Boxford v190 cnc

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Or better still produce a bootable disc which does the equivalent of a windows disc. Lets face it we want to make our machines work.

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Sorry but it can't be more simple than this that I posted earlier in the thread

https://forum.linuxcnc.org/9-install...nt-iso?start=0

it is an ISO so you can copy it to a dvd or use Etcher to make a bootable USB you might have to go into the bios to change the boot order for the usb.

You have to remember that cd and dvd drives ore disappearing .

Edit: To use Etcher download the iso then fire Etcher up and use that to flash the usb

https://www.balena.io/etcher/?ref=etcher_footer

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Originally Posted by John11668

I must admit that I get mightily perplexed by the jargon these software folks speak .
I am not illiterate , nor am I unintelligent , but I am totally at a loss with their instructions , and the software I have looked (like Rufus ) is anything but intuitive.

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I've a wry smile on my face as I type this. If you think that is bad... welcome to LinuxCNC :)

Yes, I know you're talking about the ISO burner, and I'll admit to not having tried that particular package, but you're gonna need a cup of tea and a pack of HobNobs if you're going to get your head around LinuxCNC. Standard setups are fairly straight forward, but go off piste and you'll be grinding your teeth.

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Originally Posted by John11668

I must admit that I get mightily perplexed by the jargon these software folks speak .
I am not illiterate , nor am I unintelligent , but I am totally at a loss with their instructions , and the software I have looked (like Rufus ) is anything but intuitive.
I am an engineer , I can do a bit of wiring, and have a passing aquaintance with rudimentary electronics . I am also English..
Why cant the software guys speak english too?

Or better still produce a bootable disc which does the equivalent of a windows disc. Lets face it we want to make our machines work.
We dont want to be software gurus.

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Hi John
I would be happy to burn you a dvd with the mint Linux and linuxcnc 2.8.0
I have used this very dvd today to set the HP of that arrives this week
Instal could not be simpler. Power on the pc. Open the dvd tray and pop in the dvd disk
Power off and then back on and press f9 and f10 repeatedly
You will get a boot selection screen. Select disk and wait a few seconds
Mint will start to boot up from the dvd

Once into the mint desktop there is disk icon on the desktop that you click to install mint and linuxcnc onto the desktop

Cheers. Paul


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Originally Posted by depronman

No it appears the pc in question doesn’t like the booting from a pen drive
Paul
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Come on...im not going to send you a PC that works :-D

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Originally Posted by Doddy

I've a wry smile on my face as I type this. If you think that is bad... welcome to LinuxCNC :)

Yes, I know you're talking about the ISO burner, and I'll admit to not having tried that particular package, but you're gonna need a cup of tea and a pack of HobNobs if you're going to get your head around LinuxCNC. Standard setups are fairly straight forward, but go off piste and you'll be grinding your teeth.

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I could not agree more Doddy
Every time I think I understand linuxcnc configuration I realise that I don’t
But I am getting there and the linuxcnc forum is excellent

The stepconfig wizard gets you the basic machine up and running then you built it up from there. I’ve eaten more than one packet of chocolate hobnobs [emoji23][emoji106]

Don’t forget the parport configuration that I posted yesterday this tool me all evening to work out that the parport must be disabled in the bios This allows it to be seen along with a pci parport by Linux
This makes no sense to me but it worked on both versions of Linux and on linuxcnc 2.7.14. 2.7.15. 2.8. 2.9


Paul


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Originally Posted by BernieNUFC

Come on...im not going to send you a PC that works :-D

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It works perfectly Bernie, just doesn’t like booting from a pen drive
Give it a dvd with the iso on it and it was as happy as Larry
It just took me some time to find my box of blank DVD’s. The mrs had put them somewhere safe

I guess bootable pen drives were not a thing in 2009 [emoji23][emoji2957]

I still can’t get over how quiet the HP PC is you can hear a pin drop when it’s on

Cheers. Paul


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Originally Posted by Muzzer

You should be able to boot off a USB pen drive but did you make it a bootable drive first? Many (most?) laptops don't have DVD drives these days, so it's a common thing to do.

