Forgot camera was in JPEG >.<
Should be able to see well enough though. This is the part I had in for a tad over 72 mins (by accident).
https://s1.postimg.cc/6bqlyac4kv/IMG_1350_1.jpg
Printable View
Forgot camera was in JPEG >.<
Should be able to see well enough though. This is the part I had in for a tad over 72 mins (by accident).
https://s1.postimg.cc/6bqlyac4kv/IMG_1350_1.jpg
Rarely see suggested ratio by weight, usually by volume.Quote:
Originally Posted by JOGARA
However, simple enough to figure out an approximation I guess. 3kg of water is 3L, for the sake of simplicity we'll say your 400g of 85% acid is actually 340g (400 * 0.85) and ignore the extra 60g of water, which when considering the specific gravity of sulphuric acid is 1.85 should mean it was about 184ml.
So you have actually got 0.184L acid to 3L water, or roughly a 1:16 ratio which is not too far off what I've seen recommended for 6asf (slightly low perhaps), but more than a little on the low side if using 4.5asf (caswell recommend 1:3 battery acid/water, or around 1:11 acid/water if my maths holds up).
That jives more with what you would expect - too low a concentration will give a smaller pore size which is bad for dying. Were you calculating with 4.5asf or 6asf out of interest?
Oh and fusion will give you surface area very simply - just use the menu on the left, select the body in question and right click - properties. First property is area.
So I had too little?Quote:
Originally Posted by Zeeflyboy
Dam it I already diluted half my mix. I got loads of everything so can make a proper batch using fluid measuring.
I didn't account for the acid being heavier than the water. I thought it was near enough and it being 85% I could within range say that it is 100% and the extra weight would offset that xD
I guess this is why I am having problems then...
Yeah sulphuric acid is nearly twice as dense as water (1.85g/ml vs 1g/ml)... easy mistake to make.
From what you've said, you definitely seem to have far less than recommended for 4.5asf by cadwell's guide. You aren't that far off what I've seen recommended elsewhere for 6asf though.
It is certainly a potential explanation, one of the side effects of too low a concentration is small pore size which then can give issues taking a dye.
Did you see my second post about fusion btw? Few clicks to get area of a body... copy to clipboard and ask google to convert the area value to square feet, multiply by number of the parts you are doing at once and then desired amps per square foot.
I think I need to start from the beginning. I have read through a few of the guilds and have gotten mixed up a bit with everything.
From what I have gathered, 6asf is only really for dark colours with large dye molecules, 4.5asf works for pretty much everything?
I should have for 4.5asf a 20-25% acid concentration?
What am I better off doing for my process? I am dyeing black and need it to be a tough enough for a product case that might be battered a bit.
Ill mix up a new batch, using scales but account for the higher weight and concentration.
Hang on. I am using Phosphoric not Sulphuric.
Did I mess up?
Well you can anodise using phosphoric, but all these guides are based around the use of sulphuric acid. I don't really know much about phosphoric acid anodising but I certainly wouldn't assume the processes are the same regarding concentrations/time/current etc, nor in it's ability to take dyes afterwards.
And no, 20-25% is far too high (for sulphuric, no idea about phosphoric). The caswell guide says 3 gallons water to 1 gallon battery acid, but battery acid is typically only around 32% - when you run the maths that works out to around 1:11 or approximately 9% by volume.
I don't think there is any problem using 6 asf as long as the concentration is appropriate. I have never seen any suggestion that it will struggle to take dye. If you ran 6asf using the same concentration as for 4.5asf then you would potentially end up with a smaller pore size... if you use a lower concentration of 1:15 then you should end up with similar pore size to the 4.5asf at the higher concentration.
edit, out of interest:
Sounds like the morphology of the surface is different which makes it particularly suitable for adhesives... if the morphology is that significantly different then it could certainly prevent the acceptance of dyes.Quote:
Phosphoric acid anodizing is basically used for structural adhesive bonding in high-humidity environments. This process is known as the Boeing Process and is carried out at 10-15 V. The formed oxide film has a greater durability under adverse conditions than film formed in chromic acid and sulfuric acid. One of the reasons for the great adhesive property is said to be due to the morphology of the oxide film, which should be a film of pores with whiskers or protrusions on the top surface of the formed film.
