El Beast - Initial design phase, comments and critique welcomed!

Man that Z Axis really is awesome! Far too nice to actually use and get dirty :witless:

Alex

You know Zeeflyboy you're a bastard because you've upped the bloody bar! Now we all have to aspire to your level not going to even attempt it with my present build but the next build I'm going to be copying you and then pretending like that's how I was always going to do it ;)

Between you and routercnc I feel like going home, ripping all my hair out and crying lol.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Desertboy

You know Zeeflyboy you're a bastard because you've upped the bloody bar! Now we all have to aspire to your level not going to even attempt it with my present build but the next build I'm going to be copying you and then pretending like that's how I was always going to do it ;)

Between you and routercnc I feel like going home, ripping all my hair out and crying lol.

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Hahaha you say what we all feel :D
Usually you just have to dig deep, go back to the drawing board and make a winning concept.
With these guys I have to admit defeat and bow humbly..

Skickat från min SM-N910C via Tapatalk

Very kind, but I wouldn't put my work in the same category as routercnc.

In hindsight I think one big improvement to this Z-axis would be to use longer rails and Z-plate, such that in the full down position the top of the Z-plate is flush with the top of the main body, thus keeping the unit sealed at all times when down in a cutting position. That would also allow one to space the upper carriages up without losing travel, thus giving an even more rigid setup.

Oh well, there's always a v2 ;)

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Zeeflyboy

Very kind, but I wouldn't put my work in the same category as routercnc.

In hindsight I think one big improvement to this Z-axis would be to use longer rails and Z-plate, such that in the full down position the top of the Z-plate is flush with the top of the main body, thus keeping the unit sealed at all times when down in a cutting position. That would also allow one to space the upper carriages up without losing travel, thus giving an even more rigid setup.

Oh well, there's always a v2 ;)

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I have been watching your build and I have been amazed by your quality of work. I am starting to design my router and will definitely be taking some ideas away from your build.

I agree with your comment about increasing the length of the rails but more for the fact that your seals might see some wear the more they run over the edge of the rail unless you have a good lead-in on the rails. I doubt it will be much of an issue here but thought I would point it out.

Keep plowing away at the build, I enjoy the updates!

JZ

Did a little more work, haven't finished these side plates yet but thought I'd show where I'm up to.... they still need milling on the underside but I haven't quite decided how I'm going to do that yet.

So first up I just whizzed out some inserts from 0.6mm matte finish carbon fibre. Normally I would cut submerged but given it was such a thin piece and an extremely quick job I just used the vac with hepa bag and hepa filter.

For cutting CF I only ever really used double sided tape. Works very well and the waterproof variety doesn't mind being submerged...

https://i.imgur.com/2Z05vCA.jpg

https://i.imgur.com/6jTZ96r.jpg


Out of interest I get asked occasionally what I use for cutting CF - my favourites are these diamond coated fishtail burrs from BZT

https://i.imgur.com/o99cq4O.jpg


So given that these side plates were going to be awkward to hold down without using a larger piece of alu and leaving tabs in I thought I would try something I read about online. I have in the past used double sided tape to hold down parts but the tape either tends to be a bitch to remove the part and clean up the residue or too weak and all types I have tried have allowed too much movement in the part which then leads to vibration of the part during cutting.

I saw someone do this and thought I would give it a go since these parts aren't particularly critical! My only reservation was that it might all go horribly wrong while using coolant, but I dialled back the mist to a bare minimum and it seemed to work fine.

So the basic idea is that you lay down some strips of masking tape on to the part and then lay corresponding pieces down onto the bed.

https://i.imgur.com/LcCNvLD.jpg


You then put a little superglue on the top of the tape and while lining it all up, push the plate down firmly into place. I turned the tape on the plate over the top to make it easy to line up before then removing the excess once it was stuck down.

https://i.imgur.com/lZtx6VJ.jpg

https://i.imgur.com/9UyHzy4.jpg


I was actually very surprised at how firmly the plate was held in place - no wiggle like you can get from double sided tape. Anyway, proof is in the pudding as they say and it worked exceptionally well.... sounded great when cutting and the chips didn't dance on the surface as they do when using normal tape, suggesting the part wasn't able to vibrate. One day I will need to make myself a nice vacuum setup but one project at a time!

https://i.imgur.com/5LMLuYs.jpg


Before removing the plates I just checked the fit of the inserts in case anything needed tweaking but they were a perfect fit

https://i.imgur.com/3ncvVQW.jpg


CF plate isn't stuck down yet, just resting in place so it's not sitting perfectly flat for those with keen eyes:

https://i.imgur.com/qftzEPw.jpg


So anyway, next up I need to mill the underside and then print the side seals...

Dude that is going to look badass!

One thing I am curious to know is if you have experienced the Z axis rolling downwards on its own accord -due to the weight- when the stepper is not switched on.

On my milling machine, the weight of the mill head made it freewheel downwards when the power was off. I remedied this by using a belt drive, as opposed to the direct coupling you have on your Z.

I assume the the spindle/mount and sliding plate/rails are not heavy enough to overcome the natural thread retention of the ballscrew, so this may not be an issue at all with a router, as I've seen a lot of guys using direct coupling.

Also, did you go for medium or light preloading for the Hiwin carriages for the Z? I am thinking Medium for the Z, Light for everything else, though I guess it not so important..


Edward

Ah my eyes!!! Build porn again!!!

Quote:

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Originally Posted by JZimmy

I have been watching your build and I have been amazed by your quality of work. I am starting to design my router and will definitely be taking some ideas away from your build.

I agree with your comment about increasing the length of the rails but more for the fact that your seals might see some wear the more they run over the edge of the rail unless you have a good lead-in on the rails. I doubt it will be much of an issue here but thought I would point it out.

Keep plowing away at the build, I enjoy the updates!

JZ

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Cheers - Yeah I'm not too worried about wear (I can print new seals for a few pennies after all) but I do think there are improvements to be made to this Z-axis design. I was thinking about just making a longer plate with longer rails (and indeed probably will at some point) but I'm actually thinking a v2 will be change enough that it wouldn't be worth modifiying, rather just build an entirely new Z for the v2.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Edward

One thing I am curious to know is if you have experienced the Z axis rolling downwards on its own accord -due to the weight- when the stepper is not switched on.

On my milling machine, the weight of the mill head made it freewheel downwards when the power was off. I remedied this by using a belt drive, as opposed to the direct coupling you have on your Z.

I assume the the spindle/mount and sliding plate/rails are not heavy enough to overcome the natural thread retention of the ballscrew, so this may not be an issue at all with a router, as I've seen a lot of guys using direct coupling.

Also, did you go for medium or light preloading for the Hiwin carriages for the Z? I am thinking Medium for the Z, Light for everything else, though I guess it not so important..


Edward

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Well, not sure yet on this one. On my X6 it stays put when powered off (and actually requires a fairly good shove to start moving down), so I would expect this one will too - it is a little heavier with the large Z-plate and rails on the moving side, but that will likely be more than offset by the fact i'm using a 4mm pitch screw rather than 5mm like on the X6.

My carriages are all ZA (medium) preload.

Nick & Alex - cheers chaps :)