I will join in on emailing them! Will be a little while till I buy one so maybe they will see sense!!
So the CSMIO controller is on its way lol, will take this thread as an opportunity to ask about new ideas for my new panel design.
question 1: I have acquired the Pilz PNOZ X5 , can it be used to connect safety reset , leadshine EM806 fault lines, VFD NC/NO connection in similar fashion as is described in the CSMIO manual?
question 2: I would like to use one power cable to hook all the components including VFD, will 1 wall outlet be enough to power 2.2KW VFD , 4 3.1Nm motors max 4A + misc 12V/24V power etc? sorry if it sounds dumb or like I didn't do my homework, I know the total power would be over the supplied 13A plug ( we use standard UK plugs here 220v) but because I have the oppurtinity to convert the wall outlet to a little bigger plug which has round pins and is rated 15A, in my humble opinion I think it will be rare to reach full power on spindle and all motors and everything at the same time right? in that case would either 13A or 15A be enough to power up the whole thing or should I use two wall sockets as I'm doing now?
question 3: is power line filter worth it for VFD?
question 4: is magnetic contactor helpful to power up the VFD? in my VFD manual it mentions it's safer or something in case braking transistor starts a fire ( I do plan on using the braking resistor ) so a setup with magnetic contactor controlled by the CSMIO worth it? or do they even do it like that?
Q#1: Well yes because it's just a relay, all be it expensive one and how you use that relay in your safety system is up to you.
Now to be honest the manual does say that what they show is just a minimum of safety and to me what they show I wouldn't use because it shuts every thing down including the controller which isn't required.
In E-stop situation you really only need to shut down the main PSU and drives along with anything else that can hurt you or cause damage.
#2 Yes 13A will easily handle everything you throw at the machine.
#3 Depends on your incoming supply really. If it's dirty line then yes would be worth it. Do I fit them.? NO. Generaly only if I have problems which I rarely do.
#4 Yes the VFD and the Main PSU along with any other high current devices are best run thru Contactors. They are just relays with contacts more suited to high loads. ( On Clives quite correct request I'll make clear Contactors break both sides of the contact, Std relays only break one side but still they work just like relay. Often they also have Aux set of low current contacts for signal purposes)
Normal relay contacts can and do burn out from high surge currents which devices like VFD and Toroidal transformers pull on startup.
In practise you'll have your master safety Relay turn these on using a low voltage.
Last edited by JAZZCNC; 31-12-2015 at 10:17 AM.
The Following User Says Thank You to JAZZCNC For This Useful Post:
Thanks Jazz as always you are the pillar of knowledge here, one follow up though about the contactors, what is the risk of not using them and just have a circuit breaker and/or fuse instead. is it the advantage of having everything powerup through a low voltage signal which would be coming from the controller?
What I think your meaning is can you get away without the Contactor and use general pupose Relay Contact of the Pilz relay instead.? The answer is yes but not recommended for high surge devices like VFD or Toroidal transformers. Few reasons really.
Pilz relays are not cheap and over time those high intial surges will take there toll on the contacts and if for some reason say the transformer shorted internally then has wears it could melt the relay contacts before the Circuit breaker tripped.!
Using a contactor for high surge devices lowers the stress on the expensive safety relay contacts because your only passing low current thru them to turn on the Contactor Coils.
The Master safety relay which is what your Pilz will essentialy be shouldn't connect directly to any high power device it's function is to monitor lower voltage safety circuits IE 24V E-stop , guards etc before allowing a reset. Then turn off any contactors or Relays if any of those safety systems fail using low voltage.
Only the Contactors or relays suitably sized should directly power devices.
Now in your case if you don't want to buy Contactor and are prepared to risk the expensive Pilz then yes it will work without contactor going directly thru the relay contacts but you will lower it's life.
If you really don't want to risk the Pilz relay then you could use a Normal relay with suitable size contacts for the high power devices but Contactor is the correct way and won't cost much more money.! . . . Certainly much cheaper than a Pilz relay.!!
Oh and by the way I forgot to explain why it's not a good idea to use the Cslabs circuit of killing power to the controller.? It drops the ethernet signal to Mach3 and the plug-in will time out meaning a reset of Mach3 which is a royal pain in the arse.!
Now to try the reply for the third time-----
In June / July this year Zapp were offering the Ip-S for an all up price of £438. Maybe they will do it again if asked nicely . I thought about making an independant gantry squaring module using an arduino to supplement the Ip-M, but when I saw the Zapp price for the Ip-S it made more sense to go for it.
I definitely will get one but all I find is ones controlled with AC voltage, I read that I can make them work with DC though
Using a contactor means that the safety relay can turn off the power to any devices connected to it when an emergency stop case happens. You dont have to run round the machine looking for the plug.
Incidently I thought I had been kicked off of here, the site wouldn't let me login earlier?
AC contactors will work ok because again there coils pull relatively little current so the Pilz Relay contacts are not under heavy loads. It's just prefered to keep low voltage for safety and simplicity reasons.
so I thought the power to everything can be on, its just in case of any driver detecting any fault it will open its fault connection and the relay will cease giving signal to all of them.
if my concept is not right please let me know and I guess I will just do the contactors way if required.
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