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  1. #91
    Obviously section 1.10 of the Hiwin manual is the 'correct' method but if you don't have the gear . . .
    To mount rails similar to yours, I first clamped a straight edge along the top with the edge parallel to the beam and for the Hiwin rail to be in the centre.
    Then I clamped the Hiwin rail to the beam making sure it was tight up against the straight edge. The holes in the rail are about 5.5mm diameter so I used a 5.5mm drill in every mounting hole to make a dimple in the epoxy similar to using a centre punch. This allowed my 4.2mm tapping drill to go right through the epoxy and beam, all central to the Hiwin mounting holes. The other rail was mounted in a similar way but using a DTI gauge to keep them parallel.
    Last edited by EddyCurrent; 10-02-2014 at 01:54 PM.
    Spelling mistakes are not intentional, I only seem to see them some time after I've posted

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  3. #92
    Quote Originally Posted by silyavski View Post
    Now something very important. I will not move the frame at all. After a week has passed will solder the gantry and sides. Then will turn upside down the gantry and lay the upper side on the level surface of the epoxy. Then will pour epoxy on the gantry side plates that step on the Hiwin bearing blocks, connecting them together. Also pour epoxy on the lower side of the gantry beam. When dry, will turn the nagtry to normal position , rest the leveled side plates / epoxy on epoxy/ and pour the final epoxy at the top side of the gantry beam.
    So with these steps i will achieve all hiwin rails lay on epoxy surfaces that are paralel to each other. The only thing left will be to ensure squareness of Z. I hope to achieve a quite precise machine.
    Hi Silyavski,

    Guess you have been pulled away onto other things for a while, but I really hope you will be coming back to continue with this great build thread. . . . .

    I am particularly interested in whether your intended technique worked in getting the gantry rails parallel?

    Cheers, Andy

  4. #93
    Quote Originally Posted by AndyGuid View Post
    Hi Silyavski,

    Guess you have been pulled away onto other things for a while, but I really hope you will be coming back to continue with this great build thread. . . . .

    I am particularly interested in whether your intended technique worked in getting the gantry rails parallel?

    Cheers, Andy
    Hi,
    yes its been a while. I am not the fastest builder around it seems .


    Basically what happened is that apart from other jobs and orders on my small machine, i had to change house , and it was 3 weeks madness. Now i am happyly suited in a new house with a proper garage/workshop/ so from 2 weeks i am continuing the build.

    Here is what happened in short / only problems /:

    1. Mistake one
    I bumped the frame a couple of times when i was trying to reach the washing machine. So it moved a bit. As i wanted perfection in leveling...Only if i had hot glued the legs to the floor , this mistake will be not repeated again. So here is the solution. Again pouring epoxy, this time on my soldering jig. Waiting , fixing, pouring again, turning around, pouring. It took some time. A week.

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    2. Next mistakes
    Then when the epoxy on all necessary surfaces on the gantry was dry enough, i decided to open the holes necessary for the bolts to hold the gantry to the bearing blocks.
    WOW, another mistake. The epoxy chipped and the drill bit unglued the first of 4 epoxy plate from the gantry. Now i was worried. So i marked it and cut the corners as seen in the photo. I marked all others with numbers and crossed lines and using Dremel filed the corners. And...everything unglued. The good thing was that all was marked so i knew which is which and where it has been exactly. So i finished them, cleaned everything and using instant glue and pressure/clamps fit then where they have been.

    Perfect fit, the glue squeezed equally , checked with the straight edge, well it was perfect. Hell, i was worried, and the epoxy was starting to finish

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    3. Painting problems

    I actually bought a car paint. But as it was quite expensive i decided to base coat with anti-oxide yellow paint meant to be painted directly over the metal.

    I found the following things:
    -successfully painting small things doesn't mean you can paint a big thing well at home
    -having pro HVLP gun doesn't help if your compressor is small and you want to paint big things. Not enough air.
    -having smaller airbrush type gun doesn't help either
    -not having dry filtering, i mean real dry filter on the air line , means bad things happen...
    -painting yellow is a mean thing, really mean. 3 liters of paint. Well i sued a roller at the end, as otherwise i had to paint it a whole week.

    in short-painting is not my strength :-)

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    4. Bolting the gantry to the frame and aligning the gantry rails.

    Needless to say - a lot of problems.

    a/ First to say i have dry bolted the gantry before painting all. It was ok. So what was my surprise when everything was painted, the machine fixed on the welding jigs for comfort and the gantry will not fit. So i called a friend that helped me and 3 times i had to lift the gantry and lower it, mean while widening the holes. The reason. This is crazy- the machine is outside, the sun heats the frame and it widens. cause i made the machine in the winter...
    So basically now i cover all the time it so it could not heat . My garage is small i mean to work inside.

    So at the end i squared perfectly the gantry and bolted it


    b/ Now next unsuspected problem. How do i fit the rails on the gantry to be perfectly square with the long rails on the frame? I knew i could do it somehow but in reality it was a big challenge.
    I know how to do it if say i make 10 same machines, a fixture and no problem. But how to do it on the cheap. Cause this machine really ate a lot of money spend on little things.
    After a lot of thought i fixed the straight edge perpendicular to the base rails and decided to start with the upper rail first.
    Once the upper rail was square, there came the problem with the lower rail. A friend of mine says we have all necessary stuff always at hand. So i was in no rush, thought it a whole weekend and just have done it.
    Another difficulty was that i do all alone at home with no help, so first i more or less squared it using clamps and then drilled and tapped 2 holes only. Then aligned and bolted until happy. Then drilled the rest of the holes directly on place and bolted. Photos speak better than words how all of this was done.

