Advice on converting my VMC

[Boyan Silyavski]

I am not sure about what you say Dean. Part of me agrees, part of me thinks differently. I am not defending anything here, just my cold reasonable thoughts /of a traitor who sometimes out of frustration is secretly working for the enemy /




This is how i am thinking.I am just proposing.Anyone should decide for himself. Only the facts:



-you can not skip machine setup with either controller

-that mr H. or sb else has made his machine ATC work with Mach3 or 4 is Not = support from sb if you start going the same way. Even if someone that knows will have the desire to help you, these people are busy, so lack of time will make that impossible.
I have still fresh memories about 2x expensive Galil boards in my possession,you know there is a plugin for them and Mach3. Even a support forum. fresh memories come to mind how nobody could help me when help was needed. So- No, don't rely to support or help if doing anything specific.

-an expert in Macros will have no problem programming any controller or software and making an ATC work

-Windows is crappy, PC even a cheap one could become quite expensive when starts to waste your time. Especially if you value it. You need right away to change the disk to a flash drive to avoid reliability problems, reinstall windows and so on,

-exchanging a dead controller is 1/2 hour. changing a PC-combo could take days . I know that for a fact, even that i am a Pc geek. What about the people that are not?

- i am sure the user database on the Chinese controllers is much bigger in volume than any typical one or even the whole Mach user database. These controllers are sold in the millions and i know that for a fact. Its known for a fact that they are fitted on ATC machines, have seen enough videos on the net and that some companies silently retrofit them here in Europe.

-if you hire sb from west expect >50-60 per hour for that job. I know at least of a couple of companies that could sell you the controller a bit more expensive but know what they are doing and speak English. So presale questions could be asked and even they could do the heavy lifting with the ATC setup.

-when real problems are encountered with an EU or USA made board, all publicity crap is not valid. Expect to be the guinea pig. Paying guinea pig. Expect lame answers, unacceptance of the problem and so on. No beauty from that moment on.




at the other hand:

-Chinese are extremely unreliable, cheat like monkeys, haggle like old gypsies and pretend to be dumb like donkeys. Like every other Asian they think they are superior to us - in trade, intelligence and cunning. Its a fact that any Asian is better in trade.

-Chinglish manuals are serious challenge to anyone's intelligence

-Chinese don't care what they sell here, they have enormous market

-Chinese don't have a hacking idea what we need, what functions are needed for DIY machine of any type or for a retrofit.

-Whatever they sell to us they seriously overcharge for it compared to their real price for Chinese market and meanwhile having the self satisfaction that they are hacking us

-Chinese make copies of the copies

[Clive S]

-Windows is crappy, PC even a cheap one could become quite expensive when starts to waste your time. Especially if you value it. You need right away to change the disk to a flash drive to avoid reliability problems, reinstall windows and so on,

I know that for a fact, even that i am a Pc geek. What about the people that are not?

Boyan How can you say the above with conviction. Windows is not crappy and you certainly do not require to change the hard drive to a flash drive. Hard drives will run for many years without any problems. Flash drives are new on the block and have not been tested for many years in service as yet. Although I am getting to like them.

at the other hand:

etc. We could say the same about the Russians but that would not be fair either

-if you hire sb from west expect >50-60 per hour for that job. I know at least of a couple of companies that could sell you the controller a bit more expensive but know what they are doing and speak English. So presale questions could be asked and even they could do the heavy lifting with the ATC setup.

If you know where to buy these and get good support why not put links up. Remember this is a forum to help each other not for self gain.

[JAZZCNC]

I am not sure about what you say Dean. Part of me agrees, part of me thinks differently. I am not defending anything here, just my cold reasonable thoughts /of a traitor who sometimes out of frustration is secretly working for the enemy /

Not quite sure what your meaning here with words like Traitor.?

This is how i am thinking.I am just proposing.Anyone should decide for himself. Only the facts:

-you can not skip machine setup with either controller

-that mr H. or sb else has made his machine ATC work with Mach3 or 4 is Not = support from sb if you start going the same way. Even if someone that knows will have the desire to help you, these people are busy, so lack of time will make that impossible.

