Page 41 of 82 FirstFirst ... 31394041424351 ... LastLast
  1. #401
    Quick vid showing the drilling with the guide in place, I've not showed setting up to drill a hole as I'm sure that's pretty self explanatory...saying that so is drilling the hole...oh well

    The pillar drill is a bit old and knackered and I think could do with a little TLC....

    Neil...

    Build log...here

  2. The Following User Says Thank You to njhussey For This Useful Post:


  3. #402
    Did a bit of shopping on Friday and it turned up today I bought a 1200mm Veritas straight edge, a couple of 6" engineers squares and 4 100mm G cramps.

    Placing the straight edge against the rail there was a bow in the middle of the rail of about 3 thou so I loosened all the master x rail bolts and clamped (lightly) the straight edge to the rail in 6 places. I then tightened the bolts checking with a feeler that there was no gap between the reference side of the rail and the straight edge. Once this was done I placed the straight edge on the reference side of the rail and tried the feeler gauge again. It was the same all the way down with no gaps so I'm happy with that. I'm going to clamp (lightly) the straight edge to the rail again and then one by one take out the M5 socket cap heads and threadlock them in. This should give me my master reference X rail to set the second X axis rail from.

    Click image for larger version. 

Name:	X rail straight.jpg 
Views:	166 
Size:	386.0 KB 
ID:	14399

    I wanted to see if there was/how much twist there is in the rails. Placing the straight edge across the two rails on top of the carriages I tried to get a feeler gauge underneath the edge and couldn't. Shone a light from the other side and couldn't see a thing so it looks like the epoxy has done it's job in finding the level. Again I'm happy with that!

    Click image for larger version. 

Name:	Twist check-2.jpg 
Views:	174 
Size:	387.2 KB 
ID:	14400

    Click image for larger version. 

Name:	Twist check.jpg 
Views:	176 
Size:	369.2 KB 
ID:	14401

    Waiting on my Tooling plate to come before I square the second X axis rail so I'm just making drawings so I know where I'm drilling holes, machining pockets for steppers ballscrew housings etc, what size belts and pulleys to get etc. etc.
    Last edited by njhussey; 12-01-2015 at 11:56 AM.
    Neil...

    Build log...here

  4. The Following User Says Thank You to njhussey For This Useful Post:


  5. #403
    Quote Originally Posted by njhussey View Post
    Surely the twist will be sorted when the rail is bolted tightly down, that's assuming that the epoxy is perfectly flat of course?
    Quite likely yes - but how much force will bending the bearing to 'flat' impose upon it? The answer is a lot, since the stiffness of these bearings is still very high in the rolling direction. It also depends on how stiff the gantry is and how wide it is - something has to bend. A fairly high force wont make much difference to how smoothly the bearings roll, since as I mentioned in the last post their co-efficient of friction is very low. It will still shorten the life of the bearings though.

    It's different with round rail bearings - clearly they have zero stiffness in the rolling direction, so angular misalignment doesn't affect the force of the bearings (within reason).

    If you look in the datasheet for the rails and bearings you'll find specifications for the maximum linear and angular misalignment. These are based on getting the rated lifetime out of the bearings, so if you exceed it by a little, the bearings just wont last as long. Though on a home machine it might still outlive you!

    Quote Originally Posted by njhussey View Post
    I wanted to see if there was/how much twist there is in the rails. Placing the straight edge across the two rails on top of the carriages I tried to get a feeler gauge underneath the edge and couldn't. Shone a light from the other side and couldn't see a thing so it looks like the epoxy has done it's job in finding the level. Again I'm happy with that!
    That's a good indication that they're close, but since you've got the straight edge you might as well measure it carefully. The issue with what you just did is it's hard to measure very small angles and you don't get a reading for what the angle actually is. Instead you need to do something like in my build log - stick the dial indicator on one of the bearings and mount the straight edge parallel to the rail, but some distance (say 200mm) horizontally away from it. Make the indicator touch the straight edge, with it's movement perpendicular to the surface. That will convert the angular reading into a linear reading and amplify it. You don't need to worry too much about getting the straight edge level, as if you plot the readings on a graph that will just make a linear error which you can subtract.

    Just out of interest, how much did the straight edge cost?
    Old router build log here. New router build log here. Lathe build log here.
    Electric motorbike project here.

  6. #404
    Quote Originally Posted by Jonathan View Post
    Quite likely yes - but how much force will bending the bearing to 'flat' impose upon it? The answer is a lot, since the stiffness of these bearings is still very high in the rolling direction. It also depends on how stiff the gantry is and how wide it is - something has to bend. A fairly high force wont make much difference to how smoothly the bearings roll, since as I mentioned in the last post their co-efficient of friction is very low. It will still shorten the life of the bearings though.

    It's different with round rail bearings - clearly they have zero stiffness in the rolling direction, so angular misalignment doesn't affect the force of the bearings (within reason).

    If you look in the datasheet for the rails and bearings you'll find specifications for the maximum linear and angular misalignment. These are based on getting the rated lifetime out of the bearings, so if you exceed it by a little, the bearings just wont last as long. Though on a home machine it might still outlive you!



    That's a good indication that they're close, but since you've got the straight edge you might as well measure it carefully. The issue with what you just did is it's hard to measure very small angles and you don't get a reading for what the angle actually is. Instead you need to do something like in my build log - stick the dial indicator on one of the bearings and mount the straight edge parallel to the rail, but some distance (say 200mm) horizontally away from it. Make the indicator touch the straight edge, with it's movement perpendicular to the surface. That will convert the angular reading into a linear reading and amplify it. You don't need to worry too much about getting the straight edge level, as if you plot the readings on a graph that will just make a linear error which you can subtract.