Installation gets easier each iteration it seems. https://forum.linuxcnc.org/9-install...inuxcnc#184773

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Yes the pen drive is bootable. It’s been used to boot into Linux on numerous different PC’s laptops and even a MacBook Pro

I also entered the PC’s boot menu just after the bios

When I burned an dvd with the iso the pc booted up find using the dvd

Paul


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Hi folks and thanks for the flurry of constructive help.
I have managed to make a boot drive , installed linuxmint as an OEM install wiping all other stuff on the way, and am accessing this forum via LM.
Will clearly get used to it and when I do I will download linux CNC.

May need a socially distanced gathering to set up CNC but could just about manage that with someone sitting on top the Bantam, the washing machine (for overalls ) would be a comfortable perch in the other corner , and if someone doesnt mind sitting on the Khasi then we could just about manage ,:smile:

Hobnobs or pasties depending on preference , and tea for man and beast.
Who would need a Forum??

All I need now is to get this "Effing" TCL 125 into running order and I think I am getting close .
Maybe still need some help on the spindle relay to get there :smile:

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I have managed to make a boot drive , installed linuxmint as an OEM install wiping all other stuff on the way, and am accessing this forum via LM.
Will clearly get used to it and when I do I will download linux CNC.

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Did you do it from the link I gave you.
.

If so you also have linuxcnc.
.

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I must admit that I get mightily perplexed by the jargon these software folks speak .

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You mean like this:-

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and am accessing this forum via LM.

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Might need a LinuxCNC expert here - can LinuxCNC and the real-time kernel be easily installed on a Mint base installation? (I've only ever installed the LinuxCNC/Debian prebuilt package?

Reason I ask, John, is if not you may need to install the LinuxCNC ISO image similar to what Clive links to, in which case I wouldn't go too far down the path you're following, if you find yourself re-installing down the line

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Originally Posted by Doddy

Might need a LinuxCNC expert here - can LinuxCNC and the real-time kernel be easily installed on a Mint base installation? (I've only ever installed the LinuxCNC/Debian prebuilt package?

Reason I ask, John, is if not you may need to install the LinuxCNC ISO image similar to what Clive links to, in which case I wouldn't go too far down the path you're following, if you find yourself re-installing down the line

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The link I put up is https://forum.linuxcnc.org/9-install...int-iso#165631 the RT version with Mint with linuxcnc and wifi support and is simple to upgrade .

In a terminal type

sudo apt-get update
then
sudo apt-get dist-upgrade

will get you the latest packages


If you want the official version :- http://www.linuxcnc.org/iso/linuxcnc-2.8.0-buster.iso The Debian 10 Buster ISO uses a PREEMPT-RT patch

But in my opinion the mint one is a lot more user friendly.

My understanding is Doddy is correct
Linuxcnc needs the RT kernel
The link provided is for an iso of Linux mint 19.3 which also includes linuxcnc 2.8.0 already installed
This means that someone (beagle brain from memory) as already done the hard work and integrated linuxcnc into Linux mint

If I was John I would take the easy route abs use the iso with all of the hard work already done for you

Paul


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Will have a look again in the light of day .
In all honesty Clive I got so lost amongst what google threw up that I "muddled "my way through, but no harm done as I can easily go back to square one and start afresh. With a clean box little is lost.
At least I now know that Bernies box works ( Thanks again Bernie) and I now know how to make a bootable drive , So at least one step forward when I go your route Clive .
.
I quite like the clean desktop of linux so will try to keep it that way and leave all the rubbish on the windows machine.
I still have Mach3 and UCCNC on there for the mill , so maybe have to get used to switching. between operating systems

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Originally Posted by John11668

Will have a look again in the light of day .
In all honesty Clive I got so lost amongst what google threw up that I "muddled "my way through, but no harm done as I can easily go back to square one and start afresh. With a clean box little is lost.
At least I now know that Bernies box works ( Thanks again Bernie) and I now know how to make a bootable drive , So at least one step forward when I go your route Clive .
.
I quite like the clean desktop of linux so will try to keep it that way and leave all the rubbish on the windows machine.
I still have Mach3 and UCCNC on there for the mill , so maybe have to get used to switching. between operating systems

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John
Its no use to try and download linux from anywhere but from the linuxcnc site that is where the links came from that I gave you.