No it doesn't and how can you say that. I've helped many many people and know of others that do all with differing experience levels. Many of them on this forum you included. How the hell did you get started.? ? ? . . . I'll tell you With help from others.

I have still fresh memories about 2x expensive Galil boards in my possession,you know there is a plugin for them and Mach3. Even a support forum. fresh memories come to mind how nobody could help me when help was needed. So- No, don't rely to support or help if doing anything specific.

You bought an out of date controller that wasn't fully supported anymore. It's also controller that is aimed at Professional usage and as such expected the person fitting as required knowledge. So Again it's case or workman blameing the tools.!!

-an expert in Macros will have no problem programming any controller or software and making an ATC work.

Exactly the users isn't an expert and those with the skills don't often give it away for free. So your cheap controller suddenly isn't so cheap or easy.!

-Windows is crappy, PC even a cheap one could become quite expensive when starts to waste your time. Especially if you value it. You need right away to change the disk to a flash drive to avoid reliability problems, reinstall windows and so on,

-exchanging a dead controller is 1/2 hour. changing a PC-combo could take days . I know that for a fact, even that i am a Pc geek. What about the people that are not?

Complete rubbish on both accounts. PC's are very reliable these days and if correctly backed up simple to restore. Also any PC controlling machinery should be dedicated PC and will be minimal re-install if required at all. Also doesn't need to be high end PC when used with decent motion controller so no great expense required.

- i am sure the user database on the Chinese controllers is much bigger in volume than any typical one or even the whole Mach user database. These controllers are sold in the millions and i know that for a fact. Its known for a fact that they are fitted on ATC machines, have seen enough videos on the net and that some companies silently retrofit them here in Europe.

Ok well then go find me somebody who's very competant and willing to freely share there knowledge of these controllers.? The simple truth is you won't or can't because while many maybe fitted to industrial machines they won't give there hard learnt expensively come by knowledge away. Even if they would share it they will charge hefty price for it.

-if you hire sb from west expect >50-60 per hour for that job. I know at least of a couple of companies that could sell you the controller a bit more expensive but know what they are doing and speak English. So presale questions could be asked and even they could do the heavy lifting with the ATC setup.

Yes so do I and sure just about anyone on here could find company to do this but then it's not DIY is it. May have well just gone out and bought machine with controller fitted.
This is like comparing apples with oranges. Completely different things.

at the other hand:

-Chinese are extremely unreliable, cheat like monkeys, haggle like old gypsies and pretend to be dumb like donkeys. Like every other Asian they think they are superior to us - in trade, intelligence and cunning. Its a fact that any Asian is better in trade.

-Chinglish manuals are serious challenge to anyone's intelligence

-Chinese don't care what they sell here, they have enormous market

-Chinese don't have a hacking idea what we need, what functions are needed for DIY machine of any type or for a retrofit.

-Whatever they sell to us they seriously overcharge for it compared to their real price for Chinese market and meanwhile having the self satisfaction that they are hacking us

Sorry Boyan but that's shamefull attitude. It's Disrespectfull and verging on Racist.
I've dealt with Chinise for many years both with CNC and other non CNC related business dealings and can tell you with hand on heart I've never been ripped off by one of them. Which can't say to be true by companys in EU.
I can also say I've never had supplier from Uk or EU send me unrelated gifts they are not trying to sell for free. I've had several such gifts from chinese sellers.!! . . . . Infact I'm drinking one of them Now.

Lets just say we are not going to agree on this one.!! . . I won't be replying to anything you post on this matter, I've said what's needed saying so don't waste your time and lets leave the OP thread alone.

