Comments sought on new build: A CNC Router for RC Gliders and Planes

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Originally Posted by Jonathan

At first glance I thought that, but he's using such excessively thick wire that it's probably not a big deal.

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It's wire I had left over from making Y leads for my large electric RC Helis, I though it would be good to use as I could strip sections of outer off, push it over the pin and then flood with solder. Then cover the soldered bit with hot glue to insulate....

Missed that first time round, nice idea looks cool.

Not sure on Clive and the chocblock, I guess he's right but what to do...

I guess you need somthing of a busbar, mini consumer unit? Or is that ott?

.Me

Neil what do you thin: http://www.directindustry.com/prod/s...5-1058789.html

Or somthing like this: http://www.12voltplanet.co.uk/power-...s-busbars.html

Maybe mount the MCB's on the din rail with a busbar and then a seperate din mounted busbar for the -ve?

:) sounds like a plan :), just seen these: http://m.ebay.co.uk/itm/321061386290

I remember now...EddyCurrent linked to that in his build...looks like a good solution, ta!

Or this....http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/4-Way-Fuse...item2ed92648b0

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Originally Posted by Lee Roberts

:) sounds like a plan :), just seen these: http://m.ebay.co.uk/itm/321061386290

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These seem ok and you would get the fuses for the drives (if you want them) you would need two of them fuse in the +ve and bridge the -ve solid (no fuse) cheapo choc blocks will melt if the screws come loose. Clive

ps the others with the led in would be no good as you will be running 70V ish.

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Originally Posted by Clive S

cheapo choc blocks will melt if the screws come loose.

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Yea i think the white version are the better ones, somthing about not melting.

How about soldering the 1 wire from the caps directly to 3 smaller wires and connecting them to din terminals.

http://tapatalk.imageshack.com/v2/15...3279bf4b7e.jpg

Then connecting from there to MCB's before going to the drivers?

http://tapatalk.imageshack.com/v2/15...f26a3810fd.jpg

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Originally Posted by njhussey

How about soldering the 1 wire from the caps directly to 3 smaller wires and connecting them to din terminals.

http://tapatalk.imageshack.com/v2/15...3279bf4b7e.jpg

Then connecting from there to MCB's before going to the drivers?

http://tapatalk.imageshack.com/v2/15...f26a3810fd.jpg

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You don't need mcb's just fuses if you want (I personally don't bother) but that sort of arrangement is better. You could do the same thing with a decent choc block or the fuse block that that you indicated before. That would in my eyes be a decent solution. At the end of the day it is up to you. ..Clive

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Originally Posted by njhussey

How about soldering the 1 wire from the caps directly to 3 smaller wires and connecting them to din terminals.


Then connecting from there to MCB's before going to the drivers?

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Yep that's how I do it.!
Look at bottom din rail and on Far Left you'll see MCB's for toroidal Transformers, 24v psu, VFD along with Din terminal banks for Mains voltage.
On Far Right you'll see Din Fuse terminals for Drives and 0v & 24V bank of Din terminals.
Terminals in middle are for I/O to the machine, ie Limits etc.

Attachment 14931

Neil I have been thinking about it and Dean is quite correct I had forgot you will be using this in a works environment and needs to be done correct. If you had a fire the insurance might not pay out if it was not done ok.
So fit MCB's etc .. Clive

Re-done the connections...

http://tapatalk.imageshack.com/v2/15...03406e992c.jpg

http://tapatalk.imageshack.com/v2/15...40ef77c6a0.jpg

Neil You have passed the test :toot:very nice

Cheers Clive, except that I put a N label on the live terminal!!!!!

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Originally Posted by njhussey

Cheers Clive, except that I put a N label on the live terminal!!!!!

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Ok then two points deducted.:encouragement:

Full marks though for it working, it's giving a nice steady 72V. It is taking a while for the capacitors to discharge but then there's no real load across them...

http://tapatalk.imageshack.com/v2/15...5a24786f2c.jpg

How can I safely discharge the capacitors with no load on them.......just to point out I've no resistor to drain it.....yet!!

Ok so I'm drawing up my wiring diagrams, ill start with the power to the PSU'S and 230V driver. I've got on and off push buttons I think that the off button needs to go in the safety part of the circuit as it needs to kill the power to the drives through the relay?

http://tapatalk.imageshack.com/v2/15...04b2136b03.jpg

I blinking hate electronics!!!

For the wiring of the drivers to the din rail terminals and the motors to the din rail terminals is the below ok to do i.e. connect the screen to the earth core and just terminate it at the din rail terminals? Obviously both ends will have shrink wrap on them :) Oh and this is just a test piece.....no way near long enough!!!

http://tapatalk.imageshack.com/v2/15...1982b51c7b.jpg

You may hate electronics, but they and the rest of the machine is looking very nice. G.

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Originally Posted by njhussey

Ok so I'm drawing up my wiring diagrams, ill start with the power to the PSU'S and 230V driver. I've got on and off push buttons I think that the off button needs to go in the safety part of the circuit as it needs to kill the power to the drives through the relay?

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I use Mains ON/OFF Isolator for Switching power to the Control box and then have ON/OFF switch on the 24V side for Local isolation when using machine but without turning mains ON/OFF for when changing tools etc or when making a Cuppa etc but not finished using machine. This way I'm not switching Mains voltage and it add's extra level of safety when changing tools etc so machine can't accidently be moved or spindle turned on as there is no power for the Master relay.

I have all Mains going thru a Contactors with 24V coil and then these go thru the Pilz relay contacts. While they will handle Mains voltage your better using them to control contactors.

Edit: I presume your going to use the drives Fault signal as part of the E-stop to stop machine if motor stalls.?

