Thread: Time to go vertical.!
Ok for a long time now I've had it in my mind to build a vertical CNC machine, either free standing or off the wall.!!. . . . . WHY.??
Well it occurred to me that seen has I mainly cut Aluminium and I clamp or screw every thing down to the bed, inc the waste material that it doesn’t really matter if the machine stands vertical, horizontal or even upside down on the ceiling (That was Jonathans crazy idea not mine.!)
It also occurred to me that the bennifits would be meny and the negatives few.!! . . Think about it for minute.!
1: When cutting dry all the chips fall away from the cutter so virtually no re-cut giving much better finish with longer tool life.
2: Chips fall with gravity and collect in the bottom instead of being flung round the shop or having to be blown away again flying around the shop.
3: Easy to use coolant or air with low flow rate so less mess and spray plus it wash’s the chips and heat away quickly and neatly into a filter collection container at bottom of bed. Simply lift or slide filter tray out with chips on it when done. Could even have worm drive system into collection bin like the big boys do.!!
4: Easy access to all the bed area so easier to position material and less prone to cutting in just one area so wearing screws etc in that one spot. Also easier on my bad back because I’m not bet over machine.!!
5: Massive saving in workshop floor space, basicly taking the same space as a large wardrobe.
6: Easy to build full enclosure using simple frame with folding doors and 1 or 2 sides, less noise and mess contained. Again it's basicly a CNC machine in a wardrobe.!
Negatives: (or Negative.!)
1: Slightly more akward to hold material and clamp at same time.!! . . . Easy fix just use a temp slide to rest material against while clamping then slide away while cutting.!!
That’s the only negative I can find.!
Ever since I thought about it I’ve resisted the urge to whop off the legs of my machine and hang it off the wall. . BUT . .All the time it’s been like that bloody Precious ring from “Lord of the Rings” . . . . . calling me.!!! Anyway after over a year of resisting the sneaky bastard got me didn’t it. . .I cracked.!!
Well I didn't fully crack I more edged my bets and decided to test the water by simply unbolting my machine from floor, up ending and leaning at a 80deg angle against the wall. Whopped 2 raw bolts into wall just to hold it and give it a go.?
My original plan was to orientate it so the X Axis(twin screws) was horizontal meaning the heavy gantry would travel horizontal and the Y axis would move vertical against gravity. This would work best regards fighting gravity but it had other issues like mess falling onto bottom screw, harder to access bed, more work when chopped.
So after consultation with my partner in crime(mate) it was decided that just for test purposes it would be easiest to just stand in vertical position and try it.?
If it didn't work good then easy enough to position horizontal and try and if it didn't work like that then put it back on it's feet with nothing lost but several hours setting up.
It worked and it worked far far far better than even I expected. .:dance::dance:
I did several test's in Ali upto 3mm DOC which is the max I cut at with various cutters 6,10,12mm all done dry and the difference was amazing, all the chips just fell away, even on the horizontal cuts. Nice clean finish and lovely clean cutting sound with absolutly no re-cut.
Next I tried to find the limit but without causing too much stress. So I used a resin impregnated MDF thats very hard and abrasive, harder than most normal hard woods but not as hard as Ali. I did a 5mm deep single pass with a knackerd 6mm single flute cutter up the vertical so pulling gantry against gravity at 5mtr/min and it breezed thru. So did another at 10mm Doc 7mtr/min which is flatout on my machine. Again whistled straight thru at which my jaw dropped.
Anyway now I've proved to myself the concept works it's time to alter the frame and set up every thing up again, then build the enclosure frame etc.
Will post pics and vid when everythings as I'd like it. Just so chuffed and excited I just had to post. .
The Following User Says Thank You to JAZZCNC For This Useful Post:
WOW Jazz I can't believe you've reinvented the wheel :rofl::rofl::rofl:
what a great idea :idea: I think you suggested it to me some time ago and even suggested it in some one build post ??
the only draw back I can see is length of material you could use(ceiling to floor distance) :naughty::naughty:and the fact you wouldn't use the front of the machine that much as it is near to the floor ??
Just out of interest what material is your frame made from??
Dam! Now I will have to build a brick wall in my new workshop to support a vertical router. Thats just genius Jazz. Look forward to some piccies and a video of that 10mm cut.
BruceThe more I know, I know, I know the less. (John Owen)
Also the machine doesn't sit directly on the floor and infact will be on a steel boxsection frame thats bolted to the floor and supports the machines frame and allows for adjustment.
Also the machine is raised about 12" at rear and 18" at front due to being angled back. Infact really the machine will be effectively free standing and doesn't need a wall thou mine will be mounted against the wall with shock absorbing rubber mountings. (At the minute it's sat on concrete blocks and axle stands with a few bolts into wall)
The whole bed is easily reached, far easier than when flat. Straight away in use I knew this was going to be a big bennifit to me and my Bad back because reaching over my wide bed when clamping large jobs killed me, esp if I'd been stood watching over the machine for a while.!!
Frame is all 50x50 box section steel.
This orientation was going to be my first choice and if building from scratch then thats how it would be done but the way my machine built it suits me better how it is.
Bruce just for you I've done a quick vid showing it in all it's glorious roughness warts n all.!!
Has you'll see it's very very very very rough at minute, the frame will be braced and cut so it goes back another 18" it will also bolted to a load bearing supporting frame which allows for adjustment, this will be bolted to the floor not the wall.?
I had concerns about the wall expanding with heat and shaking with high winds and this movemnet transfering into the machine. The supporting frame will handle supporting the top and at most I may just butt upto wall with rubber buffers. May even put lift up/down wheels so it can be rolled in and out then anchored to floor, thou think it will be a bit top heavy for moving around too much but will allow for easy access if something breaks.!!
All in all it will stand off the wall 1mtr(40") this is to the top of the Z axis when raised which is it's most protruding point. When parked with Z axis down just above bed it's 850mm(34").
This will be it's parked position when not in use and the gantry will come to rest at the bottom on some rubber buffers to take the strain off the ballscrews when not in use (Sarah's idea Micheal's wife, she's not just a prity face smarter, sharper than a laser cutter).
Didn't push it flatout only 5mtr/min 10mm DOC. because of very knackerd 6mm single flute cutter and no water in spindle, you can tell from the sound the cutter didn't like it and infact after this I tried to cut straight thru 13mm and it got half way and snapped cutter.!! . . .didn't stall thou which I was happy about.:dance: . . . . AND. . . Just look at the room I've got back in the shop plus when it's all finshed and further back with coolant and chip collection try in the bottom along with doors on front so full enclosed it will be brilliant. .
Won't happen for a week or so because I'm wanting to fully test just in case any gremlins appear that I hadn't foreseen. I will cut several jobs with where it is, these will be a good test because there long-ish jobs in Ali and even some mild steel slots so should show any issue's. . . . I've also got to finish off the electrics new home.!
Here it is and don't comment on the state of the shop or machine.!! . . .Yes I know it's rough engineering at it's best and an untidy shit hole.!
looks great, a nice swarf conveyer at the bottom would be usefull.
conveyer gives you the option to remove any wanted items easily.
Strewth! That was quick. This looks exciting. I wonder if a vacuum bed would be good for holding at this angle?
BruceThe more I know, I know, I know the less. (John Owen)
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