[Proteus]

Jazzcnc, Thank you for Your thoughts :-)
Beleive me, i can not be talked into a solution i don`t feel comfortable with, but i don`t get easily scared of new solutions or technology either.
I am a self made man, learned electronics, computers and mechanics on my own, and to a level where i actually get employed by companies, and i`m proud of it.
I`m actually very curious about the GSX-990 Controller, and i will at some time next year incorporate it in my converted BF25 mill.
The VMC300 however is a cute little thing i want to make use of for smaller things, and will most likely run on a network 6 axis controller from Automation Technologies.
As for the ATC, i`m waiting for some pictures from a very helpful guy(The Engine Guy at CNCZone) who has the same machine, and where the ATC is controlled by some PLC.

My reason for this post is to get some feedback from you guys on choice of voltage and noise issues, experience with the 6 axis motion controller boards from Automation Technologies(or others),-
and issues with ATC communication.
I`m very curious with the CSMIO/IP-S and the HiCon Integra Controllers from Automation Technologies, claiming easy integration of Tool Changer.

[Colin Barron]

Or you could be our guinea pig and try one of the standalone 3- 4 axis chinese controllers. I will point you from where and which one exactly, if interested. Around 500-600 euro. means 300 euro cheaper than CSMIO and mach4 is another 200. I will buy it off if you are not happy. Just i don't have physical time to do all i want to, and one of these things is test said controller.

It is able to rigid tap and tool change . I am talking about the 980- 990MC , here is the manual . Dean said will be testing the 1000 one/numbers dont mean anything, its totally made by another company/ . So meanwhile i could test another one from third company. All of them are similarly priced and look like similar,

I am talking like this one here / this not the best price i think/ .

I got a price for the gsk980 direct and they wanted £1262 delivered, what is the price of the GSk990. What makes GSK so much better than the £450 controller from cnc workshop on ebay.

[Boyan Silyavski]

I got a price for the gsk980 direct and they wanted £1262 delivered, what is the price of the GSk990. What makes GSK so much better than the £450 controller from cnc workshop on ebay.

All the controllers in Aliexpress are rebadged GSK or a copy of them, not sure which. What did i say about Chinese some posts up, remember? / the near racist ones as Dean said, though it was only observations . Now start to get it?

[Colin Barron]

The price i got was £1262 for the GSK980MDc direct from GSK, the other Newker NEW990TDb was on Ebay £450 ish. Aliexpress appears to be for retail punters while Alibaba appears to be set up more for traders. I found GSK gear only on Alibaba. Of the Chinese controllers GSK appears to be the premier brand for the machine builders. For lathes with automatic tool change GSK980TDb, and milling machines GSK980MDc. I think if i do buy i would be happier buying from the manufacturer. In your experience will they negotiate on price?

[Proteus]

Hi Chaz, and thanx for your quick reply.
Have not planned a max budget yet. Might have to take it step by step if it gets to expensive though. Just want to get it up and running.
I have to admit, the CSMIO/IP-S looks really tempting after viewing docs and some youtube videos.
But like you said, it`s not cheap. However being able to control it from Mach software is the positive part for me not to familiar with heavy programming.
Manuals and docs have been stored locally on my computer for some late night reading.

[Chaz]

Hi Chaz, and thanx for your quick reply.
Have not planned a max budget yet. Might have to take it step by step if it gets to expensive though. Just want to get it up and running.
I have to admit, the CSMIO/IP-S looks really tempting after viewing docs and some youtube videos.
But like you said, it`s not cheap. However being able to control it from Mach software is the positive part for me not to familiar with heavy programming.
Manuals and docs have been stored locally on my computer for some late night reading.

You can do cheaper and have Mach3. The breakout board on my lathe is only like £30. This gives step / direction for a number of axis and a single relay output. It's basic but works.

[Proteus]

You can do cheaper and have Mach3. The breakout board on my lathe is only like £30. This gives step / direction for a number of axis and a single relay output. It's basic but works.

Yeah, i know Chaz.
But my plan is not necessarily finding a solution as cheap as possible. I will spend the money necessary(within limits) converting it to a good accurate VMC.
However i was hoping to find parts I`m able to handle without me studying programming for a couple of years before i get it up and running.
Hope i don`t sound impatiant though :-)