Off to go buy some battery acid then :p
Thanks
[edit]
Looks about right this stuff
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/161904105341
Used these guys last time for my other acid.
Yeah so with that, to do 4.5asf as per caswell guide you would mix 1L of that to 3L distilled water.
You can get 1L of 98% sulphuric acid on amazon for that price, but there is an argument to be made that buying battery acid is safer. Sulphuric Acid Pure (H2SO4) Min. 98% 1*Litre https://www.amazon.co.uk/dp/B013T3EO..._Nk74zbXPCQA3M
If you go the 98% route needless to say you need to be effing careful with it, especially when mixing with water.
Yea I only got chemical gloves and glasses. No HEV suit...Quote:
Originally Posted by Zeeflyboy
Happy to just get the 33%.
Hmmmm Not looking great...
https://s1.postimg.cc/7wz5o4ht1b/IM..._155340523.jpg
Ill leave it in the dye for 15 mins and come back.
Great - glad we managed to dig to the bottom of the problem!
good job :)
Just want to check.
1L of 33% battery acid (I have 31-38%) mixed with 3L of water for 4.5asf?
Had the amazing, original idea of using one of these stone air things from fish tanks.
Have to say, works really well.
https://s9.postimg.cc/qjb2c891r/IMG..._204238780.jpg
https://media.giphy.com/media/1vZaA7...9avK/giphy.gif
https://media.giphy.com/media/8quBjt...OhA9/giphy.gif
That'll be an air stone ;-)Quote:
Originally Posted by JOGARA
Made me smile as it reminded me of a minibus driver I had last week, who took it upon himself to act tour guide.
"This used to be the mine weighbridge, where they used to weigh things coming out the mine"
Worked really well. The larger bubbles before sometimes caused me issues but this is great.
Not 100% there yet. More practice and experimenting me thinks.
https://s9.postimg.cc/r7oi8mmrz/IMG_..._235228049.jpg
Looking good.
Can I just ask - what are you using for your cathode? (I did start setting myself up for anodizing but a squirrel ran past and I moved onto something else)
Wow the result is very good, nice work!
Currently using scrap aluminium from the waste bin.Quote:
Originally Posted by Doddy
I am trying to get hold of a bit of lead though as it does not disintegrate if you leave it in there unlike aluminium xD
Not sure why but set the power supply to CC instead of CC/CV and now getting this...
https://s9.postimg.cc/4huxk0b4v/IMG_..._152311722.jpg
Getting what?, pitting? (I assume that's pitting and not bubbles on the wet surface?) - shouldn't be because of CC - that's what you're supposed to use - I'd guess cleaning/prep?Quote:
Originally Posted by JOGARA
Cleaned with dish soap and sparyed down with my clean water supply.Quote:
Originally Posted by Doddy
Ill go down and have a feel of it later once they have set a bit.
Yesterday it did the same but once dried it was not as bad.
Still no idea what I am doing wrong here..
Yesterday I threw in a bit of scrap and it came out looking alright.
This problem is only happening with my tumbled parts...
https://s9.postimg.cc/e72smqqvj/IMG_...415884_HDR.jpg
https://s9.postimg.cc/5otciezsf/IMG_..._160423547.jpg
Just found someone on eBay UK selling the Craftsman Electric Powder Coat Spray Gun that is quite popular over in the US for its low price.
So for £40 with powder I thought I might give it a go.
https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/NEW-Craft...72.m2749.l2649
Be interested in how you get on with powder coating.
The PSU is 110VAC and 60Hz, but should work okay on a step-down at 50Hz (will wait until you give a review before buy
I am hoping they ship 240v but picture does show 120v brick :/Quote:
Originally Posted by Doddy
I sent them a message about it on Friday but have not heard back.
Looking online, the gun wants 24v DC and the ground cable is to ground. Should be able to feed it the 24v off my desktop psu and hock the parts to any of my ground points.
That's the wacky bit - the powder, as you know, needs to be electrostaticaly charged - I guess there's a HT generator in the gun. I'm sure it'll be fine and 24VDC isn't hard to find.
ill be honest ive not read all 7 pages of posts.
when it comes to sourcing the required products where and what do people buy?
I know dies are easy enough to get off ebay, but acids etc...?
eBay - I bought my hydrochloric and sulfuric off eBay at 5l quantities - never been a problem.Similarly a degreaser (who's name I can't remember and it's too early to pop to the shed)Quote:
Originally Posted by andy_con
EDIT:
Things are getting more difficult...
