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  1. #1
    I’ve recently got into a bit of a “discussion” with another member here regarding what is a serious machine rather than a badly designed one like Ox, Workbee and Shapeoko.

    What could be done to improve it without spending too much money, as I have a limited supply as I don’t work and only rely on disability benefits here in the UK.

    My current build has the X and Y driven by double belts (el cheapo rack and pinion method) with the Z axis running a C-beam linear actuator. I have full limit switches, the Dewalt 611 (26200 here in the UK) speed and power is controlled by a SuperPID and the vacuum power is controlled by the coolant switch (as I don’t use flood coolant).

  2. #2
    JAZZCNC's Avatar
    Lives in wakefield, United Kingdom. Last Activity: 18 Hours Ago Forum Superstar, has done so much to help others, they deserve a medal. Has been a member for 9-10 years. Has a total post count of 7,617. Received thanks 1,312 times, giving thanks to others 84 times.
    Show us the machine you have then we can see better what can be done if anything.

    To be honest whenever I've had dealings with these types of machines my advice as been don't bother trying to upgrade as it's not much more work to build from scratch. Better to sell it and put the money towards another. As the old saying goes " Can't make silk purse out of sows ear"

    But I understand your position so will try to help if possible.

  3. #3
    Click image for larger version. 

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    That's a closeup showing the gantry. It’s 80 x 40. The side rails are 80 x 20. I altered the stock z axis because it sucked. The replacement is similar to what is used on the Workbee.

    I’ve already ordered a water cooled spindle and VFD to test. I’m probably going to replace the gantry before fitting the new spindle though. Might see if I can make the plates for the new machine with my old machine.

    What advice I do need is to do with what linear rails and ballscrews to go with.

  4. #4
    I’ve already ordered a water cooled spindle and VFD to test
    Have you actually ordered or going to? Because there are two main types of the VFD post a picture of the one you ordered as you might still have chance if you age getting the wrong one. (they are both the same price)

    Edit This is the type we generally use : https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/2-2KW-WAT...13b9ff6cef94f9

    You can also get the spindle in a smaller Kw
    Last edited by Clive S; 27-01-2020 at 11:50 AM.
    ..Clive
    The more you know, The better you know, How little you know

  5. #5
    Quote Originally Posted by Clive S View Post
    Have you actually ordered or going to? Because there are two main types of the VFD post a picture of the one you ordered as you might still have chance if you age getting the wrong one. (they are both the same price)

    Edit This is the type we generally use : https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/2-2KW-WAT...13b9ff6cef94f9

    You can also get the spindle in a smaller Kw
    This is the one I ordered...

    Click image for larger version. 

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    I’ve been wanting a water cooled spindle for ages but honestly thought they were way more expensive than they actually are. Was only after JazzCNC disabused me of my decision that they were too expensive that made me impulse buy this one.
    Last edited by NeoMorph; 27-01-2020 at 01:51 PM.

  6. #6
    Yep. That looks OK.

    One thing to note is that you may have to change some parameters in the VFD. PD143 is sometimes wrong.
    When you have it working if the spindle is running the wrong way. Just change over any two of the spindle wires going to the VFD

    This is from the sticky on the forum:-

    NOTE: Always check these settings are applicable to your Haunyang VFD as there have been some design variances over the years.

    General VFD setup:
    Here's the correct settings for the Huanyang VFD that always seems to come with these kits.

    PD013 - 8 MASTER RESET <<< DO THIS FIRST [Jonathan Edit: I prefer not to input this reset command, as often they've set a lot of the settings for you, so it saves time to leave it and you'll spot any settings that are wrong when you set the rest, so there's no risk]
    PD005 - 400
    PD004 - 400
    PD003 - 400
    PD006 - 2.5
    PD007 - 1.20
    PD008 - 220
    PD009 - 15
    PD011 - 120 [Jonathan Edit: No, this is a common misconception. This setting is the lower frequency limit, so setting it to 120Hz means you can't run the spindle below 7200rpm, which originated from the air cooled spindles which would burn out below this speed. This is not a problem with water cooling, so you can set it to zero. You wont get much torque below 7200rpm, but down to about 3200rpm is useable for drilling small holes in aluminum if you don't have carbide drills.]
    PD014 - 1 [Jonathan Edit: This is time to accelerate to rated speed. It may be better not to set it as low as 1 second (e.g. 2) to reduce the starting current, or if you don't appreciate the lights dimming every time you press run.]
    PD015 - 1
    PD072 - 400.00
    PD143 - 2
    PD142 - 7
    PD144 - 3000, factory setting is 1440 ->3000 gives correct RPM of 24000 at 400hz

    Control Settings:
    For spindle Start/Stop using Mach controlled relay connect DCM to FOR with the relay wired between the two. NOTE: Wiring DCM to REV will give reverse spindle rotation.

