6040Z controller

[Doddy]

Having set the programme and machine up so the limit home and soft home all worked I fitted a noise filter as per instructions both having been supplied by a forum member, now the limit and Home switches do not work, it had gone into e stop mode
I have gone through the line and port settings and all is correct, however if I set the XYZ limits to active low the machine does not go into e stop but the limit switches do not work, in diagnostics the limit led do not light up, if I uncheck the active lows the programme is in e stop but the diagnostic shows the led as lit, but they do not go out when the limit switch is activated, I have checked the wiring circuit of the limit switches they are all correct, I have checked the wiring to the Bob from the switches all correct, I removed the filter and replaced the original XYZ leads and went through everything it is exactly the same,
On manual jog if I manually activate a limit switch it goes into e stop, so that must prove the switch circuit
Has to be something simple, I know it is difficult without being on the actual machine, but can anyone throw any light onto this please
Regards Richard

Okay, Richard, there's a lot of information missing for people outside of our conversation here, and in particular what a "filter board" is in this context. Let me fill in the blanks that people will otherwise ask, and perhaps ask a few questions myself...

Having set the programme and machine up so the limit home and soft home all worked I fitted a noise filter as per instructions both having been supplied by a forum member

"Having wired the machine with independent X,Y,Z limit switches, each axis wired with two switches in series in a Normally-Closed mode, onto a modified BoB (shown in images on page 1 of this thread), there were problems experienced with noise on any/each axis limit switches that generated spurious limit triggers with Mach3. We did try to address the noise issue by increasing the 'Debounce' value in the Mach3 configuration settings, however, whilst increasing 'Debounce' did reduce the occurrences of spurious limit trips, they were still evident.

Some kindly soul suggested that, in reviewing the board layout, the BoB simply presents the limit-switch input straight to the parallel port interface with nothing but a pull-up resistor (and privately, possibly a filter capacitor). This means that any electrical noise picked up by the wiring in the machine is presented directly to the parallel port input into the computer, and could be a mechanism for noise susceptibility.

To try to counter this, it was suggested to introduce a commercially-available opto-isolator board, in this case a 4-channel device. In reviewing the schematic for the opto-isolator board, noting the positive-side switching, a wiring scheme was introduced (and modifications made to the board) to support 24V switched limit switch inputs to attempt to improve noise immunity, thus:



and provision of cable assemblies, thus:



and finally with a special-to-type cable assy to connect the opto-isolator board directly onto the board, previously modified with pin headers to access the X/Y/Z limit switches...

now the limit and Home switches do not work, it had gone into e stop mode

I have no e stop fitted yet, should I connect the e stop connection to the 24 common so it looks as if one is fitted

It’s a plan, or set it active high/low in Mach3. ESTOP is normally N/C so wiring 24V to the ESTOP filter board input would work

I have gone through the line and port settings and all is correct, however if I set the XYZ limits to active low the machine does not go into e stop but the limit switches do not work, in diagnostics the limit led do not light up, if I uncheck the active lows the programme is in e stop but the diagnostic shows the led as lit, but they do not go out when the limit switch is activated

At this point, I explained that Mach3 is not an area that I've comfortable advising upon simply because I've not used for several years. Forum members may be able to help.

However, Richard, I did ask for screen shots of the Mach3 Ports&Pins Input configuration settings that covers the axis limit/home switch settings. I believe people will require that to help further.

I have checked the wiring circuit of the limit switches they are all correct, I have checked the wiring to the Bob from the switches all correct, I removed the filter and replaced the original XYZ leads and went through everything it is exactly the same,

Okay, a new request - can you provide a good photo of the wiring loom added into the BoB

On manual jog if I manually activate a limit switch it goes into e stop, so that must prove the switch circuit

Now, I need to ask you to be precise here. Mach3 will enter a fault mode, and identify the cause of this (E-Stop, Limit Switch, etc), that you have to then clear. You say "e stop" - is that true?, that Mach3 scrolls a message that E-Stop is pressed?, or does it identify that the Limit Switch is triggered?, this is quite important to understand clearly.

Has to be something simple, I know it is difficult without being on the actual machine, but can anyone throw any light onto this please
Regards Richard

Very difficult without being on the machine. I keep looking at the map and we're still 150 miles apart. However a 6 hour trip is starting to sound more and more attractive, if it wasn't for this damned Covid crap.

