What software would be recommend?
Alright so I've gotten a lot of input and I realized the common denominator is that it really depends on what software you're starting with, and what your budget is set at.
So I got some great input on Linux cnc although I read up on it that you need a Real Time Operating System, (I don't really have a great understanding on that, if someone could help a brother out). I also see Mach3 and 4 are very common yet unreliable (I'm not totally sure why it isn't reliable but can someone explain or direct me to where I can find out)
I've also got solid recommendations about UCCNC using the UC400ETH controller
So what would you guys recommend that makes one software special, or why would you guys not recommend another software.
By the way, up till now I was thinking of purchasing either the Ethernet smooth stepper with Mach 3/4, or the UC400 with UCCNC.
Summary- what cnc software would you recommend for someone building a simple 3 axis cnc.
- sorry again if I left anything out or didn't make sense, let me know. Thanks so much!
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Re: What software would be recommend?
Quote:
Originally Posted by
jtar40
So I got some great input on Linux cnc although I read up on it that you need a Real Time Operating System
You will be using Linux OS in order to run LinuxCNC, there is no option
Linux is a "Real Time" operating system
They just like to bang on about it so much that they forget to mention the basics ;-)
Re: What software would be recommend?
Quote:
Originally Posted by
jtar40
I also see Mach3 and 4 are very common yet unreliable (I'm not totally sure why it isn't reliable but can someone explain or direct me to where I can find out)
I've also got solid recommendations about UCCNC using the UC400ETH controller
So what would you guys recommend that makes one software special, or why would you guys not recommend another software.
Mach3 isn't unreliable, Yes it's got the odd issue for certain users but so have others. The biggest down side to Mach3 is that it's no longer supported by Artsoft. They now only support Mach4 which IMO still isn't stable enough to be on sale with not enough support for Hardware suppliers.
Also don't get too hung up on the control software because for the average user with simpler needs just about all of them are more than capable and good enough to run 95% of machines. Mostly it comes down to personal tastes and dislikes of the screen layouts.
Quote:
Originally Posted by
jtar40
By the way, up till now I was thinking of purchasing either the Ethernet smooth stepper with Mach 3/4, or the UC400 with UCCNC.
Now Hardware is another story all together and it's here where you have to be careful and the software play's it's part.!
Nearly every External motion controller uses some form of Plug-in or Firmware type software for it to function. The Hardware supplier is usually the one who provides this, if it's using 3rd party control software ie: Smooth stepper/mach3 then it's very very important the Hardware people work closely with the software people when ever there is change. It's here where most fall down.!
The Plug-in is the heart of the controller and if it's not supported very well then at some point down the line, esp as the software updates, your going to get trouble.
Warp9 who make the Smoothstepper are just about the worst company at releasing updates or fixing any errors in there Plug-in software.
UCCNC software is made by the same Hardware supplier so they have total control when it comes to updates and bug fixing.
This is why UCCNC is starting to improve so much compared to Mach3/4. IMO the UCCNC as been much better than mach3 for quite some time but was let down by the fact it was USB, this isn't the case any more with the ETH versions.
Another issue for me personally being a builder of machines was the fact it didn't have any decent breakout boards that easily allowed 24v I/O and differential inputs. To me this is very important because of reliabilty. However this has also changed to some degree with Outside hardware supplier. Ideally I would prefer Both Motion control board and BOB to come from same hardware supplier but it's better than nothing.
SO my advise to new users looking for long term solution with relaibilty in mind would be this setup UCCNC with UC300 and UB1 BOB.
However I will clarify and say that, Mach3/4 or Linux CNC are more than capable of running any simple/medium machine straight out of the box using just simple BOB without any external Motion controller. OR UCCNC with cheap UC100.
IF on budget or just testing the waters with CNC then go with Linux CNC, yes will have bit of learning curve regards setup etc compared to Mach3 or UCCNC but still very do-able even for new user and there's plenty of help out there.
Hope this helps.
Re: What software would be recommend?
Quote:
Originally Posted by
JAZZCNC
Mach3 isn't unreliable, Yes it's got the odd issue for certain users but so have others. The biggest down side to Mach3 is that it's no longer supported by Artsoft. They now only support Mach4 which IMO still isn't stable enough to be on sale with not enough support for Hardware suppliers.
Also don't get too hung up on the control software because for the average user with simpler needs just about all of them are more than capable and good enough to run 95% of machines. Mostly it comes down to personal tastes and dislikes of the screen layouts.
Now Hardware is another story all together and it's here where you have to be careful and the software play's it's part.!
Nearly every External motion controller uses some form of Plug-in or Firmware type software for it to function. The Hardware supplier is usually the one who provides this, if it's using 3rd party control software ie: Smooth stepper/mach3 then it's very very important the Hardware people work closely with the software people when ever there is change. It's here where most fall down.!
The Plug-in is the heart of the controller and if it's not supported very well then at some point down the line, esp as the software updates, your going to get trouble.
Warp9 who make the Smoothstepper are just about the worst company at releasing updates or fixing any errors in there Plug-in software.
UCCNC software is made by the same Hardware supplier so they have total control when it comes to updates and bug fixing.
This is why UCCNC is starting to improve so much compared to Mach3/4. IMO the UCCNC as been much better than mach3 for quite some time but was let down by the fact it was USB, this isn't the case any more with the ETH versions.
Another issue for me personally being a builder of machines was the fact it didn't have any decent breakout boards that easily allowed 24v I/O and differential inputs. To me this is very important because of reliabilty. However this has also changed to some degree with Outside hardware supplier. Ideally I would prefer Both Motion control board and BOB to come from same hardware supplier but it's better than nothing.
