Axis not working properly

[Georgehun]

Hi all

I bought a 3 axis cnc router from UK and comes with computer etc.
so finally managed to put together and try it out. I used aspire for doing my drawings and Mach3 for the cnc.
I`m new for this but have to start somewhere.
So opened my program and started o run without cutters in to see.
the spindle was sitting in to the middle of the table and started from there. My machine work area is 850mmx870mm and my program was running in 750x200mm. so i did surprised why not go to left because it wont fit this way......
anyway, let it run and when reached the edge I switched off straight away. try to send the spindle manually (jog) but wont react to nothin and the software was wont let to re set.
so I switched off and back but still no joy. Today I went back and find the solution to re set the machine (google was the answer) so now the jog is working but regardless what arrow I`m press the spindle only go one way... the spindle wont move up or down but the Software showing it is moving.
and I have Two motor to shift the spindle but only one working and again wont matter what arrow I press only going one way.
They got power i guess because if machine switched off you can move them but if power up and switched on they wont move non of them.
found out it was my mistake to not re position the zero point but i thought the machine automatically pick the sizes up from the aspire program....
However now i have a CNC is doing funny things and not sure why.
I sent a few text where I get the machine but not much help I get last time... (probably he pulling the hair out what I did)
So now please someone tell me I`m not ruined my brand new machine?
I`m from Aberdeenshire if that`s help or have someone near enough here? I`m very new for this but part from that i was doing fine to make my programs etc but now I don`t know what to do.
If anyone can help or suggest anything would be brilliant. The machine should be running for ages but was a few parts was damaged for delivery and now this,....... nothing big damage so not related to any of this parts and as I said it was working before fine.
I did said to reset the software because I hoped they will get back to the starting point when it was "jammed" that would messed up something?
Hope you understand the my situation.
Best Regards
George

[JAZZCNC]

Hi George,

Another Ebay machine from the guy in Peter lee I'm guessing.?

I've had a few dealings with his junk machines. You'll have more chance of getting a reply from the Queen than you will him.

The reason you crashed was that the machine doesn't have any HOME (or Limit) switches and because of this SOFT LIMITS cannot be set which would have prevented this from happening.
Aspire as nothing to do with the machine and knows nothing about where you are going to set your ZERO point on the table. Only the machine controller (Mach3) knows this and if it isn't set up correctly or has the needed switches crashes will happen.

All of his machines I've had dealings with have been the same, no homes or limits and poorly set up or not set up at all.

Now without seeing more and a better explanation of exactly what is happening or not happening it's hard to say why it's not working. BUT you mention Resetting the software.! Exactly what did you do.? because if you re-installed Mach3 then it's highly likely you have messed up the settings.

You need to give a better explanation of what you did and what's not working. We/I can help you but you have to help yourself by giving us clear information.

[Georgehun]

Hi Jazzcnc

The guy called David and you can see he's machine in eBay but I found him on Facebook to "Woodwork" it's called.
What you saying is correct about no limit switches on the machine.
What I did is the mach3 top sections saying configuration and at the very bottom asking reset.
I was sent a message to him about what happened and he's asked me to open the controller box and go true what he asked.
All the lights are green how it should and one is blue etc. So he said it's all ok there.
He asked me to open the motor configuration page and send a screen shot and he said the settings are not right.
He send me a files and said if I drop that file in it would sort this problems.
I did but nothing happened. I mean when I try to jog the machine it's only go one way the X axis and when I want to shift the whole machine only one motor moving instead of two.
And the motor which is shifting the spindle up and down not respond but the mach3 software showing is moving up or down.
But when I jog the machine only move one direction regardless what arrow I press on that axis......
I try to get a cnc I can work with and very little shown when I googled it ..... Unwanted to something sturdy enough and not a hobby things.
He's not got bad reviews and I thought it be ok.
He's explained how to run my programs next time to not happening this again.
But now it's somehow isn't working how it should.
Probably I better explain true the phone what happened ....I can speak English but struggle to explain something written....I'm Hungarian.

[Georgehun]

This is how I try to re set the machine

[JAZZCNC]

I'm very surprised he's even replying and I don't expect he will do so for long but my advice is that while he is responding then do exactly what he ask's you to do and if it still doesn't work then send it back or have them come and get it working. You shouldn't have to make the machine work and just crashing it into the side shouldn't break the electrical side of the machine (or even the mechanical side in normal circumstances). The worst it should do is require a shutdown and reset of the drives or at the very worst a PC restart.

Don't mess around in Mach3 because you can easily wipe out important settings. For instance, the Reset you show isn't a reset like you think, what you are actually doing is Reselecting the external Motion controller device, which in your case will be UC100, which is an external USB device.

If you still don't get any joy from him and he doesn't get you working or you don't or can't return it, then come back and I will talk you thru getting it working but until then I wouldn't touch it or change any settings unless told to do so by the supplier.

[Georgehun]

Good advice
However I have a funny feeling I'm not going to far away with him. And plus I get the blame probably for not setting the program right and I crashed to the diode for a second.
I was stand by and soon as the spindle hit the side I was stopped the machine straight away.
Only one thing I changed the mach3 is not letting me reset and keep showing need reset..... So I found one of the forum how I can get that to work.
So that was it but I didn't changed anything .
I think he a few hundreds miles away from me so I can't see he's gonna come and have a look for me.
It's not helping for I'm new for this to but I did managed to get my programs done.
I will try to call him tomorrow and see what happens and what he says.
Unfortunately I need the machine running by now but I can't see that happening any soon.
Just can't get a head around it it was everything was working before now is like half the machine are not responding at all or responding but not going the right direction....
I believe those limit switches can be added to the CNC after?
I mean I do understand what to do next time and probably I misunderstood something but was not very clear.
Now he explained to screw my workpiece down shift the machine to position and set zero,re generate the toolpath and that's it.
But I just did the trial run without tool in and the CNC started the program there were it was sitting.
That is going to be a nightmare but hey ho......my luck.
Thank you for your help and advice.
I will do a update if I spoke with him and see what's happening.
Regards
George

