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  1. #1
    This popped up on my YT feed...

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jqpJy86iwxc

    Quite an interesting design.

    I think the waste boards that Marius adds are quite a good idea, it'll be interesting to see what others think.

  2. #2
    JAZZCNC's Avatar
    Lives in wakefield, United Kingdom. Last Activity: 11 Hours Ago Forum Superstar, has done so much to help others, they deserve a medal. Has been a member for 8-9 years. Has a total post count of 6,911. Received thanks 1,162 times, giving thanks to others 72 times.
    I'm always wary of machines that are covered in tin sheet. They are nearly always on to hide the weak structure or short cuts on build quality.! . . Looking at this with narrow rail placement and using lead screws, not ball-screws I'd be wanting to look under the covers before buying.!

  3. #3
    I agree with what Jazz said. Must say overall finish looks okay, not something i would buy though.

  4. #4
    I can't see why on earth they would put the gantry linear rails so close together.

  5. #5
    Quote Originally Posted by pippin88 View Post
    I can't see why on earth they would put the gantry linear rails so close together.
    +1 on that
    I am a big fan of the Felder range, they make some good kit, did a quick search trying to find the price but came up short. as mentioned need to see under the covers.
    Update
    According to Marius Hornberger, who tested a pre-production model of this machine, the standard model will cost around €3500. This includes the controller and software license, but not the spindle. It can also be bought without the controller, at around €3000.
    Last edited by mekanik; 26-02-2020 at 09:53 AM.

  6. #6
    Nigelo's Avatar
    Lives in Chelmsford, United Kingdom. Last Activity: 4 Weeks Ago Has been a member for 1-2 years. Has a total post count of 2.
    Have been looking at the Hammer HNC myself and got quoted 3k excluding controller and software but including the basic 1KW spindle that Marius tested.

    I already use Hammer's Planer Thicknesser / Felder dust extractor and they are both seriously good kit. The HNC weighs in at 85kgs so is substantial for a desktop.

    Having recently converted my Wabeco mill to run on Centroid's Acorn with excellent results, that is my intended direction for the HNC - BUT, the 2.2KW spindle option (Teknomotor with ER25) I want to use comes out at 1,700 from Felder on top of the machine itself which is, ahem, not cheap to say the least.

    What surprises me most is the use of small 2.8amp Nema 23 steppers with just 1.08Nm on leadscrews with the X axis using just 1 centrally mounted stepper and connected to a pair of leadscrews using 1 long toothed belt. They do claim a max feed speed of 6m/min (236ipm) however.

    It's Austrian not Chinese but I am scratching my head.

    Hope this helps and any further thoughts welcome

  7. #7
    JAZZCNC's Avatar
    Lives in wakefield, United Kingdom. Last Activity: 11 Hours Ago Forum Superstar, has done so much to help others, they deserve a medal. Has been a member for 8-9 years. Has a total post count of 6,911. Received thanks 1,162 times, giving thanks to others 72 times.
    Quote Originally Posted by Nigelo View Post
    Have been looking at the Hammer HNC myself and got quoted 3k excluding controller and software but including the basic 1KW spindle that Marius tested.

    I already use Hammer's Planer Thicknesser / Felder dust extractor and they are both seriously good kit. The HNC weighs in at 85kgs so is substantial for a desktop.

    Having recently converted my Wabeco mill to run on Centroid's Acorn with excellent results, that is my intended direction for the HNC - BUT, the 2.2KW spindle option (Teknomotor with ER25) I want to use comes out at 1,700 from Felder on top of the machine itself which is, ahem, not cheap to say the least.

    What surprises me most is the use of small 2.8amp Nema 23 steppers with just 1.08Nm on leadscrews with the X axis using just 1 centrally mounted stepper and connected to a pair of leadscrews using 1 long toothed belt. They do claim a max feed speed of 6m/min (236ipm) however.

    It's Austrian not Chinese but I am scratching my head.

    Hope this helps and any further thoughts welcome
    If I'm honest I think people are being tricked by Felders good rep. The spec says it all to me.

    3k for what is essentially a machine frame using lead screws with Delrin nuts and rails which are fastened to an aluminum profile that is far too narrow. In fact, all the axis are too narrow and the Gantry only uses 3 linear bearings. The Z-axis design and how the spindle mounts look flimsy. I can't imagine that Z-axis handling a large spindle very well if I'm honest.
    All the rest of the machine ie: the tin sheet is just camouflage to me which is hiding what.? At best it's just for aesthetics and a dust trapper/collector because it's not done very well and IMO not on the machine to serve a functional purpose but solely to make the machine look better than it is.!

    For what will easily turn into 4k by time bought controller and spindle I'd expect and want at least ball-screws on all axis. And even then you are still stuck with poor machine design regards rail spacing and Z-axis.!

    Like I said before I'd need to see it naked before I'd go near it and even then at 4k don't think I would.

  8. #8
    Nigelo's Avatar
    Lives in Chelmsford, United Kingdom. Last Activity: 4 Weeks Ago Has been a member for 1-2 years. Has a total post count of 2.
    Thanks for that. However, I watched Marius video again and he does state "sheet" but also 10mm thick!! As the German word Blech can be either metal sheet or metal plate, it seems clear we are not talking of tin sheet but rather heavy steel plate construction and the reason it wieghs in at 80kgs.

    One last point, my figures above were ex VAT so definitely well in excess of 4k after controller etc as you say

  9. #9
    JAZZCNC's Avatar
    Lives in wakefield, United Kingdom. Last Activity: 11 Hours Ago Forum Superstar, has done so much to help others, they deserve a medal. Has been a member for 8-9 years. Has a total post count of 6,911. Received thanks 1,162 times, giving thanks to others 72 times.
    Quote Originally Posted by Nigelo View Post
    Thanks for that. However, I watched Marius video again and he does state "sheet" but also 10mm thick!! As the German word Blech can be either metal sheet or metal plate, it seems clear we are not talking of tin sheet but rather heavy steel plate construction and the reason it wieghs in at 80kgs.

    One last point, my figures above were ex VAT so definitely well in excess of 4k after controller etc as you say
    Ok well, first of all, 10mm is not heavy plate, it's not even thick plate and to be honest, it doesn't add anything to the machine but excess weight in the one place you don't want it. Also, 80Kg isn't heavy for a strong machine this size.!

    However, I wasn't referring to the gantry sides but rather all the tin sheet that covers the gantry and screws, etc. Looking at the gantry in the video they don't offer much in way of chip protection and actually look like chip traps so why cover it.? . . . I'll tell you why I think it's covered.! . . . .To make it look better than it really is. They don't want you to see that the gantry is actually quite flimsy built using a single narrow piece of aluminum profile.! I'm also guessing the same goes for long axis and what's hiding behind those covers.!

    I've worked on many machines built in the same way. Both Denford and Boxford Routers use this method of hiding weak structures behind tin covers designed to make them look more industrial than they really are. Strip the covers off and they look like chickens without feathers.!

    My point in saying all this to highlight that just because it's a Felder or German doesn't automatically mean it's quality or strong. No more than looking BLING will make it cut good.!

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