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  1. #51
    Chaz's Avatar
    Lives in Ickenham, West London, United Kingdom. Last Activity: 10 Hours Ago Has been a member for 3-4 years. Has a total post count of 628. Received thanks 14 times, giving thanks to others 18 times.
    Quote Originally Posted by JAZZCNC View Post
    The machine will only be has good as the weakest link.! . . . No point fitting high end parts and then throw cheap under powered chinese spindle on it IMO.

    Datron Spindles are 60K rpm and not your average Spindle, very expensive I'll guess.? If you notice they also mostly only use smaller diameter tooling and the machines are much more agile.

    IMO with all those oversized heavy weight components and Frame design your building Sledge hammer to crack an EGG if all your doing is cutting aluminium with small tooling. Even then it probably won't give better results than lesser built machine with quality spindle on it. (ie Datron)

    If you want to HOG aluminium out then you'll want larger tooling and this will require HP from the spindle. Fast tool changing is easy enough.? It just costs lots of money.!
    All very true. The smallest Datrons cost 35K. Ill be happy to get anywhere near the performance as Ill not be spending near this kinda money.

  2. #52
    Chaz's Avatar
    Lives in Ickenham, West London, United Kingdom. Last Activity: 10 Hours Ago Has been a member for 3-4 years. Has a total post count of 628. Received thanks 14 times, giving thanks to others 18 times.
    Quote Originally Posted by JAZZCNC View Post
    The machine will only be has good as the weakest link.! . . . No point fitting high end parts and then throw cheap under powered chinese spindle on it IMO.

    Datron Spindles are 60K rpm and not your average Spindle, very expensive I'll guess.? If you notice they also mostly only use smaller diameter tooling and the machines are much more agile.

    IMO with all those oversized heavy weight components and Frame design your building Sledge hammer to crack an EGG if all your doing is cutting aluminium with small tooling. Even then it probably won't give better results than lesser built machine with quality spindle on it. (ie Datron)

    If you want to HOG aluminium out then you'll want larger tooling and this will require HP from the spindle. Fast tool changing is easy enough.? It just costs lots of money.!
    Out of interest, with the components that I have thus far, what would you do with them?

  3. #53
    Quote Originally Posted by Chaz View Post
    Out of interest, with the components that I have thus far, what would you do with them?
    Charl, i think you are missing the point. Depends on what you want to do exactly with the machine, you construct it around that idea. So thats what you should concentrate on, nbot making the best machine possible.

    But i think Dean had already shown what he will do, same as what i would do- buy me a big beast VMC and retrofit.
    project 1 , 2, Dust Shoe ...

  4. #54
    Chaz's Avatar
    Lives in Ickenham, West London, United Kingdom. Last Activity: 10 Hours Ago Has been a member for 3-4 years. Has a total post count of 628. Received thanks 14 times, giving thanks to others 18 times.
    Quote Originally Posted by Boyan Silyavski View Post
    Charl, i think you are missing the point. Depends on what you want to do exactly with the machine, you construct it around that idea. So thats what you should concentrate on, nbot making the best machine possible.

    But i think Dean had already shown what he will do, same as what i would do- buy me a big beast VMC and retrofit.
    Im not picking a fight. Just asking. Curious.

  5. #55
    Chaz's Avatar
    Lives in Ickenham, West London, United Kingdom. Last Activity: 10 Hours Ago Has been a member for 3-4 years. Has a total post count of 628. Received thanks 14 times, giving thanks to others 18 times.
    Ive been eyeing out lathes for ages. This one came up, not too far from me, needs a bit of TLC. Came with a metal cabinet full of stuff. Just tried it, I know little about speeds / feeds, but it will work and allow me to make a few parts. Wondering if I should CNC this or leave it original and find an Emco or something to CNC.

    A bit tight ... just as well I rented the larger van.