The site that you linked to is charging you £9 for a 32 bit version of linux which is FREE . You need the 64 bit version from the linuxcnc site as it need a real time kernel.

Please re read this post from the beginning. It is not as complicated as you make out. I will even post you a usb stick with linuxcnc on it and it will load linuxcnc in 10mins

Sorry to be pedantic but these days linuxcnc has never been easier to load.

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Originally Posted by Clive S

John
Sorry to be pedantic but these days linuxcnc has never been easier to load.

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Sorry to hijack the thread - Clive - I'm keen to try Mint - do you know if it's possible/easy to install alongside another (Debian) install?, I really don't want to trash my Deb. install just yet, but I do prefer Ubuntu to Debian, and I guess Mint will provide a closer experience to Ubuntu.

EDIT: And, apologies Clive - the link you pointed to (I'm there now to download your recommended ISO) also includes the instructions how to update a base Mint install to include the RT kernel, LinuxCNC etc, although I do think a clean install from an ISO provides the lowest risk hassle-free install.

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EDIT: And, apologies Clive - the link you pointed to (I'm there now to download your recommended ISO) also includes the instructions how to update a base Mint install to include the RT kernel, LinuxCNC etc, although I do think a clean install from an ISO provides the lowest risk hassle-free install.

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IF I am not mistaken you can boot the iso and it will load a live version to see it and won't overwrite the HD until you click on the iso button on the desktop. It is a good idea to be connected to the internet when installing .

In your case why not just swap out the HD for another and test it out on that. Then you can always put the other HD back.

One very good think with linux is that you can generally move HD's around from machine to machine without issue.

If anybody is interested.
I am considering making a post about the HAL and INI files to simplify or try to explain what they and how they work as I know there is a lot of confusion around this. But as you know I am not good at explaining stuff.

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Originally Posted by Clive S

IF I am not mistaken you can boot the iso and it will load a live version to see it and won't overwrite the HD until you click on the iso button on the desktop. It is a good idea to be connected to the internet when installing .

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I'd prefer to install - then I can go a long way to breaking things with other package installs etc, configuration, customisation, but with a view of stepping back from the cliff and recovering back to normal if it all goes wrong.

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Originally Posted by Clive S

In your case why not just swap out the HD for another and test it out on that. Then you can always put the other HD back.

One very good think with linux is that you can generally move HD's around from machine to machine without issue.

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Sigh!, you must think I've hard-drives just lying around.... Oh!, I do. Fair point, will take that approach (though will need to copy my machine installation first.

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Originally Posted by Clive S

I am considering making a post about the HAL and INI files to simplify or try to explain what they and how they work as I know there is a lot of confusion around this. But as you know I am not good at explaining stuff.

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Happy to review technically if you want a second pair of eyes. No ulterior motive other than knowing it can be useful having a second pair of eyes/perspective. Does it belong here?, possibly not, but although there is substantial documentation on LinuxCNC sites/forums, it's very regimented and fragmented, and doesn't bring different topics together well.

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Originally Posted by Clive S

IF I am not mistaken you can boot the iso and it will load a live version to see it and won't overwrite the HD until you click on the iso button on the desktop. It is a good idea to be connected to the internet when installing .

In your case why not just swap out the HD for another and test it out on that. Then you can always put the other HD back.

One very good think with linux is that you can generally move HD's around from machine to machine without issue.

