Will run out of HAIR SOON

Hi all,
please can someone help me.:mad:
Finished build (mech +elec) of my CNC with spindle.
Got no movement -
Using Mach 3 on Win 7, Parallel port on PCI.
Did fresh install of Win 7, and then Mach 3 on a fresh hard drive.
Was prompted by means of a tick for PP (parallel port) driver - ticked.
Question: in device manager i dont have resources to show address for PP, also says my driver for the card is not there - tried and cannot get a new driver for the PP loaded? Any ideas

Have been through all the inputs/outputs etc on config - nothing changes
Checked continuity from PP male - PP female (i had to cut it to go through a gland) - all tested ok.
i did have limit switches illuminate (on and off) on diagnostics page - so i assume the link between BOB and PC is ok.

i am using a BB5001 board (HY-JKM5) Chinese one off Ebay, found a couple of articles which showed pin allocation - does anyone know what they should be?
Starting to think that this is the root of all my problems.

Any help/info greatly received.

Is it 64 bits or 32 bits W7?
PP is only supported in 32 bits W7.

32bit

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I know this doesn't help you now but trust me you'll thank me for it later if you do. Do yourself the biggest favor and dump the PP and buy an ethernet controller like the AXBB-E or UC300, don't be tempted to buy a USB controller as they are only one small step from a PP.

The PP is a dinosaur and you'll have nothing but trouble and poor performance, USB is better but it has lots of issues with noise and can be very flaky. Ethernet is rock solid and very reliable and fast.

The issue you are having now is not uncommon when using PCI PP cards and not all work, it's a little bit of a lottery with them from what I know.
My advice is don't waste time on it, bite the bullet and go with an Ethernet controller.

If you are determined to carry on with the PCI Parallel Port, and I do not recommend it, the drivers for the port are generic depending on the chipset of the port. I used a PP card and getting a driver was a quest. If you have a MOSCHIP chipset, I have a CD somewhere of all the MOSCHIP chipset drivers and if you get really stuck, I can start the search for it in the boxes of old crap I have piled up in my den. I would need a good photograph of you PP card to get the chipset details first.

But heed Jazz - he knows, you know!

Quote:

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Originally Posted by JAZZCNC

I know this doesn't help you now but trust me you'll thank me for it later if you do. Do yourself the biggest favor and dump the PP and buy an ethernet controller like the AXBB-E or UC300, don't be tempted to buy a USB controller as they are only one small step from a PP.

The PP is a dinosaur and you'll have nothing but trouble and poor performance, USB is better but it has lots of issues with noise and can be very flaky. Ethernet is rock solid and very reliable and fast.

The issue you are having now is not uncommon when using PCI PP cards and not all work, it's a little bit of a lottery with them from what I know.
My advice is don't waste time on it, bite the bullet and go with an Ethernet controller.

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I second that.
I have only ever got perfectly successful running with Mach3 using WinXP sp3, which I have on retail disc from yesteryear.
Win7 wasn't reliable at all. Surprisingly, also fresh from a retail disc.
I've moved straight on to a uc300eth for the need of more I/O.

If it isn't working right, don't faff about. Ethernet all the way.

Thank you for your advice.
I value your insight.
My budget is quite tight, what would you say to the one below, I only need 3 axis control.

https://www.amazon.co.uk/dp/B07H8DXF...ing=UTF8&psc=1



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So, just looked at again, although it says ethernet, looks like usb. [emoji849]
Whilst I keep looking I will keep saving.[emoji848]

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I spent several years using a cheap Chinese parallel board, though with LinuxCNC rather than MACH3. I spent more time fault-finding spurious limit trips and other issues than I did making things. If I'd had to pay for the amount of time people spent reading and replying to my posts on this forum I'd be a homeless bankrupt.

Recently I bit the bullet and changed to using UCCNC software and an AXBB-E controller from CNC Drive as recommended by Those Who Know. Apart from an interesting W10 problem that ended up being related to which USB port on my laptop I plugged the Nintendo game controller into ($8 version of remote pendant, well worth the investment!) it has been rock solid. Easy to set up and there are plenty of experienced user on this forum to help with any issues.

I'm the ultimate cheapskate when it comes to machine building but should have made the change long before I did. If you plan to make a few things to sell, even as no more than a self-funded hobby, you will get your money back in improved production time soon enough.

Kit

Thanks Kit, and thanks to everybody else that has replied.
I will take all your time served advise and bite the bullet, I like a challenge but think the PP route would, by the sound of it, be too frustrating.
After all I want to make stuff, I don't want to spend all my time tinkering and problem solving.
Thanks again.