  6. #56
    Quote Originally Posted by Chaz View Post
    All very true. The smallest Datrons cost 35K. Ill be happy to get anywhere near the performance as Ill not be spending near this kinda money.
    Quote Originally Posted by Chaz View Post
    Out of interest, with the components that I have thus far, what would you do with them?
    I'd Carry on and use them but I'd make sure the whole machined was matched and balanaced. This was my point really.! The Spindle will be woe fully pathetic in comparison to rest of machine.

    The other point i'd like to make because I see it happening more and more is that BIGGER isn't always better.? Often it makes for poorer performing machine.!
    The WHOLE machine must use balanced components otherwise it's wasted.!

    In your case you have Rails and Ballscrews that you'd likely see on VMC's 4 times the size of what you have planned. Those same machines would be using Servos's matched to the screws etc and running spindles in the 15-20HP area. Theses machines would be built like this because they are intended to cut steels or Hard allloys with high MRR.
    While they will equaly cut soft materials there main advantage would be they can use much larger tooling for higher MRR when roughing etc.
    For 3D and general machining of softer alloys you wouldn't buy that machine because you'd be paying lot of money for Strength and componets which are not required for aluminium.

    Machines like Datrons which are designed cut soft alloys while still using quality componets and matched components wouldn't use the size of linear rails and ballscrews you have bought because it would be harder or much more expensive to make them reach the accelrations and feeds required. For there intended purpose they will also more than likely beat a large VMC in cycle times.

  7. #57
    Chaz's Avatar
    Lives in Ickenham, West London, United Kingdom. Last Activity: 10 Hours Ago Has been a member for 3-4 years. Has a total post count of 628. Received thanks 14 times, giving thanks to others 18 times.
    Quote Originally Posted by JAZZCNC View Post
    I'd Carry on and use them but I'd make sure the whole machined was matched and balanaced. This was my point really.! The Spindle will be woe fully pathetic in comparison to rest of machine.

    The other point i'd like to make because I see it happening more and more is that BIGGER isn't always better.? Often it makes for poorer performing machine.!
    The WHOLE machine must use balanced components otherwise it's wasted.!

    In your case you have Rails and Ballscrews that you'd likely see on VMC's 4 times the size of what you have planned. Those same machines would be using Servos's matched to the screws etc and running spindles in the 15-20HP area. Theses machines would be built like this because they are intended to cut steels or Hard allloys with high MRR.
    While they will equaly cut soft materials there main advantage would be they can use much larger tooling for higher MRR when roughing etc.
    For 3D and general machining of softer alloys you wouldn't buy that machine because you'd be paying lot of money for Strength and componets which are not required for aluminium.

    Machines like Datrons which are designed cut soft alloys while still using quality componets and matched components wouldn't use the size of linear rails and ballscrews you have bought because it would be harder or much more expensive to make them reach the accelrations and feeds required. For there intended purpose they will also more than likely beat a large VMC in cycle times.
    Thanks. So in effect I need to potentially ditch the Chinese spindle idea and get something 'decent'?

  8. Quote Originally Posted by Chaz View Post
    Ive been eyeing out lathes for ages. This one came up, not too far from me, needs a bit of TLC. Came with a metal cabinet full of stuff. Just tried it, I know little about speeds / feeds, but it will work and allow me to make a few parts. Wondering if I should CNC this or leave it original and find an Emco or something to CNC.

    A bit tight ... just as well I rented the larger van.






    Its a Boxford, either CUD, BUD or AUD model i think, with quick-change threading/traverse gearbox, nice little lathes, I have one myself :)

  9. #59
    Chaz's Avatar
    Lives in Ickenham, West London, United Kingdom. Last Activity: 10 Hours Ago Has been a member for 3-4 years. Has a total post count of 628. Received thanks 14 times, giving thanks to others 18 times.
    Quote Originally Posted by Davek0974 View Post
    Its a Boxford, either CUD, BUD or AUD model i think, with quick-change threading/traverse gearbox, nice little lathes, I have one myself :)
    Sadly not the AUD but an older A model with motor at the top. It will do what I need so all good.

  10. #60
    Love that first picture, looks like WW1 in the back ground -smileyface-

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