Emco Padovani E260 Fagor 8055T control.
Hi all,
Is there anyone who knows anything about the Fagor 8055T control on Emco lathes? I've had the machine for a while now, and it has never worked properly. It does all sorts of strange things, flashes up warnings about events that have not occurred, won't feed in X due to apparent software limits exceeded, the list goes on.
I've limited recent experience of CNC turning, (although plenty of time spent on all types of manual machinery) and the type of work I do would not require a production type machine, that's why I opted for a used 'teach in' type lathe. It has all the features I need, plenty of easy to use cycles, but I've had nothing but trouble in trying to get it working. Any help would be much appreciated. The machine itself has had little use, perhaps it's never worked correctly?
The control panel appears to be unique to Emco, although the standard 8055T manuals are still relevant.
I look forward to hearing from anyone who may be able to assist, even if it's to tell me it's had it!!
Thanks,
Northstar.
Re: Emco Padovani E260 Fagor 8055T control.
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Northstar
Is there anyone who knows anything about the Fagor 8055T control on Emco lathes? I've had the machine for a while now, and it has never worked properly. It does all sorts of strange things, flashes up warnings about events that have not occurred, won't feed in X due to apparent software limits exceeded, the list goes on.
I don't know anything about the Fagor Control but I'm not so sure your problem is the Control.? If these errors are Phantom's and the control is reporting these has external control errors like Limit's etc then it's more likely electro/mechanical than software.
Electrical noise (EMF) is major problem for any CNC machine and if your machine is suffering form poor grounding or working on a noisy eletrical line it will be affected by strange random happenings.
Essentially the Controller does just that and controls or responds to external devices ie: Servos, limits, sensors etc. So provided it's got the correct parameters setup and turns on then they usually work fine and often these kind of problems come from faulty sensors/wires etc sending false reports back.
So If the machine is old then wiring could be a problem so checking all cable connections, esp the Ground and shield wires is a good place to start.
Shame your not closer otherwise I'd have come take a look for you.!! . . . Sorry can't help more but Good luck tracking down.!
Re: Emco Padovani E260 Fagor 8055T control.
What you're saying sounds logical, and does make sense with some of the error messages that have flagged up, e.g. buffer battery voltage error, but the battery tests ok, and external emergency activated when the emergency stop button has clearly not been pressed. Both these 'hardware' items are quite a distance apart on the machine, so I guess I'm looking for some common area like a multi-pin connection that may carry several of these signal wires.
Another regular message is 'axes (spelt like that!) board voltage error 24V', but the transformer tests good, along with the wires to the DIN rail connections. I'm not sure where there could be a common area that carries all those wires.
Time to get the multimeter on the case!
Thanks for the pointer, it may take some time but I'll get back to you with the results.
Of course your comment on correct parameter set up may also need checking, there are a couple of suspects for other issues in there. I have a manufacturers floppy disk which allegedly contains the factory parameters, but no floppy drive on the machine, and my PC won't read it. Anyhow, I'll leave that one for another day, as that's not causing the issue at hand.
Regards!
Quote:
Originally Posted by
JAZZCNC
I don't know anything about the Fagor Control but I'm not so sure your problem is the Control.? If these errors are Phantom's and the control is reporting these has external control errors like Limit's etc then it's more likely electro/mechanical than software.
Electrical noise (EMF) is major problem for any CNC machine and if your machine is suffering form poor grounding or working on a noisy eletrical line it will be affected by strange random happenings.
Essentially the Controller does just that and controls or responds to external devices ie: Servos, limits, sensors etc. So provided it's got the correct parameters setup and turns on then they usually work fine and often these kind of problems come from faulty sensors/wires etc sending false reports back.
So If the machine is old then wiring could be a problem so checking all cable connections, esp the Ground and shield wires is a good place to start.
Shame your not closer otherwise I'd have come take a look for you.!! . . . Sorry can't help more but Good luck tracking down.!
Re: Emco Padovani E260 Fagor 8055T control.
Yes Multi connectors are prime suspects. Also check pinch points on machine for crushed cables and areas where cables run close to heat and going brittle is common problem on older machines.
Broken shield wires on Connectors is also another common cause of false triggers thru loss of grounding. EMF will trigger e-stop easily and most other sensitive sensors.
PSU units on some of these Controls are very sensitive to power fluctuations so if your supply is a little up/down then this may answer your 24v report.
I bought a large milling machine with Anilam controller that had similair issue giving random reports and strange happenings just before it appeared to expire and give up the ghost on it's previous owner. Who thought the controller had died or more was actually told by so called Anilam engineer it was dead.! (He must have been a marvelous Engineer because he diagnosed all this on the Phone.!!)
