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  1. #51
    Quote Originally Posted by Kitwn View Post
    That's a really interesting base design, I've been wondering about a concrete or block base myself in the future as a cost-effective and very rigid structure. I'll be interested to follow your progress.

    If you plan to drain the coolant to a tank underneath then it may help to cast a short length or two of plastic drainpipe through the base to act as conduits for the fluid hoses.
    We'll see how it works, I can't see why it will be a major issue unless shrinkage is significant over time, but I'll give it a bash. That's a good point on the drainage, I'll have to reiterate the CAD some more. The general idea was to have the coolant flood over both front and back and design a fibreglass chute to direct fluid back to the tank but that could also work, I'll have to have a think.

  2. #52
    Kitwn's Avatar
    Lives in Exmouth, Australia. Last Activity: 13 Hours Ago Has been a member for 2-3 years. Has a total post count of 551. Received thanks 75 times, giving thanks to others 14 times.
    Just thinking out loud here John, but once you have the base epoxied up for leveling the rails you might as well use that surface as the base of your coolant-catching tray with a drain down to a storage tank below. Maybe build up the surface to direct the fluid to the drain. Rather like an Australian bathroom where the entire floor is built up round the outside to direct any spilled water into a central drain.
    Engineering is the art of doing for ten shillings what any fool can do for a pound.
    Wellington.

  3. #53
    Quote Originally Posted by Kitwn View Post
    Just thinking out loud here John, but once you have the base epoxied up for leveling the rails you might as well use that surface as the base of your coolant-catching tray with a drain down to a storage tank below. Maybe build up the surface to direct the fluid to the drain. Rather like an Australian bathroom where the entire floor is built up round the outside to direct any spilled water into a central drain.
    Hey, I think I'm following what you mean, that's not a bad idea actually, thanks. What I could do is run channels at the sides down into pipework and into the catchment tank from there, rather than fluid running over the front and back, and build a lip at the front and back for liquid catchment. That might make things a bit difficult loading and unloading stock though, particularly if stock is to overhand the Y (I do that sometimes).

    The spindle only gets within 150mm or so of the alu sections which holds the rails left and right so there's plenty of space there for a liquid channel. I must draw up some options to gauge the simplest approach before starting.

  4. #54
    Initial test mix is done, the testing here is designed to judge bonding strength when using a simple UHPGRFC mix as a replacement for mortar. This might be unnecessary but mixes like this are said to be good for 12,000psi or so, so I'd like to try it.


    UHPGFRC mixes (in my very limited experience) are approached differently than regular cement type mixes, insofar as the cement to aggregate (sand) proportions are quite different. With regualar cement mixes you would generally be 1:3 cement to sand ration, here we are 1:1 roughly.

    I have a simple mix and a more exotic one, the simple mix is approached here as I'll need to source some other part for the latter which I'll detail later.

    Here we have:


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    +200g Sharp Sand (quartz I believe) I live near several quarries and this stuff costs me roughly 25 euro per tonne, give or take, and makes great concrete.

    +200g Portland Cement (regular cement). Generally this will be mixed with other elements such as 20% CSA or Silica Fume, I'll fill you in on that later, those can be hard to source.

    +6g of Glass Fiber (From mbfg.co.uk added to the mix last, strand length is 13mm in this case, probably too long but it'll do the job)

    +0.6g of Plasticiser (FLUP PCE 104 from moertelshop.de) I went with the manufacturers recommendation in this case of 3g/kg, it probably needs to be doubled in reality though, so I'll have to order another 1kg tub for the table to be sure.

    Don't take anything I say as gospel, this is what works for me so far, I'm very new to this so take everything with a pinch of salt and as 'in testing'.
    The mixing procedure used was pretty straightforward, mix sand and cement together dry first, add a small amount of water to make an overly dry mixture that is just starting to clump a little. Add super plasticiser, continue to mix for a minute or two (vigorously) and add more water to bring it to field capacity being careful not to overdo it. When the consistency was where I wanted it, I mixed in the glass fibers last.

    I ended up using a little more water than I would have liked or predicted from my calculations (65g), but I think I'll double the plasticiser next time and test again to see if I can further reduce the water input.


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    I used some small 'soap bar' bricks which are almost identical in nature to the larger versions to test it out, at the moment I'm mainly concerned with bonding strength if I use it as a mortar between the blocks. If it fails to bond, I plan to make another custom mortar mix using standard mortar mix with sand, cement lime and mortar plasticiser with some added glass fiber reinforcement to beef it up as I know that will stick well to the blocks.

    One thing I've noted is that the mixture consistency becomes noticeably more 'dry' when adding the Glass Fiber, so I'll have to balance that out. Also the working time is short, around 20 minutes, so I'm going to have to be on the ball when doing this but I have a cement mixer so it should be doable.