    For variable speed control using a 10k ohm pot connect ACM and 10v to the pot with IV on the Wiper.

    PD001 - 0 = Start from VFD Panel(Manual control), 1 = Control from inputs(use if Mach is start/stopping your spindle as explained above)
    PD044 - 2
    PD045 - 3
    ..Clive
    The more you know, The better you know, How little you know

  7. The Following User Says Thank You to Clive S For This Useful Post:


  8. #7
    Regarding computer managed speed control I take it is PWM based? That’s how my SuperPID is currently set up. It is set for a lowest rpm of 5000 and a highest of 30000. Considering that is with a Dewalt 26200 (611) router it’s pretty impressive... and I’ve only ever killed one endmill since 2017 lol.

    Mind you I have crashed the machine quite a few times by hitting the wrong button. That’s why certain buttons are under flip top security cages. That is what I was updating when I got into an argu... errr... discussion (calling my machine “shite” and a “sow’s ear... harrumph I ask you. LOL) that I decided to see how good of a machine I could design with how much I paid for my Ox and additions.

    I’m going to keep track of the costs and see how I go. I will definitely like the reduced runout AND having collets for all the sizes of endmill I have. I’ve collected a few over the years to go with my Triton router table (another project that’s getting redone when the warmer weather gets here and my assistant is free to do all the heavy lifting.

    Thanks for the advice btw. I’m a noob still for sure... but an enthusiastic one.

  9. Quote Originally Posted by Clive S View Post
    PD014 - 1 [Jonathan Edit: This is time to accelerate to rated speed. It may be better not to set it as low as 1 second (e.g. 2) to reduce the starting current, or if you don't appreciate the lights dimming every time you press run.]
    Re the VFD setup PD014...

    I have mine set quite long as my entire shed, air-con included, runs off a single 16A breaker. It is then necessary to add a delay to the G-code for each job after the spindle start command to allow it time to run up before it starts cutting. I use a 6 second delay (G4 P6).
    Engineering is the art of doing for ten shillings what any fool can do for a pound.
    Wellington.

  10. #9
    JAZZCNC's Avatar
    Lives in wakefield, United Kingdom. Last Activity: 18 Hours Ago Forum Superstar, has done so much to help others, they deserve a medal. Has been a member for 9-10 years. Has a total post count of 7,617. Received thanks 1,312 times, giving thanks to others 84 times.
    Quote Originally Posted by Kitwn View Post
    Re the VFD setup PD014...

    I have mine set quite long as my entire shed, air-con included, runs off a single 16A breaker. It is then necessary to add a delay to the G-code for each job after the spindle start command to allow it time to run up before it starts cutting. I use a 6 second delay (G4 P6).
    Don't know if your using mach3 or not but for anyone else who does then there is a setting in the spindle settings to do just this. You can set a delay for both ramp up and ramp down before G-scode gets processed. Saves messing around with editing G-code

  11. #10
    IMHO the real problem is the linear rails / the lack of/ . Best would be to upgrade to Chinese square rails Hiwin type. 20 size best but even smaller size is ok. Like 15 or 12 and use 3 carriages instead of 2, as they are very cheap. Especially the gantry and the Z, its a must if you want to have any resemblance of a proper machine.

    If you can not find an easy way to do that, better fabricate what brackets you need for a new machine and sell that one. If money is a problem, don't dilute your attention on pointless parts. You need basic structure with ball screws, square rails and a controller


    I have seen recently such a machine like yours / and have had worse/ and honestly 0.8kw spindle is enough for it. Anyways the spindle is a good buy, could be moved on a new machine
    project 1 , 2, Dust Shoe ...

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