Anyway to my good fortune this wasn't the case and was infact just 24v PSU that had gone down, all be it Very expensive PSU if bought from Anilam. It also had several other issues due to age like brittle broken wires, faulty/worn switches etc but none of these affected the control other than tricking it into false errors.
I have how ever since removed the control along with DC brushed servos/drives and currently retrofitting with modern controller and AC servos.
Re: Emco Padovani E260 Fagor 8055T control.
Hi JAZZCNC and everyone else reading.
Here's the latest update on the Emco.
I've painstakingly checked through wiring, connections, plugs, sockets, DIN rail connectors, more plugs........you get the picture! Nothing obviously wrong. Whilst visiting one of my customers, I discussed the issue with a couple of the guys there who install control systems to ultrasonic scanning machines. They both said the same as you, and suggested that I reroute the incoming power cables as far from any signal leads as possible, using SY flex of the correct size, also earthing the braid for extra protection from any EMFs.
They also suggested that I install ferrite beads on all signal cables as close to the terminals as possible.
After doing all this, I expected to triumphantly power up and be merrily machining within minutes.
No.
On switching the isolator on, there was a slight pop like a trip blowing from inside the enclosure, and now the machine does nothing. No screen, no initial run of the lube pump, zilch.
There is three phase in all the right places, the PSUs seem to be pumping out the correct voltages, the lights are on on the drive units, and the supply light is on on the CNC processor case. But no screen, it briefly changes colour on power up, but then reverts to black. Also, several of the LEDs on the softkeys are illuminated, which never happens on start up. Incidentally, none of the buttons, keys, knobs or dials now do anything.
It strikes me that the machine is doomed to failure. I cannot afford to scrap it, it is mechanically far too good for that. I either need to call in the experts, or seriously consider retrofitting a new control system, neither of which I can particularly afford at the moment, but I do need to get this machine producing.
I've tried contacting Emco, and it transpires that they don't actually have a UK service centre, or anyone who knows anything about this machine. Surprising.
Any ideas or suggestions at this point would be much appreciated. Could it be sheer coincidence that something else has gone kaput just at this time, or is there a simpler explanation?
Incidentally, does anyone know if I can purchase a complete retrofit package with a conversational control suitable for this machine? It is only 2 axis, with manual tool change.
Thanks in advance for any help!
Quote:
Originally Posted by
JAZZCNC
Yes Multi connectors are prime suspects. Also check pinch points on machine for crushed cables and areas where cables run close to heat and going brittle is common problem on older machines.
Broken shield wires on Connectors is also another common cause of false triggers thru loss of grounding. EMF will trigger e-stop easily and most other sensitive sensors.
PSU units on some of these Controls are very sensitive to power fluctuations so if your supply is a little up/down then this may answer your 24v report.
I bought a large milling machine with Anilam controller that had similair issue giving random reports and strange happenings just before it appeared to expire and give up the ghost on it's previous owner. Who thought the controller had died or more was actually told by so called Anilam engineer it was dead.! (He must have been a marvelous Engineer because he diagnosed all this on the Phone.!!)
Anyway to my good fortune this wasn't the case and was infact just 24v PSU that had gone down, all be it Very expensive PSU if bought from Anilam. It also had several other issues due to age like brittle broken wires, faulty/worn switches etc but none of these affected the control other than tricking it into false errors.
I have how ever since removed the control along with DC brushed servos/drives and currently retrofitting with modern controller and AC servos.
Re: Emco Padovani E260 Fagor 8055T control.
Oh Dear sorry to hear that. Sounds like maybe shorted something in the re-wire.?
Regards Replacement controller then I don't know of any Retro kits has such. You can buy Controllers with Conversational options but they tend to be quite expensive for industrial strength controller. For instance ProtoTrak SLX is nice looking Lathe controller with some neat features but they won't be cheap or simple to retrofit. Most probably not be worth the costs given age of machine.?
Other options are Retrofitting with PC based controller like Mach3 and CSlabs Motion controller. This combination is often used on older machines, Lathes and Mills, for retrofitting has it's high quality controller with good support.
There are other PC based Controllers like Kflop and Galil etc which are also used for retrofits.
None of these have built in Conversational programing but some like Mach3 have Wizzards which are pretty much the same and give the same result.
These types of motion controllers will be far cheaper to retrofit than buying Bespoke controllers like protoTrak etc.
Obviously taking this route does mean a certain level of knowledge and experience is required. That doesn't mean it can't be done by inexperienced but it will be a steep learning curve and handful if never done before.!!