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If you choose the AXBB-E hardware and matching UCCNC software then buy the software license and hardware as a package. The license for the software is tied to the specific controller so you can load it on as many PCs as you like but it will only ever run the one controller. I bought mine direct from the CNC Drive website and was very happy with the service and delivry to Australia, but if you can get it cheaper elsewhere then go ahead. No doubt others will chip in with the best UK suppliers.

Kit

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Originally Posted by 703E5

Thanks Kit, and thanks to everybody else that has replied.
I will take all your time served advise and bite the bullet, I like a challenge but think the PP route would, by the sound of it, be too frustrating.
After all I want to make stuff, I don't want to spend all my time tinkering and problem solving.
Thanks again.

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If you are thinking to buy either AXBB-E or UC300 then get in touch as I stock and fit them to machines we build. I will do you a good price and it will come with a UCCNC license file.

If you don't have the budget for this then in my box of test controllers I will probably have some ethernet and USB controllers, think I have both an Ethernet and USB Smooth stepper. I may even have a Cslabs IP-M controller so if you don't mind used then I could work out a price.

However, all of the above are Mach3/4 only, well the Cslabs can use their own software but it's rubbish. Mach3 is long in the tooth and unsupported which is the main reason why I changed after over 20yrs using mach3. UCCNC is much much better and far more stable, plus it's fully supported, and developed by the controller manufacturer so it will be for the foreseeable future.
Mach4 is very buggy and difficult to set up plus its nearly 4 x the cost of UCCNC and doesn't support the controller directly so if the card manufacturer doesn't provide a plug-in or update the plug-in regularly you are a stuffed and left with software that won't talk to the controller.!

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Kitwn

I'm the ultimate cheapskate when it comes to machine building but should have made the change long before I did.

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I can vouch for that, I must have told him 1000 times to dump the PP but he wouldn't listen, so for being so Pigheaded and tight as a ducks arse I made him an honorable Yorkshire man...:hysterical:

Thanks Jazzcnc, I may take you up on that.
Wish I would have asked for advice before I bought a licence for Mach3 - to use specifically with my PP.
You live and learn. My learning always seems to effect my pocket. [emoji848]
If I hadn't bought Mach 3 and asked the question I would be making stuff by now. [emoji2959]
Trying to formulate a plan to hide the purchase from my better half - wish me luck.

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Quote:

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Originally Posted by 703E5

Thanks Jazzcnc, I may take you up on that.
Wish I would have asked for advice before I bought a licence for Mach3 - to use specifically with my PP.
You live and learn. My learning always seems to effect my pocket. [emoji848]
If I hadn't bought Mach 3 and asked the question I would be making stuff by now. [emoji2959]
Trying to formulate a plan to hide the purchase from my better half - wish me luck.

Sent from my SM-G981B using Tapatalk

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...on the other hand, you can still use something better than PP... The CNC Drive products have plugins, so you you don't need to use them with UCCNC, even if it would be the best solution.

Welllll...
with PP it all depends.
I'm using an Intel Mini ITX board (I guess it is D201) with on board graphics and PP + PCI PP as second one for pendant. OS is Win XP :)
Untill today, no hickups with Mach3, and I've been running quite hefty codes of more than 500,000 lines.
Only thing that I have switched off is toolpath display as Max RAM that the board can accept is 2 Gb, and is shared with graphics chip (if my memory servs me it is a SiS one).

Quote:

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Originally Posted by 703E5

Thanks Jazzcnc, I may take you up on that.
Wish I would have asked for advice before I bought a licence for Mach3 - to use specifically with my PP.

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You can still use the AXBB-E or UC300, in fact, any of the CNCdrive controllers with mach3 just by using the mach3 plug-in. You can always switch to UCCNC at a later date if you prefer.
You can if you want to use either and have both set up on the PC.

I do have an old desk top which runs xp and has a built in PP.
With that info I wonder if I could reserect that and see if I get any joy.
May be worth a go, will fire it up and see.
I have options now, which is more than I had a while ago.


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Quote:

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Originally Posted by 703E5

I do have an old desk top which runs xp and has a built in PP.
With that info I wonder if I could reserect that and see if I get any joy.
May be worth a go, will fire it up and see.
I have options now, which is more than I had a while ago.


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It might do.
Just check it has service pack3 first.
If not, there is an update archive on the ms website.

I've always said. Mach3 is that old, it was designed for xp. Any other o.s is grief waiting to happen.

Other than that. Take the advice on the UC controls.

Been mulling it over, think I need to heed the advice of those in the know.
PP BOB - RIP.
Going to go for the uc300, and actually get on with making some stuff.