    Of course i managed to chip the paint here and there so it seems when everything is working i have to retouch it at the end. No big deal.


    2 equal pieces of aluminum square bar were used to fix more or less the correct distance to the upper rail.

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    Both were precisely squared to the straight edge which was squared to the base rails. 2 pieces of rail were used to support them, a kind of parallels . Not seen on the pictures at the end only one was used at both sides so to make sure the fit is perfect and is really squared.

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    Holes were marked, 6mm drill used to clean the epoxy so it will not unglue or raise during drilling the beam, then 4.2mm drill to make the holes and then tapped. With the help of the nice little block i have.

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    On all drilling and tapping the gantry was clamped so it will not move around. here is the fixture which helped me align the lower gantry rail. Dont laugh at my square, had to clamp a rule to make it longer. I said we have all we need at home, just some imagination is needed.
    Used thickness gauge though to align it perfectly /yes i love that word/.

    Note should be taken here that when i bolted the 2 plates from the Z i pushed them from behind till they touched the screws, so i know they are alligned to the bearing blockes, as the holes are laser cut. I mean because of this i am sure that their edges are parallel with the corresponding rails. Later i will have some additional opportunity to align them on one plane/the z face plate/ as i can move one of them a bit back.


    5. The result till now
    I am very late with this machine. Good that my friend still suffers me :-)
    Thats all for now, problems or no i am quite happy with the result. I can not say what the precision till now is, though i can say imprecision is not obvious or visible in any way. means i use precision squares and they fit well everywhere where measured. No obvious gaps or workarounds. Lets say that for sure i am still under 0.1 mm accumulated squareness. Though it took a lot of time to achieve this.


    What do you think? I hope it clears some problems one could encounter on a DIY build.

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  6. #94
    After your problems it's looking nice, I like the colour.
    Spelling mistakes are not intentional, I only seem to see them some time after I've posted

  7. #95
    Neale's Avatar
    Lives in Plymouth, United Kingdom. Last Activity: 6 Hours Ago Has been a member for 4-5 years. Has a total post count of 786. Received thanks 109 times, giving thanks to others 5 times.
    What did you use to build the dams to hold the epoxy? I can't quite make out the detail in the photos.

  8. #96
    Quote Originally Posted by EddyCurrent View Post
    After your problems it's looking nice, I like the colour.
    +1
    .Me

  9. #97
    Syliavski nice work. Congladulations!!!!
    How thick steel plate did you finally use and what is the weight of the gantry ( so far without Z axis)?
    The creative adult, is the child who survived

  10. #98
    It's looking great and STURDY!
    many thanks for the update Silyavski.
    Your build has given me plenty of food for thought!!!

  11. #99
    Quote Originally Posted by EddyCurrent View Post
    After your problems it's looking nice, I like the colour.
    Thanks! I like to discuss here in detail the so called "problems" , not cause they are real problems, especially for a metalworker with the proper tools, machine and workshop.

    I would rather say difficulties for the DIYer on the cheap where solutions have to be with what you have at hand and at the same time aiming precision.

    Quote Originally Posted by Neale View Post
    What did you use to build the dams to hold the epoxy? I can't quite make out the detail in the photos.
    Some post back you can see it on the photos. Alu angle profile, 10x10x1mm x 1m, very cheap. Instant glued to the frame and then hot glued from outside.

    Its seems the epoxy is ok, as far as common sense is used, the profile is clean and 10mm margin is left from the bearing rail, as it/the epoxy/ tends to rise 5mm from the contact point with the margin, whatever the material.

    PS:
    -When lifting the angles or whatever you use to form the dams , it is wiser to clamp here and there the epoxy and always take care not to lift it ,break it or chip it.
    -when drilling for the rails which for example are screwed with M5 screw, first mark the holes, drill with 6mm drill then center 4.2mm drill, drill and the tap M5. So the epoxy around the holes will not bother you, lift or chip, or heat and lift.
    -with time , especially temperature changes can make the epoxy very easy to unglue. Clamping it is necessary in this case.

    Quote Originally Posted by Lee Roberts View Post
    +1
    Thanks! Great forum :-) and a lot of help.

    Quote Originally Posted by ba99297 View Post
    Syliavski nice work. Conglatulations!!!!
    How thick steel plate did you finally use and what is the weight of the gantry ( so far without Z axis)?
    10mm steel plates, laser cut. Laser cutting the holes saves a lot of fiddling but care should be taken cause some long and thin section parts are not perfectly straight on their surface plain, so should be checked against straight edge where necessary and plastic mallet used to straighten them.

    Now looking back at the drawings, instead of 0.5mm and 1mm bigger than the respective M screw size, i would advise at least 2mm bigger diameter. The paint eats it, the straightness eats it, adjustment eats it, so i constantly had to mount, check, unmount and open more the holes. Say if you have M6 screw, the hole from the beginning should have been 8mm diameter
    Last edited by Boyan Silyavski; 14-05-2014 at 04:00 PM.

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  13. #100
    Quote Originally Posted by silyavski View Post
    Thanks! Great forum :-) and a lot of help.
    Hi,

    Your welcome Silyavski, from your build log came great discussion and realisation for others.

    So, thank YOU for sharing your adventures and returning help to others, the results are a great forum and community.

    In unity everyone can be successful, this is my original goal.

    .Me
    .Me

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