I'm concerned now with the wording of your message that the E-Stop is triggered when a limit switch is activated, because that behaviour as described is unexpected - yes Mach3 should enter it's fault mode identifying the Limit Switch is triggered. This bit, for me is critical to understand better, and part of the reason above I've asked separately for an image of the wiring of the opto-isolator board to the BoB (I want to see the wiring connection onto the BoB - for the 3-way limit switch, the 2-way scavenged 5V supply and the 1-pin E-Stop input). Back into email, I will be asking you to measure signals on pins on the BoB.

But, in asking for help from the forum a context is required which I hope I've half completed - but would be assisted particularly with the image of Mach3's input port configuration page.

BTW, if I come across as being a pedantic sod - I am - as part of my career I've had incredibly highly trained people try to explain technical problems to me - the English language is a poor medium for diagnosis, inevitably when you look under the hood you find that there's critical information missing or misunderstood which only a Mk1 Eyeball will pick up. If I continue to ask questions it's to try to understand more clearly (and at a distance) the problem. And if you don't answer the questions I'll keep asking them (at least until one of us gets bored).

There's also this bit from our email conversation...

The situation is this, everything was set up to work on home switches and limit switches, nothing was altered and the filter fitted and double checked it is connected as it should be. On the diagnostic screen the led lights operate when triggered and show the three different axis. So the filter board must be working as far as signals go.

which appears at odds with the description above. I need to probe you further on this, and the current behaviour of the machine.

[Clive S]

Mike.
Would it help to suggest to almost start again and just get one circuit working. Ie take the e-stop out of the out of the loop.

I have been following this and can see that bits are not being clearly reported.

I would suggest that he makes bullet points to be precise and a screen shot of the lights.

To the OP. I know it is always difficult to relay info when you have never done this sort of stuff before.
You will get there in the end You have the correct tutor

[RichardR]

Ok just to clarify things, I do not have the actual E stop connected and I unchecked it in Mach 3 or altered the active switch so it is out of the conversation, what I meant was that it goes, and says emergency stop, I used E stop as an abbreviation, my fault.
I am going to start from scratch again once as I have informed Doddy by pm that having removed the filter and gone back to just the bob, I am going to measure to see if I have 5 volts from the limit switches, if I haven't then more than likely the bob is now faulty, if I have I am going to reinstate the filter and give Doddy the required information he has asked me.
That will be later on so I will post the outcome as and when

Quote Originally Posted by Richard - private email
The situation is this, everything was set up to work on home switches and limit switches, nothing was altered and the filter fitted and double checked it is connected as it should be. On the diagnostic screen the led lights operate when triggered and show the three different axis. So the filter board must be working as far as signals go.

which appears at odds with the description above. I need to probe you further on this, and the current behaviour of the machine.


Its very difficult to convey exactly what I am actually trying to say and the exact order of things, I do not have Wi Fi in the garage where the machine is and by the time I get into the office to write these posts, I have forgotten small things and the order I did them in, its an age thing and very frustrating, but bear with me and I will try to get information to you as best as I can

[JAZZCNC]

Sorry but How can we help if you are having private conversations that we are not privy to.? and only giving us half the information.!
Either keep it all on the Forum or not at all because your always going to get conflicting info if we don't have all the facts.

If you want my advice then throw the bloody hacked up BOB in the bin, spend £5 on a new one and start again. Or better still invest in a Ethernet controller and dump the parallel port altogether.!

Doddy is correct that if you trip a limit in Mach3 then it should say "Limit exceeded" not "Emergency Stop" we know E-stop and Emergency stop are the same thing, but If it say's E-stop then you must be using the same Pin as the E-stop for the limits. Otherwise it would say "limit exceeded", when the pins are shared E-stop will always take precedence over limits in the messages. However in diagnostics you will see all the LED's light together if they are using the same pin.

[RichardR]

Sorry but just before I posted Doddy had said that his knowledge of Mach3 was rusty as he used other systems, I then wrote my post out giving all the information as to what had happened, or so I thought, then after that he came back with more suggestions which I carried out.
It's alright for you to have another go at me, I probably asked for it, (I don't think,)
You are a very helpful chap but a bit touchy and prone to being abrupt.
What you need to understand is that you know what you are talking about, I am trying my best to just learn how to use a machine I have had for at least 3 years that cost me in excess of £1100, but due to illness and health problems I am only just trying to get to grips with.
I have looked at other BOB's and know they cost £8 upwards, but room to fit another BOB that may be larger is tight and would mean me moving things in the control box, more technical problems for me, then I would need to know how to connect everything as the connections are different to my existing one.
Therefore if its all the same to you I will try to get the Bob repaired.
I will stay on this forum but hey honestly you don't have to reply to my posts or help me, if there is no one else that can then that's fine, I will succeed I assure you.
As an aside it didn't show limit exceeded,but was showing an emergency stop activated, due to the Bob being faulty and not switching XYZ 5volt to 0 Bolton pins 10 11 and 12, so again you made me look like a complete Pratt again.
Thanks for all your input though

[JAZZCNC]

Richard, you need to stop being so touchy, I wasn't having a go at you or trying to make you look a pratt, just pointing out that if you are having private conversasions and only giving us half the info how can we help.

