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  1. #11
    JOGARA's Avatar
    Lives in Derby, United Kingdom. Last Activity: 4 Hours Ago Has been a member for 1-2 years. Has a total post count of 294. Received thanks 12 times, giving thanks to others 54 times.
    Just tried one of these in a 500ml glass jar and it worked pretty well.
    Click image for larger version. 

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    Took a good 10-15 mins to get up to temperature so would expect a lot longer with 5l tubs.
    Runs at 12v and draws pretty much bang on 10A so 120watts.

    Going to test wit 5L now!


  2. #12
    m_c's Avatar
    Lives in East Lothian, United Kingdom. Last Activity: 4 Hours Ago Has been a member for 9-10 years. Has a total post count of 2,148. Received thanks 236 times, giving thanks to others 5 times.
    The specific heat capacity of water is 4.184 joules/gram/deg, so to raise 5 litres of water from 20 to 80 degC, would take 1255200 joules (4.184 * 5000 * (80-20)), or 0.349 KWh. Now if you've only got 120W, that means it would take 2.91 hours (0.349 / 0.12) assuming you have zero heat loss.

    However, unless you've got insulated containers, I'd doubt you'd ever get to 80degC.
    Avoiding the rubbish customer service from AluminiumWarehouse since July '13.

  3. #13
    JOGARA's Avatar
    Lives in Derby, United Kingdom. Last Activity: 4 Hours Ago Has been a member for 1-2 years. Has a total post count of 294. Received thanks 12 times, giving thanks to others 54 times.
    Quote Originally Posted by m_c View Post
    The specific heat capacity of water is 4.184 joules/gram/deg, so to raise 5 litres of water from 20 to 80 degC, would take 1255200 joules (4.184 * 5000 * (80-20)), or 0.349 KWh. Now if you've only got 120W, that means it would take 2.91 hours (0.349 / 0.12) assuming you have zero heat loss.

    However, unless you've got insulated containers, I'd doubt you'd ever get to 80degC.

    Pretty much spot on. Tried it for the hell of it and got the top third of the water to 50c/
    The rest stayed at 16c (workshop room temp). That was nearly 1 hour.

    I am thinking 1000w min really as I don't want to wait too long for it and once one puts the part into the bucket the temp will go down quite a bit. So need it to be fast enough to recover from that.

    Wondering if something like this would work?
    https://www.aliexpress.com/item/900W...809794841.html
    Keeping in mind a 5L bucket is around 200-220mm tall?
    Not sure if these are designed for water but should be okay as long as the top is kept above water line I believe.

  4. #14
    m_c's Avatar
    Lives in East Lothian, United Kingdom. Last Activity: 4 Hours Ago Has been a member for 9-10 years. Has a total post count of 2,148. Received thanks 236 times, giving thanks to others 5 times.
    With something like that, I'd be making sure they were well earthed, and powered via a good RCD.

    Have you had a look at any of the youtube videos for ideas?
    I've got these saved in my watch later list
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BtYHcsq7s5A
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GccTVfMiIIo
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TGi-nqNnENE


    It's been a while since I watched them, so can't remember exactly what they covered, but they must of contained something worthwhile that I never deleted them after watching them..
    Avoiding the rubbish customer service from AluminiumWarehouse since July '13.

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  6. #15
    JOGARA's Avatar
    Lives in Derby, United Kingdom. Last Activity: 4 Hours Ago Has been a member for 1-2 years. Has a total post count of 294. Received thanks 12 times, giving thanks to others 54 times.
    Thinking about it.
    Cleaner, Dye and Sealer don't care if they are in a metal container?
    Why not just use stainless cooking pots and put them on those cheap hot plates?
    http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Single-Ele...EAAOSw-K9ZIxN4

    As variable knob too so could potentially not even need thermostat controller?

    Obviously not put the acid/lye in these, they still need plastic containers.
    Last edited by JOGARA; 03-10-2017 at 01:28 PM.

  7. #16
    that's probably the way i'd do it personally yeah

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  9. #17
    JOGARA's Avatar
    Lives in Derby, United Kingdom. Last Activity: 4 Hours Ago Has been a member for 1-2 years. Has a total post count of 294. Received thanks 12 times, giving thanks to others 54 times.
    Quote Originally Posted by Zeeflyboy View Post
    that's probably the way i'd do it personally yeah
    11 for the hotplate, 8 for the 5L stainless pot. Total price is much better than Plastic tub plus heat element and controller...

