Help needed, advice on dismantelking baring holder/ballscrew

[GEOFFREY]

Hi, I think that you will need a proper 3 ph supply to run your machine, on my SCM the spindle is 7.5HP and the vac pump needs 5.5KW. G.

[george uk]

My spindle quotes ( i think ) 5kw at 380v and 3.6kw 220v on the case, the motors on the saw and multi drill head both quote power at ranges from 220v to 400v on there cases. the servoes are .75kw.

Hi, I think that you will need a proper 3 ph supply to run your machine

.

do you think a genny will have problems running it. i wasnt sure, i was thinking a big genny, something like this maybe.

16 KVA Diesel Generator 3 Phase Lister ST3 Engine Stamford Alternator | eBay

but if i can offload the vac and compresser, i wander if i can used cheeper jenny ( used obviously )

[JAZZCNC]

do you think a genny will have problems running it. i wasnt sure, i was thinking a big genny, something like this maybe.

You'll not run this from a Genny. Gennys don't supply a stabel enough power and the Servo's will go bonkers.!

Also I'm no electrics expert but your thinking about Inverters changing voltage is wrong, they can only put out what goes in. So 240 in 240 out, they change phase/frequency not voltage.

Rotary converters will change voltage but they are quite inefficient and you'd need a bloody big bugger for this.!

[GEOFFREY]

I am sure that if you use a genny that size you will have no problems running your machine, but I think that fuel costs and noise may be the downside. From the pictures you posted it looked like the machine is likely to be used in a residential area, and that is why I mentioned noise. Without a vac pump you may be able to get away with about a 10KVA unit. I don't know exactly what you are going to use the machine for, but I would not like to be without the vac hold-down system. Have you investigated the cost of installing a 3PH supply? I know that can be expensive, but it may prove to be the best answer long term. Anyway, good luck with whatever you do. G.

[george uk]

You'll not run this from a Genny. Gennys don't supply a stabel enough power and the Servo's will go bonkers.!

thats the info i need, is it get roundtable, could i stabilise the genny output. could you explain a bit more her please jazz so i can understand the problems.

Also I'm no electrics expert but your thinking about Inverters changing voltage is wrong, they can only put out what goes in. So 240 in 240 out, they change phase/frequency not voltage.

I will take pictures tomorrow so you can see what i mean, the extra box seem to have three large transformers ( windings ) or capacitors, and nothing else ( mabe four actually, will check tomorrow )

do have some money to spend on this but think the cost of supply 3 phase is prohibitive, i would rathewr have flexible options if available

Rotary converters will change voltage but they are quite inefficient and you'd need a bloody big bugger for this.!

.

Maybe this is the wayi just want to have a look at all options.

I do have a full independent 1 phaze supply to my workshop ( flat at back of garden, ). the machine main box says 400v 3f 35a. But i dont need the full capacity that its rated for. I purchased this, not to use fully as is, but to convert into the type of machine i need. 2 high power motors on the other heads are not needed. I may not even need the hydrolics systems that drops motors/spindle/heads. as the Z is on full rails.

On the 3 phaze side, i may only need to drive 3 * 0.7kw ( i think ) servoes and drivers ( or maybe 4 ), the VDF and spindle, --- so push come to shove, thats what i need to power... plus if i can get exsess, i will use it...

From the pictures you posted it looked like the machine is likely to be used in a residential area, and that is why I mentioned noise

ha ha yes, i have had this house her more or less 18 years, my neigbours are great. Getting it dismantled to get it in was a bit of a communal neighbourly job, and my workshop, is right at the bottom of the garden, its was a proper flat, just small, so its double walls and sound proff to some extent. I have blown things up down there a few times ( literally ), its got its own enclosed garden with high brick walls.