Regards being abrupt then you are asking for our help, I'm watching and replying, giving you my time and years of experience for free, all with the intention of helping you.
So when I see post's where you are only giving partial info and clearly working behind the scenes with others but not giving us details on what's been done then asking for more help then I have two choices, ignore it, not reply and move onto helping someone else, or post telling you that it's not helping.

Now if you see this as Having a go or being abrupt then that's your problem snow flake. As for my advice then that's for you to take or leave, I don't really care. But rest assured you won't get any more and I wish you good luck.!

[RichardR]

That's fine with me Jazzcnc looking through the posts I did give the information as I saw it, then Doddy by kindly came in and supplied all the information in a polite way,before you replied with your abrupt reply,
I object to being called a "snowflake" which I am certainly not.and regardless of disagreements this forum is not a place to call each other names

[Doddy]

I do need to hold my hands up here, Jazz - as Richard said - I did advise him to ask on the forum for specific help on Mach3 (in this case the configuration for shared limit/home switches - I think from reading the PDF that is all managed by Mach3 / Input configuration, but without a working installation to test that I'm flying blind).

Yeah, there's a lot of conversation behind the scene here which I did try to help catch up with the relevant bits on the forum with my post (and discard the obsolete/rabbit-hole info), simply, it's a lot of noise that would have run to many pages and with many threads. State of play time-now is I'm going to verify/test the board/opto-isolator config to demonstrate the current (it's changed) behaviour - if its behaviour is as Richard has measured (I trust only my eyes), then to condemn the BoB and replace; the reluctance to date is due to the physical build of the controller box - but to recover that we're talking of mounting a ribbon extender to a DB25 on the panel and relocating the BoB somewhere all together more accessible within the enclosure. And in doing so the BoB will be selected with the standard opto-isolated limit switch inputs, and then we'll all be back to a nice, known state, and Richard can hopefully move forwards with a working machine.

[Doddy]

.

[JAZZCNC]

I do need to hold my hands up here, Jazz - as Richard said - I did advise him to ask on the forum for specific help on Mach3 (in this case the configuration for shared limit/home switches - I think from reading the PDF that is all managed by Mach3 / Input configuration, but without a working installation to test that I'm flying blind).

Yeah, there's a lot of conversation behind the scene here which I did try to help catch up with the relevant bits on the forum with my post (and discard the obsolete/rabbit-hole info), simply, it's a lot of noise that would have run to many pages and with many threads.

Ye I get that Doody and I weren't having a pop at you, like me you give your time for free and out the kindness of your heart so I would never have a Pop at anyone for this but Richard came back asking for more help and gave virtually Zero Info knowing so much had happened behind the scenes, Saying he's new is NO excuse because he's the one who's done the pyshical modifications you told him to do.

You know me I don't pussy foot about with my words, I haven't got time to waste being all PC just so someone, who I'm trying to help for Free, doesn't gets offended.

That's fine with me Jazzcnc looking through the posts I did give the information as I saw it, then Doddy by kindly came in and supplied all the information in a polite way,before you replied with your abrupt reply,
I object to being called a "snowflake" which I am certainly not.and regardless of disagreements this forum is not a place to call each other names

Richard, I wasn't complaining about what you wrote I was making the point that by doing this ON and OFF the forum doesn't work and makes it difficult for Us not privy to what's happened so far to help. So my point was do one or the other not both because I haven't got time to go back thru dozens of posts trying to catch up on what's happened or read an update post that is 10,000 words long.

More than Twice now on two separate threads you have gone off the handle at reply's which were never said or meant to offend only help, but you read them differently and got offended. In my world, this makes you a snowflake.

Now here's the last piece of advice you'll get from me.!. . . If you are going to hang around Forums asking for help you are going to need to realise we are all different and text is easily misread and took the wrong way, getting upset at the words being said or asked is only going to isolate you from the people who have the knowledge and experience to help fix your issues.

Good luck.!