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Quote:

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Originally Posted by 703E5

Been mulling it over, think I need to heed the advice of those in the know.
PP BOB - RIP.
Going to go for the uc300, and actually get on with making some stuff.

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Wise choice, but if you don't need all the I/O the UC300 offers then you may find the Axbb-e is the better option as it's much neater and comes with BOB built into it, the UC300 still needs a breakout board to be safe. Both the Axbb-e and the UC300 are identical regards the motion controller side so the UC300 offers nothing extra other than more ports (I/O)

Quote:

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Originally Posted by JAZZCNC

Wise choice, but if you don't need all the I/O the UC300 offers then you may find the Axbb-e is the better option as it's much neater and comes with BOB built into it, the UC300 still needs a breakout board to be safe. Both the Axbb-e and the UC300 are identical regards the motion controller side so the UC300 offers nothing extra other than more ports (I/O)

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The only real difference between the 2 is the secondary analog output and the way you install a 5th/6th axis. And of course the 300 needs bob's or equivelent.

1. Some servo's use 2 analog inputs for hybrid speed/torque mode. If required, use uc300.

2. Some have problems adding a 5th/6th axis to the Isolated outputs on bbe. Opto's seem to be non high speed (basically for switching). If you need to use a high khz kernel for pulses then use the non-isolated outs on port3 with a high speed bob (ucsb type + IDC26 cable).

Other than that the controller is exactly the same.

Haven't fired up my 300 yet, but the unit looks like a 'proper job'. :eagerness: Big step up from my £5 thing :smile:

Quote:

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Originally Posted by dazp1976

The only real difference between the 2 is the secondary analog output and the way you install a 5th/6th axis. And of course the 300 needs bob's or equivelent.

1. Some servo's use 2 analog inputs for hybrid speed/torque mode. If required, use uc300.

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Not exactly correct, I think you maybe don't understand how the Speed/Torque mode switching in servos works.?

You don't need 2 analog 0-10v OUTPUTS from the controller to use this feature on a servo. You just need Digital OUTPUTS which connect to Digital INPUTS on the servo drive to signal the mode change, you still use the same Analog speed reference output from the controller to command the speed or torque.
The Servo Drive just changes tuning parameters etc when it sees the Digital inputs change. The same is true when switching from High to Low-speed range on a servo spindle drive or going from Speed to Position mode for ridged tapping. All done using the same Speed reference input, whether that be digital or Analog, just controlled and switched using digital Inputs.

However, to the OP this isn't really relevant as he's using a stepper-based system and if he was it wouldn't be an issue provided he didn't need more I/O than the AXBB-E offers.
In fact, for the OP the AXBB-E is a better option than the UC300 + UCSB or UCBB combo because it comes with dedicated Analog Output built into the BOB which is protected, the UCSB and UCBB don't offer this so you need some external protection if you want to be safe. It's also upgradable with an additional BOB if more I/O is required.

I fit both the AXBB-E and UC300 to machines and to me for most stepper-based machines that don't run an ATC spindle or require lots of I/O then the AXBB-E wins hands down for its neatness and simplicity in one single board and it's not exactly short of I/O for most machines. The ratio I fit is at least 20:1 in favor of the AXBB-E.

I wish the AXBB-E was available when I built my machine. It is really a very nice product, well worth it's price. I think it's the best choice, even if the UCCNC license is not included.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by JAZZCNC

I can vouch for that, I must have told him 1000 times to dump the PP but he wouldn't listen, so for being so Pigheaded and tight as a ducks arse I made him an honorable Yorkshire man...:hysterical:

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I'll have you know my father was a pure-bred Yorkshireman of many generations pedigree (including a long-past Lord Mayor of York according to his mother) even if he was born in Karachi. But I accept the sobriquet with pride.

OK so AXBB-E controller would probably suit me better than the UC300 + extras.
Unless,
As I will be running 3 axis, with vfd for spindle, with plans to eventually set up pump for coolant .
Would this set up would require more I/O's than the AXBB-E has?

Really sorry for potentially stupid questions that some of you have probably seen 100000000's of times, but I'm struggling to establish what I need with what.

I suppose there's never a stupid question only stupid answers. [emoji56]

Right last one (for now), Mach 3 + AXBB-E. Have I wasted money on Mach 3 licence ? Should I have got UCCNC?
Oh for a simple life.


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Quote:

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Originally Posted by 703E5

Right last one (for now), Mach 3 + AXBB-E. Have I wasted money on Mach 3 licence ? Should I have got UCCNC?
Oh for a simple life.


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Try it - you have nothing to lose but your hair. A transition later down to the line to UCCNC is not difficult (and oh-so much more comfortable).