[GEOFFREY]

It is possible to get generators that will give a stabilized pure sine wave output, but I do not know if that would be economic with such a large power output. I think that even running a rotary inverter is likely to be too much for your normal domestic supply (I once ran a 3PH 4HP saw on my normal domestic single phase supply, saw worked fine, but whole house lights flickered on saw start up and I figured that the rest of my street that were on the same phase probably had the same problem!!!). Are you sure your Z axis is hydraulic? My machine has an air ram to counter balance the spindle and the auxiliary drilling heads have pneumatic plunge. The main Z axis has profiled rails and a ballscrew.Whilst I generally think "if it aint broke, don't fix it", as your usage seems to be very specialist I wonder if you would indeed be better off taking advantage of the super strong build quality of your machine mechanically and completely reconfigure the electronics to suit single phase, although that may mean downgrading the spindle power. I am glad to hear that you have good neighbours, moving that machine to the flat at the bottom of your site must have been quite difficult. G.

[EddyCurrent]

I wonder if you would indeed be better off taking advantage of the super strong build qualityof your machine mechanically and completely configure the electronics to suit single phase, although that may mean downgrading the spindle power.

That's the angle I was coming from in my earlier post.
Photos are going to be a must on this one I think.

[george uk]

hi

Are you sure your Z axis is hydraulic? My machine has an air ram to counter balance the spindle and the auxiliary drilling heads have pneumatic plunge.

yes, mins the same i think.

you would indeed be better off taking advantage of the super strong build qualityof your machine mechanically and completely configure the electronics to suit single phase

.

i need to cost that option.

I am glad to hear that you have good neighbours, moving that machine to the flat at the bottom of your site must have been quite difficult. G.

Will post photos when finnished. we had to achive a minumum cross section of 148 cm to get the part down the ally. and the ally floor is badley uneven.... it made it by less then 20mm, and we had to get it 40mters down the ally, then we cut a 5 mtr Ibeem into the side of the workshop, and slotted the machine in the 4500cm hole.

2 jacks, 2 pullys, 6 friends, 2-3 neighbours, lots of wood, and volumes of tea, Yorkshire tea made with lincolnshire water. PURE MANS FUEL.

[george uk]

right, took a few days to get everything in position so i can get to work on it. I need to transfer the picture i have sofar of the electronics to post them, am picking up the extra box tomorrow. so will post picture of that. I have a number of options with power and would like to explore everyones thoughts on the options am looking at, i need to work out

1. what's possible
2. what problems each may have
3. costs

in relation to power.

as as stated above, machine is 3 phase, 3* 0.85kw yaskawa sgdb 10vd and 15vd servos plus drivers. that i definitely want to use, a 5kw or 3.4kw spindle and driver ( frenic 5000g9s ), that if possible would like to use. It also, has 2 motors to run a saw and multi ( 15 bit ) drill head mech. and an air ram attached to each to lower out of the hood. that if i can use i will, to some extent. It has a compressor ( will put KW up tomorrow ).

I have fully independant standard supply to the workshop ( 240v ac )

I am re-designing the machine to be multi use, so i can explore a number of options for electrical supply. and this is need a bit more info on the advice above, i will try post the pictures from my phone, and i still need to take a picky of one part ( additional box )., so

generator options, is it doable from a 3 phase genny, what power ( KW ) ?

conversion to single phase. would it mean totally replacing everything,

rotary converter, does this make more sense than a genny.

any opinions

[EddyCurrent]

I worked in an electrical department during the time of the "Y2K Millennium Bug", the company had hundreds of PLC's, variable speed drives AC and DC, PC SCADA systems. Large generators were hired in the event mains power went down, tests carried out indicated the equipment would operate okay from the generators however it was an interim plan and not designed as a long term solution.
If you were to calculate costs over time for fuel, servicing, etc. and if you wanted to take advantage of the machine in it's current state, I would think installing a 3 phase supply would be the best solution or it may be possible to hire a small workshop on an industrial estate that already has it installed.
The other option as Geoffrey mentioned would be to convert the machine to single phase but I'm certain you would struggle to provide enough kW to bring it up to it's present specification.