    Just out of interest, how much did the straight edge cost?
    I'm not too worried about the life of the bearings, as you say I'm sure it will outlive me and for what it's being used for. I will measure it though out of interest as I have the straight edge ...

    The straight edge was from Axminster http://www.axminster.co.uk/veritas-a...-straight-edge it's got a claimed accuracy of 0.075mm over the 1270mm length which although not super accurate is more than good enough I think for my purposes.
    Last edited by njhussey; 12-01-2015 at 04:31 PM.
    Neil...

    Build log...here

  7. #405
    Neale's Avatar
    Lives in Plymouth, United Kingdom. Last Activity: 4 Hours Ago Has been a member for 4-5 years. Has a total post count of 908. Received thanks 147 times, giving thanks to others 5 times.
    Picking up Jonathan's comment re stiffness in roll and manufacturer's tolerance...

    HiWin 20mm rails have a maximum permitted height difference of 0.130mm with 500mm rail spacing. That corresponds to a difference of 0.013mm across that 50mm or so bearing block. Don't know about you, but that's about a quarter of my thinnest feeler - and that's the maximum allowable tolerance. As for stiffness - and I don't recommend you do this at home as I only did it by accident - my gantry structure probably weighs around 30kg, and I managed to leave it hanging while only attached to the carriage at one end. It probably dropped by no more than 25mm or so. I hate to think of the abuse of the pair of bearing blocks taking the weight, but what's done is done. I shall be reporting on my experiments with epoxy (i.e. mistakes and how I've tried to correct them) elsewhere when I'm actually happy with the results, but in simple terms, it's a lot easier to get the rails level than to remove twist. The main reason to get the rails level (given that you will take out minor variations by machining the spoil board anyway) is that with, say, a 1000mm rail spacing, the max rail height difference spec only allow a height difference of about 0.26mm (10 thou). That's not too difficult with epoxy, and I would expect rather better with just a bit of care. But twist? As long as it is constant, then the gantry to bearing block joint can be shimmed/adjusted to suit but you only need a tiny amount of varying twist to go way out of spec. I'm still trying to get mine somewhere near acceptable. I'm using a sensitive level (0.02mm/m readings) to check.

    It would be easy to say that the problem is that I'm chasing irrelevant numbers with tools that are working at their limit, except that a trial bolt-down of rails with gantry mounted gave clear signs of graunching bearings even when I was happy with levels. Suck-it-and-see tells me that there's something wrong.

  8. #406
    Click image for larger version. 

Name:	NSK parallelism.jpg 
Views:	103 
Size:	57.5 KB 
ID:	14403

    These are the NSK specs on running parallelism....seems in theory I have about 16 microns for my 800mm spaced rails to play with....to be honest I think you can keep chasing numbers till you're red in the face and for a router that's going to be used for wood and plastics mostly with some aluminium then I'm not going to get my knickers in a twist about it.

    I'm going to do a quick test as Jonathan did (I'm intreagued now) and then once the gantry is made bolt it to the carriages and see what they sound and feel like.
    Neil...

    Build log...here

  9. #407
    I bet you wonder how you ever managed without a straight edge now
    Last edited by EddyCurrent; 13-01-2015 at 06:27 AM.
    Spelling mistakes are not intentional, I only seem to see them some time after I've posted

  10. #408
    Picked up the cut tooling plate just now....gantry build can start next week though first got to design and build a pantograph arm for putting in M6 UNC bolts and grease nipples into 1000 units we're currently assembling for a contract....oh, that's after I've finished machining a custom unit that's just been ordered. Work keeps getting in the way of playing!

    Click image for larger version. 

Name:	Gantry Ali.jpg 
Views:	152 
Size:	177.0 KB 
ID:	14438
    Neil...

    Build log...here

  11. #409
    Been drawing up the gantry in Geomagic 3D program today. Getting there, so far all the holes etc. line up!

    Click image for larger version. 

Name:	Gantry_assy.jpg 
Views:	139 
Size:	197.1 KB 
ID:	14477
    Neil...

    Build log...here

  12. #410
    Looks good software on their website, can't wait to get stuck into that aluminium plate eh !
    Spelling mistakes are not intentional, I only seem to see them some time after I've posted

Page 41 of 82 FirstFirst ... 31394041424351 ... LastLast

Similar Threads

  1. Does anyone want to build me a cnc router?
    By totally useless in forum Open Source Designs & Plans
    Replies: 25
    Last Post: 04-05-2014, 11:44 PM
  2. My new, and first build....comments greatfully received
    By berk in forum Gantry/Router Machines & Building
    Replies: 7
    Last Post: 12-01-2014, 02:15 PM
  3. BUILD LOG: CNC Router New Build
    By PilotTom in forum DIY Router Build Logs
    Replies: 12
    Last Post: 25-05-2013, 02:49 PM
  4. BUILD LOG: A3 Router Build
    By GTJim in forum DIY Router Build Logs
    Replies: 6
    Last Post: 17-02-2012, 11:53 AM
  5. CNC construction TUNISIA give your comments
    By ali hedi in forum Gantry/Router Machines & Building
    Replies: 5
    Last Post: 06-07-2011, 10:58 PM

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •