Arent these printers using some digital drivers with stall detection?????

    I am much more worried why these toys dont use some kind of smoke detection or fire prevention??


    Anyway, i moved further with the design. Managed to make the gantry very tight vertically, same with the hotend. Plus at the end i decided how what to do with the X motor, which will go in the clearance between the gantry sides and the table, which means keeping the structure height etremely low. That combined with the shallow depth will make it a real table top machine. Not some ugly cube. At the moment stands wide 620mm and high 370mm. I am still playing with the idea if i need or not the top and bottom cross bars, look last picture where removed. Looks more simple and better to the eye, I will decide that later . Their main idea was so if i sell the machine to sb all linear elements to be premounted here by me, Guess i have to receive the 20x20 profile and see how it will go. Their other function is if you fit servo drives and do crazy speeds so the machine to wobble. Though it wouldn't if side and top panels are fitted


    Another thing that bugs me is the cable chain. Yesterday printed some cable chains and they are not properly designed for printing even if they tell so. I will check what price are Chines, design proper one or use what they use on the Original Prusa. Some kind of cable tie organizer???


    have also started printing the parts and well, i am quite happy with the result. Till now had to redesign only one of the, All else is indestructible by hand. Which is how i like it to be strong. The hotend plastics are downloaded from internet. Just printing them now, cause i think i will have to redesign them to be stronger and ventilator adjustable somehow up and down in case i switch to the Volcano heater



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    Last edited by Boyan Silyavski; 05-12-2016 at 04:46 PM.
    project 1 , 2, Dust Shoe ...

  3. #13
    Neale's Avatar
    Lives in Plymouth, United Kingdom. Last Activity: 6 Hours Ago Has been a member for 5-6 years. Has a total post count of 1,157. Received thanks 209 times, giving thanks to others 5 times.
    Quote Originally Posted by Robin Hewitt View Post
    I keep wondering about frosting it with a waft of hydrofluoric acid, trouble is HF really does everything H&S warns you about for everything else. It really does kill you and all the hospital can do is make you a cup of tea and contact your next of kin. Back in my youth the chemistry books told you how to frost glass by dissolving old teeth
    I remember the school chemistry book with a picture of a hand that had been dipped in HF. I treated the bottle of HF with care after that; doubt if it would be allowed within miles of a school these days!

    A friend of mind is a sculptor/artist working with glass and she tells me that sandblasting is the way to go. Certainly with PLA, it works well, and as Boyan says with PVA glue, you need to let the glass cool for some time before the print comes free. I typically print with a bed temp of 60C, but of course that depends on how accurate the bed temp measurement is. At least it's a lot less critical than hot-end temp.

  4. #14
    Quote Originally Posted by Robin Hewitt View Post
    I used to use cheap ebay filament but now only the best will do, and small reels because you only wind up throwing the excess the moment it has sucked enough moisture out of the air. Pop fizz
    I store filament in airtight clear plastic paint buckets with a rechargeable portable dehumidifier and a cheap digital hygrometer. It won't miraculously make poor quality filament good but it keeps it dry enough to use the whole reel for very little expense.

  5. #15
    Quote Originally Posted by Boyan Silyavski View Post
    He told me he needs hours if at all to level the bed and that the machine is super flimsy/ it is/ .
    I bought the UP! Plus because it has a robust folded steel base and ball slides throughout. If it accidentally stands on something it rocks, it does not deform. Minimal faffing about.

  6. #16
    Chaz's Avatar
    Lives in Ickenham, West London, United Kingdom. Last Activity: 7 Hours Ago Has been a member for 5-6 years. Has a total post count of 1,194. Received thanks 85 times, giving thanks to others 58 times.
    We used to do the DIY 3D printing kits a few years ago. We did the MendelMax design, then did our own design. Played with Rostock too. I was thinking to look at this again, now that I know more about cnc and have better tools available.

    The extruder for me is the key thing to get right, then the bed / heating setup. The movement (XYZ) is almost the easy part.

    The Ultimaker 3 shows what can be done in the 'DIY' market but I cant see the value in the cost of that.

  7. #17
    Quote Originally Posted by Chaz View Post
    We used to do the DIY 3D printing kits a few years ago. We did the MendelMax design, then did our own design. Played with Rostock too. I was thinking to look at this again, now that I know more about cnc and have better tools available.