The door interlock will switch off all mains power to the control cabinet, if I need to turn off power other than this the plug socket has a trip/reset switch.

Yes drives fault will be part of the e-stop circuit....just trying to work out how to implement it all through a Pilz relay (and now contactors, any suggestions as to a good contactor to use?) and into the CSMIO IP/M.

My thoughts (so far!!) is that any E-stop (1 on control panel and 1 on machine), limit switch, AM882 + Kinco fault, (VFD fault, not sure if the Huanyang Inverter has this yet, but presume so, as not read the manual), stop button on control panel kills all power to the 70V PSU (and so the AM882 drives) & 230V Kinco Nema 34 driver. Need to work out how to shut down the spindle, presume by sending Mach3 a signal which then tells the VFD to stop the spindle?

I'll put a switch on the cabinet front panel to isolate the 24V supply only, do you remove 24V power from everything or just the Pilz relay?

I don't include Limits in E-stop Circuit any more as they are not really an Emergency situation but rather a positional error. Instead I have them Halt the control/software and Disable the drives using Enable.

Regards Stopping the VFD then if your talking as part of E-stop Circuit then I use Timer Relay along with an E-stop signal using relay contact.
E-stop signal tells VFD to Stop spindle and then few seconds later when comes to stop Timer relay removes power.! . . .BUT . . . In all honesty for a DIY enviroment then just stopping the VFD spinning is enough.

Never rely on Mach3 or any software to shut anything down that can hurt you. Do it your self with relays etc then just send software a signal to let know you have shut it down. In your case IP-M will shut it down for you by disabeling the outputs when E-stop occurs but again don't trust it and put another defence in place and then still send Mach3 signal.

Yes I only Remove 24V to Master relay or in your case Pilz.

Just been playing setting out the position of everything (well except the contactor and Pilz relay which are on their way to me....had a little play running a few neutral wires to see how it was and also a screened cable trial piece. Going to be a bit tight getting through the trunking slits but it'll be fine.

http://tapatalk.imageshack.com/v2/15...857d059174.jpg

http://tapatalk.imageshack.com/v2/15...d14ac21746.jpg

Neil Don't forget all your screens to motors etc should go to a star ground point to help stopping ground loops.

I was wondering about that, doesn't the backplate act as that as all the earth's (and motor screens and driver screens, but only JB din rail end end) connect to the din rail which is bolted to the backplate?

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Originally Posted by njhussey

I was wondering about that, doesn't the backplate act as that as all the earth's (and motor screens and driver screens, but only JB din rail end end) connect to the din rail which is bolted to the backplate?

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Technicly I don't think it should matter as the whole rail becomes a Ground Bus bar but I must admit I do take all my earths back to One block of Din terminals just for sake of it and to eliminate any chance of Ground loops.

In that case I'll not use the earth core (will cut it flush with the shield) of the shielded cable but do as you showed (can't remember the thread) and fold back the shield at the din rail end and solder to some earth wire shrink wrap it to the cable outer and take that to a block at one end.

Tonight's task is to work out how a bloody Pilz PNOZ X3 works!!

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Originally Posted by njhussey

Tonight's task is to work out how a bloody Pilz PNOZ X3 works!!

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One thing with X3 is that A1 A2 which are often the DC Coil terminals are infact the AC coil terminals and B1 B2 are the DC terminals.!! . . . . This caught me out a few weeks ago.!!. . . Presumption is the mother of all F@~k up's as they say just like not RTFM. . .Lol

That's the only thing I'm clear on Dean, what I'm struggling to get my head round is which terminals look at which relays. I'm not going to be switching AC now I don't think as I've got a 230V contactor with 24v DC coil coming (3 NO & 1 NC contact) so will switch the AC through there...

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Originally Posted by njhussey

That's the only thing I'm clear on Dean, what I'm struggling to get my head round is which terminals look at which relays. I'm not going to be switching AC now I don't think as I've got a 230V contactor with 24v DC coil coming (3 NO & 1 NC contact) so will switch the AC through there...

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Easy neil.

13 & 14 NO Contact
23 & 24 NO
33 & 34 NO
41 & 42 NC

If you want Short circuit across contacts detection then use Dual channel E-stop which means 2 x terminals on each E-stop connected as below.
Contact #1 between S21 & S22
Contact #2 between S31 & S32
Then jump wire between S11 & S12

Reset button Between S13 & S14

Ok so those are the connect through terminals, which are the ones that control them? There's 11 & 12, 21 & 22, 31 & 32.....

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Originally Posted by njhussey

Ok so those are the connect through terminals, which are the ones that control them? There's 11 & 12, 21 & 22, 31 & 32.....

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Like this Attachment 14964

Just been laying out and fixing down a few more things, not had much time on this in the last couple of days...

http://tapatalk.imageshack.com/v2/15...6da6136b12.jpg

Waiting on my Pilz X3 to arrive before I fix the last few bits down....

Makes you feel like a Kid waiting for Xmas again doesn't it Neil.. . . So close but just not coming quick enough. . :hysterical:

Looking good so far you'll be there soon.:applause:

Cheers!!

They laughed at me this morning because I got excited when another delivery from Chalon came which meant I could do the last bit of trunking on the panel!!

Quick hand drawing of power circuit so far. Pilz X3 is switching the contactor to kill power on e-stop.

http://tapatalk.imageshack.com/v2/15...55f3100673.jpg

Christmas morning today...Pilz came so knuckling down to finish the wiring diagrams so I can get it wired up....

http://tapatalk.imageshack.com/v2/15...c68d01f17a.jpg

Power and Limit switch wiring diagrams...

Attachment 15025Attachment 15024Attachment 15026