Quote:

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Originally Posted by 703E5

OK so AXBB-E controller would probably suit me better than the UC300 + extras.
Unless,
As I will be running 3 axis, with vfd for spindle, with plans to eventually set up pump for coolant .
Would this set up would require more I/O's than the AXBB-E has?

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Yes the AXBB-E has more than enough I/O's for a 3 axis router. You have 6 inputs and 7 Outputs (8 if you include charge pump but won't go there)
With the inputs, you will use 1 for E-stop, and depending on how you wire homes and limits between 1 and 6.
You have several ways to wire switches but the most common is to wire all the limits in series using Normally closed switches using just one input for all axis. If anyone switches trigger the circuit is broken and mach3 sees this as a limit trip.

Similar with homes switches but instead of Normally open you use a Normally closed type switch wired in parallel back to 1 input. Then if anyone switches trips mach3 sees this as Home for that axis.
It does this because by default mach3 or Uccnc home each axis separately so it only needs to see 1 input trigger, in which case you set each axis Home to watch the same input pin. Then whichever axis mach3 was moving at the time uses that position as Home location when the input trips.

If you wanted to have all 3 axis to go home at the same time then you would need to use 3 inputs, one for each axis. This is a waste really so not done very often unless you have lots of spare I/O.

Now if you want to save even more I/O this can be cut down to just 1 input for both Home and limits. This is done by using Normally Open switches on both limits and homes and wiring them all in parallel. Mach3 knows the difference between home and limits so when it's cutting it treats the input as a limit and when it's homing it temporally disables the limits and treats the input as Home position.
The only downside to this is that if one of your switches develops a fault or a wire breaks then because it's a Normally open switch you and mach3 won't know until it doesn't work. Where if a wire broke with a normally closed switch mach3 would see this as a limit trip and go into reset.

Horse for course really but using 2 inputs, 1 for limits with NC switches in series and 1 for homes with NO in parallel is preferred.
This would still leave you with 3 inputs for other things like probes etc.

With 7 Outputs you have plenty, will need one for controlling a relay which starts/stops the VFD, I would use the same relay to control the water pump if using Water cooled spindle this way it's only on while the spindle is spinning.
The other 6 can be used for things like coolant, vacuum, extraction or just turning the kettle on if you like. Often you'll use these to control relays or contacts because the outputs only provide low current so can't power high current devices things directly.
If you do this then also make sure you use relays with flyback diodes so they don't back-feed current into the Output and blow it up.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by 703E5

Really sorry for potentially stupid questions that some of you have probably seen 100000000's of times, but I'm struggling to establish what I need with what.

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No stupid questions but the ones you don't ask.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by 703E5

Right last one (for now), Mach 3 + AXBB-E. Have I wasted money on Mach 3 licence ? Should I have got UCCNC?
Oh for a simple life.

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Does it matter.? it's done either live with it or move on.!

Mach3 is still a very capable piece of software that has been around a very long time and got a lot of happy users. I used it for the last 2o+yrs and fit on 1000's of machines so would never say it's a waste of money. But it's a fact it's long in the tooth and unsupported and has been now for a long time.
UCCNC on the other hand is very well supported and far more advanced than mach3 so it is IMO the ONLY option someone buying an AXBB-E or any of the other CNCDRIVE controllers should use.!!! . . . . PROVIDED . . . they haven't spent money on a Mach3 license. In which case use Mach3 and live with any issues it may or may not bring up.

THAT SAID.!! . . . If you buy a controller from me then I will provide the UCCNC license at a reduced price to forum members which is a fraction of the mach3 license and still cheaper than if direct from CNCDRIVE. This makes it a no-brainer to me to use UCCNC rather than mach3.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by 703E5

OK so AXBB-E controller would probably suit me better than the UC300 + extras.
Unless,
As I will be running 3 axis, with vfd for spindle, with plans to eventually set up pump for coolant .
Would this set up would require more I/O's than the AXBB-E has?

Really sorry for potentially stupid questions that some of you have probably seen 100000000's of times, but I'm struggling to establish what I need with what.

I suppose there's never a stupid question only stupid answers. [emoji56]

Right last one (for now), Mach 3 + AXBB-E. Have I wasted money on Mach 3 licence ? Should I have got UCCNC?
Oh for a simple life.


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AXBB-E has plenty of outputs out of the box.
Enough for 4 axis + 9 other ancilliary switches etc + the analog 0-10v.
Port#3 gives another 11 on top of that I believe.

For me it was only lacking in the amount of inputs having only 6 + an exra 5 on port#3 (11).

The UC300eth + extras gives the same amount of outputs but can give you up to 49 inputs.
I needed more inputs which was the only reason I went to the 300.