If anybody is interested.
I am considering making a post about the HAL and INI files to simplify or try to explain what they and how they work as I know there is a lot of confusion around this. But as you know I am not good at explaining stuff.

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I can confirm that when you start the pc with the mint iso from either a pen drive or dvd it does not install mint instead it loads mint and lets you look around and run linuxcnc but will not save any configs. You can run the jitter year etc but I did get slightly worse results until I installed mint on the hdd
If you are happy with mint then there is an ‘install to hard disk icon’ icon on the desktop. Click this and it’s all done in a matter of 10mins

All the best. Paul


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Originally Posted by depronman

I can confirm that when you start the pc with the mint iso from either a pen drive or dvd it does not install mint instead it loads mint and lets you look around and run linuxcnc but will not save any configs. You can run the jitter year etc but I did get slightly worse results until I installed mint on the hdd
If you are happy with mint then there is an ‘install to hard disk icon’ icon on the desktop. Click this and it’s all done in a matter of 10mins

All the best. Paul


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Cheers depronman (hey!, you're local to me!), I do foresee a reboot or two during configuration, so would want to install to disk before making my mind up. I was hoping there was a positive "no worries - just dual-install/boot through grub", but it does feel safer to swap out a HD (that I had to remove a spare HD from my keyboard at 6am this morning kinda amplifies this as a solution).

Yes we live not very far away from each other
Not sure I fully understand you last post

Paul


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Originally Posted by depronman

Yes we live not very far away from each other
Not sure I fully understand you last post

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Unwarranted concern that I'd have to make system changes that would need to be committed to disk and rebooted (e.g. network configurations across twin NICs, including static configuration for the Mesa-based LAN interface (separate to the main interface) - usually if you have to tweak system files you're either restarting services or rebooting. My expectation was that the install was booting from a read-only filesystem into ram - I think that's what the Debian install does (can't remember now), BUT... just tried a boot from USB and was able to copy my machine config over, rebuild my custom HAL components, uplift my machine configuration automatically) and got the lathe running under Mint/LinuxCNC 2.8 within about 10 minutes.

Too late to cancel the same-day order for the removable drive-bay adapter.

Mint looks, for the 15 minutes I've played with it, much more comfortable than Debian.

Yes I would agree on the mint look and feel over Debian

Good result on the swift changeover
I have a couple of hard drives with a Debian setup on my orac lathe. I’m feeling the need to move that to mint as well. But really need to concentrate on the boxford atm

Paul


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Hi All,

Just adding my name to the Linux / Mint / LinuxCNC party going on here. This will be the basis for my Boxford tcl240 conversion that I know a few of you have already commented on (thanks). I snagged a PC yesterday, and have collected a screen and some other bits and pieces together, and now have the prepackaged Mint/Linux iso waiting on a usb drive (thanks for the link) and GParted on a CD ready to get to work on an old hard drive..... I'll let you know how I get on once Ive located a VGA cable to plug my monitor in!

Ade

I made another attempt using ‘etcher’ to copy the mint iso to a pen drive
All very straight forward to use etcher and the pen drive worked perfectly even on the
HP pc that previously did not like the pen drive

Etcher 1. Rufus 0. I k ow which I’ll be using in the future

Made good progress today getting a hb04 wireless pendant working and set up
Still got a small problem with the step size selection which is not working quite as it should


Paul


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I didnt find rufus user friendly.
I used win32 disc imager and downloaded mint from clive's linked site
Not being used to linux (never seen it before) it took me a while to find the linuxcncfiles and select lathe from the plethora of configurations , but I have it now with a desktop Icon.

Still puzzled a bit as to how to configure it though .

No problem for now as I need to finish the wiring yet and as I said before I will check this out using Mach 3
Then will come back for specific tuition on Linuxcnc

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Not being used to linux (never seen it before) it took me a while to find the linuxcncfiles and select lathe from the plethora of configurations , but I have it now with a desktop Icon.