    The extruder for me is the key thing to get right, then the bed / heating setup. The movement (XYZ) is almost the easy part.

    The Ultimaker 3 shows what can be done in the 'DIY' market but I cant see the value in the cost of that.


    The bed is easy. The extruder/hotend is difficult as needs lot of experiments and tiny adjustments. Thats why most go with established combos. You say the linear motion and frame is easy, but then where are the good designs? I dont see any, and if i see some they are >1500euro

    There is growing market even with the cheap Chinese printers. Many people will buy one only to upgrade at a later time when they find they can not make money with it.

    I did not enter earlier as they seemed quite under developed and funny. Material was expensive, hot ends were ugly. In other words- unreliable expensive toy with no real world purpose / at least to me/.



    I think-- how to combine all this is the key and offer sth reliable, well supported and most of all easy. Even now i find all not so easy. Easy to me after designing a couple of machines and building them and being in the CNC world a couple of years. But things still are not "push and play", i would say far from it.

    Right now i am into a couple of Facebook groups where printer guys speak, i see many real life problems with the machines priced 1000-3000$, that are ridiculous especially for the lack of support and warranty. To me its speaks: not well designed robust product.
    project 1 , 2, Dust Shoe ...

  8. #18
    Chaz's Avatar
    Lives in Ickenham, West London, United Kingdom. Last Activity: 7 Hours Ago Has been a member for 5-6 years. Has a total post count of 1,194. Received thanks 85 times, giving thanks to others 58 times.
    Quote Originally Posted by Boyan Silyavski View Post
    The bed is easy. The extruder/hotend is difficult as needs lot of experiments and tiny adjustments. Thats why most go with established combos. You say the linear motion and frame is easy, but then where are the good designs? I dont see any, and if i see some they are >1500euro

    There is growing market even with the cheap Chinese printers. Many people will buy one only to upgrade at a later time when they find they can not make money with it.

    I did not enter earlier as they seemed quite under developed and funny. Material was expensive, hot ends were ugly. In other words- unreliable expensive toy with no real world purpose / at least to me/.



    I think-- how to combine all this is the key and offer sth reliable, well supported and most of all easy. Even now i find all not so easy. Easy to me after designing a couple of machines and building them and being in the CNC world a couple of years. But things still are not "push and play", i would say far from it.

    Right now i am into a couple of Facebook groups where printer guys speak, i see many real life problems with the machines priced 1000-3000$, that are ridiculous especially for the lack of support and warranty. To me its speaks: not well designed robust product.
    I agree, its on my to do list to get something out. Time however is not on my side, too much to do.

  9. #19
    Today was a busy day, but while resting managed to finish printing a couple of popular cable guide chains and found that not one is working properly. Mehh, i was not into designing a cable guide but it seemed that i had to. Luckily having the printer at hand i did some prototypes and at the end i have sth that i am very proud of. Its strong, impossible to break and to break apart using normal force by hand and most of all moves freely cause i left the necessary clearances. if i further compromise a mm or two and make it bigger here and there , i can make it even to be printed assembled, though dint see reason to do that for now as its good as it is.

    I wanted a cable chain not that i could not use just the proper flex cable, but because i would lke to be easily scalable, that means all has to be perfect from the beginning. So later just scale and do.

    About the bed. Any idea what heating wire i could use to achieve the proper 0.4w per cm2? 12VDC , 24VDC or even better 230VAC ????? I would like to route the aluminum with channels and insert the wire from below. Certanly sb will know a silicone wire or similar that could do the job, instead of the ugly silicone pads?


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    in case anybody is wondering that is the proper way to print a cable chain links, i tried all possible today and thats how they are printed strongest:

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    Ok to be more exact like that:

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    By the way i would like to remind you that this will be open source so if sb needs some CAD, meanwhile i am finishing the drawing just drop me a line. I draw in Nx and can send you solids.
    Last edited by Boyan Silyavski; 06-12-2016 at 11:37 PM.
    project 1 , 2, Dust Shoe ...

  10. The Following User Says Thank You to Boyan Silyavski For This Useful Post:


  11. #20
    It would be nice if the hot end could deal with printable wax, speaking as a man with a furnace or two ;-)
    You think that's too expensive? You're not a Model Engineer are you? :D

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