[Georgehun]

Hi Jazzcnc

Problem solved
The CNC is working now.
It was my mistake,I thought I replaced both of the files he sent me but obviously not. I did it again today and now it's fine.
However I thinking it's a big job to add on limit switches to the machine? Probably not just a simple job specially need to get the mach3 altered to....
Most of the time I use a same program on to the machine so one's is set it should be fine but later on I want to use it for different Jobs.
Only one thing is still worrying.
When the gantry motors not worked properly just one was running so I wonder if they are slightly off set eachother?
How I can get that fixed?
I take some measurements and looks have a few mm different.
Regards
George

[JAZZCNC]

However I thinking it's a big job to add on limit switches to the machine? Probably not just a simple job specially need to get the mach3 altered to....

No, it's not a big job, this is one of the things I've supplied and helped others with on these machines. The KK01 breakout board he's fitting as got the spare Inputs.
You will need to make some brackets to mount the switches plus the switches and cables themself. Also, I would advise using switches that work with 24Vdc power, like inductive proximity sw, to lower any chances of electrical interference. In which case you will need a 24Vdc PSU as there is only a 5V PSU in the control box.

Setting up mach3 to use them is very simple.

Most of the time I use the same program on to the machine so once is set it should be fine but later on I want to use it for different Jobs.

Not really, without Home switches then you won't be able to use the same point because every time you shut down Mach3 it will lose the position and you will have no way to accurately find the WORK ZERO.
This is the function of HOME switches as they provide a FIXED reference point that never changes called MACHINE ZERO, which you can then use to find the WORK ZERO you last used. Or for instance, if you lose position when breaking a tool or hitting E-stop while the machine is moving.

Only one thing is still worrying.
When the gantry motors not worked properly just one was running so I wonder if they are slightly off-set each other?
How I can get that fixed?
I take some measurements and looks have a few mm different.

This is the other function of HOME switches, On a machine that uses Two motors slaved together you have one switch at each side and they can be used to set the gantry square when HOMING.

To be honest I can't believe they get away without supplying at least LIMIT switches as it's a basic safety feature and the cost is minimal considering the price he's asking and the cheap low-quality components he's fitting to the machine means he's got more than enough profit to do so.
Also, it's very easy to share the switch to do HOME and LIMIT duty's so there is no excuse.

My advice is to fit them ASAP if you want to work accurately and safely.

[Georgehun]

Agree with you
I want a safe working machine so I'm happy to do the modification or asked some to do it
So what sorts of money we talking about to get it done?
I thought they are very difficult to do so that's why cutting corners.
Well I can't say about quality of the parts I'm "just" a user but most of the things are Chinese stuff but I'm not surprised.

[JAZZCNC]

Agree with you
I want a safe working machine so I'm happy to do the modification or asked some to do it
So what sorts of money we talking about to get it done?
I thought they are very difficult to do so that's why cutting corners.
Well I can't say about quality of the parts I'm "just" a user but most of the things are Chinese stuff but I'm not surprised.

The cost and difficulty will depend on how you want to do it.?

If you just want to do it the cheapest way then fit just HOME switches and use the Cheap Micro switch type. You can then setup SoftLimits to protect you from crashing into the sides etc.
The Microswitch type is not as accurate and more easily damaged than the proximity type but they are cheap and will mean you can get away without requiring a 24Vdc PSU and use the 5V PSU in the control box. However, they are more prone to interference and less accurate.

These switches you can buy from £1 each up to £50 depending on quality, size, etc. You'll also need a 3 core shielded cable which will be about £1 - £2 per meter.

The next method is again to just fit HOME switches but use proximity type. They offer more accuracy and are less prone to damage, the downside is they require 6 to 36Vdc to work so your 5V won't be enough so will require another PSU, 12 or 24Vdc are usually used, 24Vdc is the better option as it provides better immunity from electrical interference.

These cost around £5 each and the 24Vdc PSU will be between £10-£20. Again 3 core shielded cables will be required.

The third method that won't cost much more money but will require more work fitting is to use Proximity switches that travel with each axis and work as both HOME and LIMITS.
They do this by sensing a Target located at each end of the machine when working as limit switches while cutting etc, but when HOMING the LIMITS are ignored as it slowly travels towards the Target so the danger is limited.

The last method but the best method and most costly method is to fit both separate home and limit switches.
This can be done with a mixture of cheap Microswitches for the LIMITS with a fixed switch at each end of the travel which doesn't need any accuracy. Then fit higher accuracy switches for the HOMING, these can be either fixed or traveling.

Now for a machine this size then I would say just fit proximity HOME switches and let the soft limits protect you from crashing. This way you have better HOMING accuracy but keep the costs down because you won't require as much wire. You will however need the 24Vdc PSU.

If you are on a tight budget and don't require better accuracy then do the same but using Micro switches and the 5V supply you already have. You'll do this for under £20.

Any of them is far better than not having any at all and Soft limits work very well but require HOME switches to work properly as the Limits are set from the MACHINE ZERO position.

There is one other POOR MANS option that doesn't require any switches and will let you set MACHINE ZERO with some repeatability and along with SOFT LIMITS keep you safer and allow you to find WORK ZERO with reasonable accuracy.? . . . Run the machine slowly into the end stops and set REF ALL HOME at this position every time you start the machine or lose position thru crashing or E-stop.

It's crude but can be effective if the end stops are accurately lined up at each side.