Here we go again . . . MK4

[mekanik]

routercnc
if you have access to a vacuum pump you could degas the resin prior to installation, have seen old pressure cookers used with a perspex lid, then you could place the resin in a container that can be pressurised. poly pipe going to the bottom of the container, LOW pressure air on top of resin to initiate your pour, after bleeding you resin supply pipe place that in direct contact with the pour surface and this should prevent any entrainment. initial mixing might be better done with flat stirrer figure of 8, softly softly.
Regards
Mike

[Electroconducive]

I noticed you were rather vigorous with the mixing. You also poured the epoxy with some kind of measuring jug from the spout.

I am sure I read somewhere that poking a hole in the bottom of a container and using that to pour is a handy way to do it. It allows any bubbles that have formed in the 'gentle' blending of the two part epoxy to rise to the top. Stopping an aerated mixture being applied to the frame.

Also, it might be worth a try with the extra slow tropical hardener?

My thinking being the longer cure time would allow not only the bubbles to rise for the bottom pouring method, but the heat gun to work to release bubbles as the epoxy remains less viscous for longer.

I've never poured either. I am just repeating what I've seen other people have success with on this very forum.

Hope your next pour goes better.

[Desertboy]

You definitely did the right thing, if it was was me I'd be bitching about it for years to come but it's got to be right.

It reassuring to see I'm not the only one that can make a mistake although we call it learning ;)

[routercnc]

I think it was Clive who mentioned pouring into another container with a hole in the bottom. It crossed my mind but I had decided on the water bath to decrease viscosity and was concerned that water may get in and ruin the mix.
Sylavski had also posted lots on epoxy as well as Neal plus many others.
Thing is I'm not ignoring what others have written and it all goes in, and you have a plan, but you need to do it for real yourself to appreciate all the subtle aspects.
As for the tropical hardener I was using the 206 not the 205 hardener as this takes longer to set. I actually emailed West systems about what I wanted to do and was advised to use the 206. Thing is that a skin forms after 30 mins or so anyway and any bubbles will then be trapped so I don't think the long set time helps on the bubbles side. Good for self levelling though.
West said laying in one session was best rather than layers but I got the impression from the overall reply that they had not used it for 5mm beds for CNC rails. It is usually for boat repairs etc.

Whilst I wait for supplies to arrive plus some other parts I am rethinking my approach. Looked into vacuum pumps to degas but this is £200 for a small kit. I think next time I will :

Mix gently
Then place in water bath to help bubbles escape
Pop any remaining bubbles
Slowly poor but start in the 2 channels as bubbles come out first (and these are waste area)
Make sure surface is all wetted and coax with cocktail stick into all areas on first layer
Then maybe leave to just skin over (so still tacky) and repeat or may just go in one long session?
Pop any bubbles with cocktail stick or gently blow

Intuitively feels like this should be gently poured and touched as little as possible ( I think any prodding and touching will show on the finished surface)

Also thinking even with a perfect pour the last tiny deviations (once cured) will need shimming or epoxy putty to get the last 0.05 or so dialled in?

[driftspin]

I think it was Clive who mentioned pouring into another container with a hole in the bottom. It crossed my mind but I had decided on the water bath to decrease viscosity and was concerned that water may get in and ruin the mix.
Sylavski had also posted lots on epoxy as well as Neal plus many others.
Thing is I'm not ignoring what others have written and it all goes in, and you have a plan, but you need to do it for real yourself to appreciate all the subtle aspects.
As for the tropical hardener I was using the 206 not the 205 hardener as this takes longer to set. I actually emailed West systems about what I wanted to do and was advised to use the 206. Thing is that a skin forms after 30 mins or so anyway and any bubbles will then be trapped so I don't think the long set time helps on the bubbles side. Good for self levelling though.
West said laying in one session was best rather than layers but I got the impression from the overall reply that they had not used it for 5mm beds for CNC rails. It is usually for boat repairs etc.

Whilst I wait for supplies to arrive plus some other parts I am rethinking my approach. Looked into vacuum pumps to degas but this is £200 for a small kit. I think next time I will :

Mix gently
Then place in water bath to help bubbles escape
Pop any remaining bubbles
Slowly poor but start in the 2 channels as bubbles come out first (and these are waste area)
Make sure surface is all wetted and coax with cocktail stick into all areas on first layer
Then maybe leave to just skin over (so still tacky) and repeat or may just go in one long session?
Pop any bubbles with cocktail stick or gently blow

Intuitively feels like this should be gently poured and touched as little as possible ( I think any prodding and touching will show on the finished surface)

Also thinking even with a perfect pour the last tiny deviations (once cured) will need shimming or epoxy putty to get the last 0.05 or so dialled in?

Hi guys,


I must say by the sound of it West is harder with the bubble issue then the resin i used.


I did not use west systems resin, 209 was unavailable in NL.... had to look for a alternative but found a usable resin else where. 5hr of pot life so plenty of levelling time. Get the slow hardner


I weighed out (kitchen type 1gram scale) and mixed the resin+/- 1kg at a time in a 1.5 liter kitchen type container with a bend wire on the batterydrill.

The whole mix turned greyish from air getting trapped in the fluid. This worried me at first.


After mixing i left it to de-bubble for at least 30min or so, some bubbles at the surface of the container remained and where wiped away with a paint brush.

Then poured only in the bridge channel, in between the x rails. no bubbles remained after flowing out evenly.


Hope this helps.

Grtz Bert.



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[Zeeflyboy]

Pain that it didn't quite go as planned...

I have no experience with pouring epoxy for rails, but from having done other things where bubbles can be a pain I definitely suggest thinking about putting the epoxy in a container you can seal and plug into a vac pump or even just shop vac for 30 mins to de-aerate... if you can vibrate it at the same time (I sometimes use an old orbital sander stuck onto the container) it speeds up the process.

Once poured, is vibrating the frame an option? Can help bring bubbles to the surface.

Better luck for round 2!

[Nr1madman]

Nice! You are a true inspiration :)

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[routercnc]

Nice! You are a true inspiration :)

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Thank you !

[Blazing Black Beard]

I've been following on YouTube. I have just one question, why the epoxy leveling? Great machine by the way. I was thinking of combining ideas from several projects and picking the best bits from about 4 DIY CNC router machine builds I've seen on YouTube. Yours has been an inspiration. Hopefully being a complete beginner I'll find some very helpful people here.

I plan on starting my design this week and hopefully some time in the next fortnight I will have a solid idea and start working on a bill of materials after finishing the design. It will be very much like yours at about 1.5m square work area.

Again thanks for the great videos on YouTube. You have added an unholy amount of ideas and knowledge to this community and inspired everyone who's watched your YouTube series of 20 videos so far on this project :-)

[routercnc]

Sorry I missed this post. I don’t check the forum too often.

I used epoxy to get the surfaces level and parallel to each other. I don’t have a milling machine and if I did it would need to have 1000mm of travel.

Thanks for the kind words. If it is inspiring others then it makes the video creation worthwhile.