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I think you may have got a sim working. If you have that lets you play about and use the gui but won't drive a machine.

If you are going to use a P/port the you need to use the stepconf wizard to get started http://linuxcnc.org/docs/2.8/html/config/stepconf.html

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Originally Posted by Clive S

I think you may have got a sim working. If you have that lets you play about and use the gui but won't drive a machine.

If you are going to use a P/port the you need to use the stepconf wizard to get started http://linuxcnc.org/docs/2.8/html/config/stepconf.html

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I think you will be right there (sim only)
Paul


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so this is what I was looking at

Attachment 28996

Maybe I just need to send Clive a pen drive .

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Originally Posted by John11668

so this is what I was looking at

Attachment 28996

Maybe I just need to send Clive a pen drive .

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Pat yourself on the back :applouse: you have the pendrive

Ok you have linuxcnc loaded but what you have there is the sim. :yahoo: you have Linuxcnc but the error is showing that the pc might have to be setup by changing some setting in the bios

Now find the wizard and use stepconf to make a real working config.

are you going to use a P/port ?

See my post with the link to stepconf

Thanks for the heads-up on Etcher Paul, I used this and the iso booted first time.

My jitter readings are crazy high with my Dell. Going to try with external graphics and see where that get me but may need to change to a different motherboard, we shall see

Ade

Should I be looking at my "Jitter" readings
Until this thread started I did not even know I had any ????

Crazy high = ??, out of curiosity.

Hi Doddy.

With everything I can shut down in bios shut down, excepting a pair of rear panel usb ports, with the machine at IDLE, I have 'Max Jitter' figures of Servo 122,194 and Base Thread 52,639....

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Originally Posted by clutchslip

Hi Doddy.

With everything I can shut down in bios shut down, excepting a pair of rear panel usb ports, with the machine at IDLE, I have 'Max Jitter' figures of Servo 122,194 and Base Thread 52,639....

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That is very high
I think on the HP slime PC I’m seeing 15,000 to 34,000
If was thrashing the pc. Gear display running and on internet opening and closing web pages etc

I have set max jitter in the linuxcnc configuration at 50,000 to be on the safe side

Paul


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Originally Posted by Doddy

Crazy high = ??, out of curiosity.

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You should be looking for < 40,000
On a lathe a CV little higher will not hurt
You are running the same HP pc as I will be using (yes). If so then the max jitter is really quite low
Can likely be improved with an external graphics card as linuxcnc is not recommended with onboard graphics which share system ram
But having said that I’m getting quite low max jitter readings anyway so I think all will be ok

It’s an option from the linuxcnc menus to run test max jitter
Set it running then abuse the pc as best you can and come back to the results after about 10 mins and use the result displayed in your linuxcnc config
What it actually does is inform linuxcnc how much resource is available to process things. When it runs out it would be bad so it limits movement speed to a slower love per second to fit within the available resources
You are not going to hit this on a small lathe as first only two axis are being moved at any time and secondly the steppers are not micro stepping down to really low values. I think I run mine at 4 micro steps which means one Rev of motor (4mm true movement) is a total of 800 pulses
You can imagine as the micro stepping is increased, some run 64 micro steps, that the number of step direction pulses increase very quickly for the same amount of physical movement
Then
Multiply this by three axis movement potentially all at the same time on a mill and you can see that pc resources are a lot more critical on a mill than a lathe

Paul


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Anyone tell me what these buttons are for please?
Attachment 29043

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Originally Posted by BernieNUFC

Anyone tell me what these buttons are for please?
Attachment 29043

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I would think trip reset buttons for various thing
Maybe axis movement is one. Spindle / cutter rotation would be another

Paul


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Any change of a picture or two of the front of the machine please


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Mine is identical to this
Attachment 29044

So a slightly newer version than mine is
What does the blue button at the large section of the control panel do. Mine does not have that

Paul


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