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  1. #31
    Going to be honest now and you may not like it.!!

    It appears to me that you don't have enough machining experience yet to justify laying out big money on machines when you don't even know what you require.
    For instance the best mill or CNC machine won't make relocating your part any more accurate if you don't know how to do it.!

    The fact the machine you built doesn't make the grade is purely down to poor weak design and choice of materials. The fact you can't relocate on centre is down to your low level of experience.
    If you'd made fixture jigs to hold your work and indexed to a known fixed reference point then it's easy.

    But your machine is so weak it will flex like jelly so this can't happen. Trying to re-locate centres without a fixture is hard at best of time on any machine and requires accurate devices to help. So no matter weak or Strong if you haven't got the abilty or the equipment then you will always struggle.

    Your weak build is to blame for low part accurecy for sure but has nothing to do with reloctating and no amount of strength in the machine will helps this as it's down to you to come up with ways to fixture.

    Properly built DIY machine which uses good components will easily do what you want.

  2. #32
    Chaz's Avatar
    Lives in Ickenham, West London, United Kingdom. Last Activity: 13 Hours Ago Has been a member for 4-5 years. Has a total post count of 973. Received thanks 69 times, giving thanks to others 42 times.
    Quote Originally Posted by JAZZCNC View Post
    Going to be honest now and you may not like it.!!

    It appears to me that you don't have enough machining experience yet to justify laying out big money on machines when you don't even know what you require.
    For instance the best mill or CNC machine won't make relocating your part any more accurate if you don't know how to do it.!

    The fact the machine you built doesn't make the grade is purely down to poor weak design and choice of materials. The fact you can't relocate on centre is down to your low level of experience.
    If you'd made fixture jigs to hold your work and indexed to a known fixed reference point then it's easy.

    But your machine is so weak it will flex like jelly so this can't happen. Trying to re-locate centres without a fixture is hard at best of time on any machine and requires accurate devices to help. So no matter weak or Strong if you haven't got the abilty or the equipment then you will always struggle.

    Your weak build is to blame for low part accurecy for sure but has nothing to do with reloctating and no amount of strength in the machine will helps this as it's down to you to come up with ways to fixture.

    Properly built DIY machine which uses good components will easily do what you want.
    Ah, a bit harsh, but that OK.

    I dont know what I need, hence the thread to ask for advice.

    The relocation of the centre was badly explained. I dont think the machine had the rigidity to be accurate enough and the centre was the easiest place to spot this. But agreed, I have a lot to learn and yes, I dont know the techniques.

    So I consider myself 'told off', no problems there. At least I tried based on what I could do on my own.

    Are you able to link to something that you would consider suitable on the DIY side?

    Out of interest, what would a machine like this cost in the UK?

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=26RNc0OA_fU

    Its a Tormach PCNC 1100


  3. #33
    Quote Originally Posted by Chaz View Post
    Ye, understood and lesson learnt with schoolfees to match.

    Can you link to something that you refer to as a suitable DIY type machine please? Appreciate your time with the feedback / comments.
    There are several Fixed gantry machines on the Forum search for those.
    To get the strength you require then fixed gantry is the way to go and built from steel if possible. Moving gantry machines can do it but they need to be very very strong.

  4. #34
    Quote Originally Posted by Chaz View Post
    Ah, a bit harsh, but that OK.

    I dont know what I need, hence the thread to ask for advice.

    The relocation of the centre was badly explained. I dont think the machine had the rigidity to be accurate enough and the centre was the easiest place to spot this. But agreed, I have a lot to learn and yes, I dont know the techniques.
    Erm well sorry but better being said than just thought and seeing you taking wrong route.!

    When ever you have to flip parts and require more than 2 it's worth taking the time to make a fixture Jig. Provided the Jig is well made and indexed to a fixed known location you will always get back to absolute accurate position. If the machine is made from jelly then you'll still be back in absolutle position you started it's just the machine doesn't go there if it's wobblying about.!!

  5. #35
    Chaz's Avatar
    Lives in Ickenham, West London, United Kingdom. Last Activity: 13 Hours Ago Has been a member for 4-5 years. Has a total post count of 973. Received thanks 69 times, giving thanks to others 42 times.
    Something like this?

    http://www.cnczone.com/forums/diy-cn...82294-cnc.html

    Found the vid of it milling alu, then found the thread.

  6. #36
    Not trying to sell you or anyone anything here but may be would be of interest to you. If time is not an issue, cause i am a bit busy right now.

    I am currently designing a couple of small CNCs cause i want to start small home production of quality machines. All will be made entirely of 20mm aluminum plate. All 200mm Z axis.