    The mixture is curing very fast, so in a day or two I should have an idea how the bonding is.
    Last edited by Evengravy; 16-05-2020 at 01:52 PM.

  5. #55
    Some small progress.

    After letting the GRFC mortar test cure for a week in situ in my workshop I inspected it for bonding, the very scientific method of slapping it with a hammer was employed. I was mostly concerned initially with whether it would bond significantly to each brick but I'm confident now that it will be perfectly fine in that regard. It's clearly much stronger than regular mortar and I'd expect it to shrink less and be stronger in compression. That's good enough for me to move on.

    One thing I realised after purchasing the glass fibre and mixing up this test is that AR glass fibre is recommended as it is suitable for the extreme environment of usage in concrete (general E glass is not as it is attacked by the alkalinity). After reviewing the technical documents from the supplier though it seems that this isn't a major issue for me, luckily. The glass fibre I have purchased, whilst not AR glass, the type I have (E6-CR from Jushi Tech http://en.jushi.com/res/excel88fcd3bf87268a79.pdf) is tested and recommended in both high acid and highly alkaline situations so it should be fine. I note it here for others though, be careful, glass fibre is not all suitable here and go for something that is specified for concrete usage.

    Here's a picture of the GFRC mortared test, being reused as a weight. This mortar is tough stuff. I'd like to do some more scientific tests before casting the main bed, I'll get the walls up firstly.

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    I'm pretty slammed at work but had some time to layout the basic structural outline on my newly concreted floor. Nothing too complex, four bricks, some string and some careful corner to corner measurements to make sure it was square. One of the issues I was having with the concrete floor was it was endlessly dusty, no matter how much it was swept it kept producing more and more dust. I treated it once with a PVA based sealer and water and this has cut this down. I will aim to treat it once more before moving on with the block work next week. This should also help ease my mind around bonding to the floor, I was more than a little concerned that it wouldn't bond correctly due to the dust but I'm told this is a commonly used solution to aid bonding.

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    Next step for me is to get my workload tied off and begin on this around the 10th.

    I've ordered some new motor to ballscrew connectors some months back but they have yet to arrive, if anyone knows of a reliable UK source I'd appreciate it. I'm looking for something to handle 480oz/inch with minimal backlash. 8mm to 12mm. Without a lathe in situ I can't really modify what I have accurately and haven't as yet been able to fully test the new ballscrew install.

    Anyway, that's it from me for now, more soon.
    Last edited by Evengravy; 29-05-2020 at 07:37 AM.

  6. #56
    Hey John,

    I have 3No 8mm to 12mm couplers on the way. They should be with me in the next few days. I have no need for them as they were part of a package deal. I have upgraded my motors to Nema 34's and I have ordered the 12 x 14 Couplers that I need. You would be more than welcome to have the 8 x 12's for nada... Otherwise they will just sit in a box for eternity.

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  8. #57
    Quote Originally Posted by Mister Mills View Post
    Hey John,

    I have 3No 8mm to 12mm couplers on the way. They should be with me in the next few days. I have no need for them as they were part of a package deal. I have upgraded my motors to Nema 34's and I have ordered the 12 x 14 Couplers that I need. You would be more than welcome to have the 8 x 12's for nada... Otherwise they will just sit in a box for eternity.
    Hey, that's very kind I appreciate that, I might take you up on that if you really don't mind. I've ordered two pairs actually but this whole pandemic seems to have put a spanner in the works to getting anything from China. I'm not in a mad panic but if there's nothing next week can I give you a shout? I'm happy to fire some money over for them.

  9. #58
    No problem John,

    They are still on the way for me. Currently in Germany so I would expect them at some stage next week. Looks like I am going to be waiting for my new motors and drives a while more than I thought also due to C19. It's a pain in the ass. I'm drooling over that piece of level floor in your workshop. I'm building on a ski slope at the moment hahaha

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  11. #59
    [QUOTE]I treated it once with a PVC based sealer and water and this has cut this down. I will aim to treat it once more before moving on with the block work next week. This should also help ease my mind around bonding to the floor, I was more than a little concerned that it wouldn't bond correctly due to the dust but I'm told this is a commonly used solution to aid bonding.
    [/QUOTE

    Looking good, I take you meant PVA or even better is SBR
    ..Clive
    The more you know, The better you know, How little you know

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  13. #60
    [QUOTE=Clive S;117646]
    I treated it once with a PVC based sealer and water and this has cut this down. I will aim to treat it once more before moving on with the block work next week. This should also help ease my mind around bonding to the floor, I was more than a little concerned that it wouldn't bond correctly due to the dust but I'm told this is a commonly used solution to aid bonding.
    [/QUOTE

    Looking good, I take you meant PVA or even better is SBR
    I did yea, thanks I didn't even notice that error (edited) it must have been the autocorrect. I'll look up SBR before beginning as I'd like to treat it again if they are compatible with one another. Thanks for the heads up.

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