Here the legislation and licensing requirements of Sulfuric acid, amongst others.
Looks like I need to go to the shed, after all, and dilute the little acid that I have left :offended:
Time to stock up on battery acid from your local corner car parts shop.
Try motor trade outlets I can get acid in 25l drums from a parts supplier, ebay you can buy 25l easy enough as well.Quote:
Originally Posted by andy_con
so this
https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Hydrochlo...8AAOSw4GVYIzpr
cant find any sulphuric on ebay?
It's becoming difficult to find - presumably because by July it will be illegal (punishable by prison/fines) to sell sulfuric acid above 15% conc. to any non-EPP license holder (and by November, illegal to own it without a license). Battery Acid is normally around the 30% conc. - around the strength touted as required for anodising. Hydrochloric acid is illegal above 10% conc. which buggers up anyone looking for alternatives to ferric chloride for PCB etching at home. Today, I can find hydrochloric acid advertised for sale on eBay at 35% conc. - I bet if you tried to buy it it would quickly be removed from sale.
The EPP license is within reach of the public, but at a cost of 40 quid every 3 years - for each and every substance identified on the license, it makes casual dabbling with plating and/or anodising something that needs careful planning. It makes supplying the chemicals a complete pain in the arse.
Acetone looks to be under the glare of government - expect that to become illegal next.
I blame Europe. And the idiots running around harming people.
EDIT: My bad - Hydrochloric acid is not a regulated chemical, but is a notifiable one - so any suspicious activity surrounding the sale is reportable to the police. As are a whole bunch of traditional fertilisers (okay, so my interests - electronics, some limited form of CNC toys, and Sunday down the allotments - all going to get me into trouble!)
Yea the new laws coming in sound pretty dumb. This is not really a problem outside the getto of London...
I canceld the order with the eBay seller of that electric powder gun.
I sent multiple messages and they did not respond to any of them. They also didn't ship the after a week.
They have reduced the price to £18 https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/253570991736
I know this device is cheap but they are only going to get ~£10 after fees....
They are selling quite a few every day and one other person has not had any messages back from them or the item shipped..
https://s9.postimg.cc/8py4ljz4f/image.png
Stay away...
Bought this one instead.
https://electrostaticmagic.myshopify...-case-supplied
No wires. Uses the plastic nozzle to generate the positive charge and uses your body as the grounding.
Should be arriving tomorrow (Monday).
Will review..
Well... I prefer this over anodizing any day!
Rock hard, not scratching, easy and fast to apply, cheap...
The gun from Electrostatic Magic is amazing. Came with everything you need to get going.
I do wish they added some packing peanuts or something to the parcel. It was just thrown in there with everything else but the gun is rock solid.
Big chunk of metal, feels solid in the hand and the 2 pots makes applying multiple colours fast.
https://s9.postimg.cc/wqn3nyyxr/IMG_1654.jpg
https://s9.postimg.cc/b4836xsnj/IMG_1655.jpg
https://s9.postimg.cc/4qj03og1r/IMG_1657.jpg
https://s9.postimg.cc/pnf88bbhr/IMG_1658.jpg
https://s9.postimg.cc/77uraxcsv/IMG_1659.jpg
https://s9.postimg.cc/bgzhd38cf/IMG_1660.jpg
https://s9.postimg.cc/d8sg8074v/IMG_1661.jpg
Looking very good!
That's the £150 compressed air gun?
Yep!Quote:
Originally Posted by Doddy
With FineBlack Textured powder, https://electrostaticmagic.myshopify...-black-texture
Got some Satin coming, maybe, idk. Bought it on eBay last week and it has not arrived...
looks great - you just using the kitchen oven?
Yep. Bought a new one from B&Q for £100 https://www.diy.com/departments/cook...1769308_BQ.prd (had £10 voucher) and it works great.Quote:
Originally Posted by Zeeflyboy
I set it to about 150 and the parts warm up to 180-200c.
Trying to find the sweet spot tomorrow.
Might be ordering the powder directly from the manufacture and 20KG is minimum order quantity... Anyone want some? xD
Can only think of around 10 items I want to powder coat and 5 of them are my van wheels :p
you could sell your excess as 1kg bags of it on ebay and probably make a tidy little profit :)