  10. #18
    JOGARA's Avatar
    Lives in Derby, United Kingdom. Last Activity: 4 Hours Ago Has been a member for 1-2 years. Has a total post count of 294. Received thanks 12 times, giving thanks to others 54 times.
    Okay so here is my shopping list for each step.

    Washing between steps
    1 PP tub http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Plastic-Bu...72.m2749.l2649
    Deionised water (got loads of but will be buying more)
    1 spray bottle

    Cleaner
    Stainless steel pot 5L http://www.ikea.com/gb/en/products/c...-art-80129725/
    1000w Stove http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Streetwize...72.m2749.l2649
    Cleaner poweder https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/381987813243


    Etch
    1 PP tub http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Plastic-Bu...72.m2749.l2649
    Lye https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/231690311428


    Desmut
    Stainless steel pot 5L http://www.ikea.com/gb/en/products/c...-art-80129725/
    Desmut https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/352012108749
    1000w Stove http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Streetwize...72.m2749.l2649


    Anodize
    1 PP tub http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Plastic-Bu...72.m2749.l2649
    1L sulfuric acid https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/141920434018
    Titanium wire for holding work piece https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/221839543...r=520722722260
    Not sure if to go lead or aluminum cathodes?
    Already got my DPS5015 with 480w 48v PSU and some 18awg silicone wire.
    Not forgotten about air agitation, just testing my old air pump first.


    Dye
    Black Dye https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/253186569978
    Stainless steel pot 5L http://www.ikea.com/gb/en/products/c...-art-80129725/
    1000w Stove http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Streetwize...72.m2749.l2649


    Seal
    Stainless steel pot 5L http://www.ikea.com/gb/en/products/c...-art-80129725/
    1000w Stove http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Streetwize...72.m2749.l2649
    Sealer https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/382075702419


    Looking good? Already bought some stuff like the stoves, PP buckets. Not got any of the materials like acid, dye etc yet.
    Last edited by JOGARA; 03-10-2017 at 10:30 PM.

  11. #19
    Quote Originally Posted by JOGARA View Post
    From what I read you don't want the acid hot at all. Both the etch and/or the anodizing tanks should be room temp as those processes get hot when reacting/putting amps though them.
    The Desmut, Colour and Seal should be heated though...


    Going off the Ron Newman guide that m_c sent be lists this;
    1. Polish part using fine sand paper for shiny finish, or wire wool for matte (can also etch for a little longer for matte finish/hide imperfections)
    2. Cleaner @ 140F 5 mins
    3. Rinse (de-ionized water)
    4. Etch in Lye for 10-30 seconds @ room temp
    5. Rinse (de-ionized water)
    6. Desmut @ room temp 1-3mins
    7. Rinse (de-ionized water)
    8. Anodize at room temp based off 720 rule
    9. Rinse (de-ionized water)
    10. Dye @ 140F for 15s-15m
    11. Rinse (de-ionized water)
    12. Seal @ 180F
    13. Rinse (de-ionized water)
    14. Hang to dry for 24 hours


    Other guides I have seen do mostly the same procedure, though one suggested using "Sodium Bisulfate/Sodium Hydrogen Sulfate" instead of Sulfuric which I guess is safer?

    As for heating the buckets, I like the one you linked, but I am limited on power in my current workshop. Wont be in my new one till end of November.
    Pretty much can't draw more than 3000w in total.

    Thinking of getting a couple 12v ones that I can then use one of these cheap controller boxes with. Safer too as those immersion ones don't always have earth on the metal case.
    https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/172822446...r=471604592191 (This is 220v ones yes, they do 12v too)
    If you have a mains thermostat just tape the probe to the outside of the bucket accuracy will be good enough.

    I use these
    http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/220V-10A-M.../142426824134?

    daily very reliable never had one fail over 5 years.
    http://www.mycncuk.com/threads/10880...60cm-work-area My first CNC build WIP 120cm*80cm

    If you didn't buy it from China the company you bought it from did ;)

  12. #20
    JOGARA's Avatar
    Lives in Derby, United Kingdom. Last Activity: 4 Hours Ago Has been a member for 1-2 years. Has a total post count of 294. Received thanks 12 times, giving thanks to others 54 times.
    Quote Originally Posted by Desertboy View Post
    If you have a mains thermostat just tape the probe to the outside of the bucket accuracy will be good enough.

    I use these
    http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/220V-10A-M.../142426824134?

    daily very reliable never had one fail over 5 years.
    I presume that as long as the temps are in the ballpark around 120-140F then it is okay? Don't have to be so bang on?

    [edit]
    Multi buy, 3 for 2 https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/292039778...r=591027809178
    Last edited by JOGARA; 03-10-2017 at 09:59 PM.

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