    So i have semi finished 3 designs of small machines. I don't want to load you with information now, just the thing is that maybe i will start making first the 600x400x200 moving gantry prototype. As i have semi finished drawing of the fixed gantry machine if you are interested i could provide you the drawing, only condition will be to use what elements i tell you, so you act like a test pilot

    The said machine will easily handle 3kw spindle or even much more.

    400x400x200mm, the bearing design and rails spacing is already tested on my previous build 1, the yellow machine, so no risks here. Parts will be around 3000$$ so you only have to put all together.

    Apart from being light years better from anything i know of for the same $$ it would be extremely strong and beautiful, remember, all parts 20mm aluminum including the tool table.

    Even the moving gantry machine will easily do the same plus its even more versatile. The yellow machine using mere 0.8kw spindle handles with fully extended Z aluminum with perfect finish with 1.5mm depth of cut, 800mm/min 12000RPM

    And remember i am talking about OTT machines capable of working 24/7, not toys.


    About the Tormach, i dont believe it could hold 0.05mm precision from what i have read around.
    project 1 , 2, Dust Shoe ...

  7. #37
    Chaz's Avatar
    Lives in Ickenham, West London, United Kingdom. Last Activity: 13 Hours Ago Has been a member for 4-5 years. Has a total post count of 973. Received thanks 69 times, giving thanks to others 42 times.
    Quote Originally Posted by silyavski View Post
    Not trying to sell you or anyone anything here but may be would be of interest to you. If time is not an issue, cause i am a bit busy right now.

    I am currently designing a couple of small CNCs cause i want to start small home production of quality machines. All will be made entirely of 20mm aluminum plate. All 200mm Z axis.

    So i have semi finished 3 designs of small machines. I don't want to load you with information now, just the thing is that maybe i will start making first the 600x400x200 moving gantry prototype. As i have semi finished drawing of the fixed gantry machine if you are interested i could provide you the drawing, only condition will be to use what elements i tell you, so you act like a test pilot

    The said machine will easily handle 3kw spindle or even much more.

    400x400x200mm, the bearing design and rails spacing is already tested on my previous build 1, the yellow machine, so no risks here. Parts will be around 3000$$ so you only have to put all together.

    Apart from being light years better from anything i know of for the same $$ it would be extremely strong and beautiful, remember, all parts 20mm aluminum including the tool table.

    Even the moving gantry machine will easily do the same plus its even more versatile. The yellow machine using mere 0.8kw spindle handles with fully extended Z aluminum with perfect finish with 1.5mm depth of cut, 800mm/min 12000RPM

    And remember i am talking about OTT machines capable of working 24/7, not toys.


    About the Tormach, i dont believe it could hold 0.05mm precision from what i have read around.
    Sure, am interested. Can you provide more detail / info please?

    Thought the Tormach looked OK for what it was.

  8. #38
    Quote Originally Posted by Chaz View Post
    Something like this?

    Found the vid of it milling alu, then found the thread.
    Well it's nicely made but could be stronger. The Vid cutting aluminium is more like scratching than cutting. I've built Moving gantry routers designed just for wood that cut aluminium deeper than he is doing.
    With a Fixed gantry machine and decent spindle it will do a much better job of munching Ali.!!

  9. #39
    Chaz's Avatar
    Lives in Ickenham, West London, United Kingdom. Last Activity: 13 Hours Ago Has been a member for 4-5 years. Has a total post count of 973. Received thanks 69 times, giving thanks to others 42 times.
    Quote Originally Posted by JAZZCNC View Post
    Well it's nicely made but could be stronger. The Vid cutting aluminium is more like scratching than cutting. I've built Moving gantry routers designed just for wood that cut aluminium deeper than he is doing.
    With a Fixed gantry machine and decent spindle it will do a much better job of munching Ali.!!
    Have just found a thread where you built someone a machine. Interested in doing the same for me? Feel free to PM me if interested.

  10. #40
    Quote Originally Posted by Chaz View Post
    Sure, am interested. Can you provide more detail / info please?

    Thought the Tormach looked OK for what it was.
    For what it is, its OK. Ask somebody on machinist forum and they will say its a crap and you need HAAS mini mill


    About the one on the video. Has some small important details overlooked and some weak links , that bothers me..., not up to my standard. of design i mean.

    at the left is the fixed gantry, still not finished.




    This is the one i intend to prototype first. I was going to hide it until ready and physically finished, but as sooner or later has to pass the "Dean test" , better now than later
    I will be starting to buy parts for it next week. It will be solid aluminum beast.
    Last edited by Boyan Silyavski; 17-05-2015 at 06:33 PM. Reason: drawings removed
    project 1 , 2, Dust Shoe ...

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