SO my advise to new users looking for long term solution with relaibilty in mind would be this setup UCCNC with UC300 and UB1 BOB.
However I will clarify and say that, Mach3/4 or Linux CNC are more than capable of running any simple/medium machine straight out of the box using just simple BOB without any external Motion controller. OR UCCNC with cheap UC100.
IF on budget or just testing the waters with CNC then go with Linux CNC, yes will have bit of learning curve regards setup etc compared to Mach3 or UCCNC but still very do-able even for new user and there's plenty of help out there.
Hope this helps.
Hey Thanks for all that help, it definitely cleared up a ton of questions!
I am still a bit blurry on Linux cnc though, as I understand, Linux cnc demands parallel port being a "real time operating system." I hope I'm not misunderstanding this but I believe this is because USB/Ethernet sends gcode in bites and parallel port sends data directly to the breakout board. As I understand it, the "real time operating system" means Linux cnc intends on data being sent directly to individual pins through the parallel port instead of breaking it up into bites.
So my question is, am I correct here? Does Linux cnc need a direct parallel port or can it too be used with a USB/ Ethernet interface? If it can't, I'd probably invest in your UCCNC suggestion but if it can I think that'd be a good route to take because as you said before I'm still testing the waters here mostly for hobby use.
Again, my apologies if some of this may not make much sense, but thanks for the input anyways!
-Justin
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Re: What software would be recommend?
Linux is a real time operating system so when you install Linux CNC it will Install the real time operating system it requires.
In it's basic form then yes it requires a parallel port. But don't confuse for instance with Mach3 or windows parallel port because they have a layers software in between which makes them a buffered system so not real time. Linux and Linux CNC doesn't have these restrictions so is true real time system.
However you can if you want buy PCI cards that install into the PC slots. These are called Mesa cards and allow massive amounts of I/O and upgrade features, including Ethernet connection amongst many others. But to be fair this is not an area I'd point a new user because their will be very steep learning curve involved.
If you can find a PC with parallel port then Linux CNC is good cheap option for simple machine with limited I/O needs that new user could manage with little hand holding via Linux forum.
Clives S on this forum is the Man you want to ask. He's the Linux Guru around here..:devilish:
Re: What software would be recommend?
Quote:
Clives S on this forum is the Man you want to ask. He's the Linux Guru around here..
Dean don't take the piss:nightmare:
However linux and luxcnc are quite different. Linuxcnc is a motion controller that is embedded into a version of linux running a real time kernel. Now if you want to try it say for a simple 3 axis machine then it is simple as there is a program that is installed along with Linuxcnc called stepconfig. Stepconf is a program that generates configuration files for LinuxCNC for a specific class of CNC machine: those that are controlled via a standard parallel port, and controlled by signals of type step & direction.
You just fill in the boxes and it generates the configuration files for you. the step pulses etc. are generated within the PC.
If you want to have the pulses generated in hardware then you can use a Mesa card. that is installed in a pci or pcix slot in the pc in this case thee Mesa card is connected to a BOB through a db25 pin cable and will provide you with spindle control plus mpg encoder and loads of input and outputs all 24v etc.etc.
There is also a Mesa card than can be connected via lan cable.
Going down the Mesa route you use a program called Pnconf that is a wizard to get you going.
The download for the latest stable version is :- http://www.linuxcnc.org/linuxcnc-2.7-wheezy.iso
And the Docs:- http://linuxcnc.org/docs/2.7/html/
Re: What software would be recommend?
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Clive S
Dean don't take the piss:nightmare:
Clive was genuine big up, you know more than most on here about Linux CNC so don't put self down you Old Git.:hysterical:
Re: What software would be recommend?
It cost me ~£250 for a mesa solution for linuxcnc, I'd recommend going with the 7176e clive recommended me I didn't and it was more hassle getting a pc to actually work with the pci card I got. The 7176e is Ethernet so none of these issues.
Do you have 2 ballscrews and 2 motors on the Y axis? This is harder to setup but I managed it so you can lol.
Linuxcnc is funkier to setup, the linuxcnc forums are excellent though so you'll find plenty of help and once running it seems simple enough.
I like it and am glad I made the extra effort to go linuxcnc route (I would have gone mach 3 otherwise).
Re: What software would be recommend?
Quote:
t was more hassle getting a pc to actually work with the pci card I got.
If you are talking about the 7i25 card. Then I have to say that I have used a few of these with no issue. I have also had a lot of success with using PP pci cards with Lcnc with much issue.
You are correct that if two motors need to be homed to set the gantry square each time, then at this time you have to use the dev. branch (2.8) to do this. If that is not required then the best version is 2.7.12
Re: What software would be recommend?
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Clive S
If you are talking about the 7i25 card. Then I have to say that I have used a few of these with no issue. I have also had a lot of success with using PP pci cards with Lcnc with much issue.
You are correct that if two motors need to be homed to set the gantry square each time, then at this time you have to use the dev. branch (2.8) to do this. If that is not required then the best version is 2.7.12
I was just unlucky but pci is getting rarer of course ethernet is more future proof.
I had 2 machines that wouldn't boot with the 5i25 and then the 3rd machine wouldn't boot dvd or usb only cd so couldn't get latest linuxcnc on it. Then the last machine I tried had no pci slots only pcie so in the end I bought another pc for £10 from a local recycler and it worked fine.
On the linuxcnc forums I was told that there is a boot issue but it affects less than 1% of computers I just got unlucky twice but I have 2 RM education pc's from the same seller on ebay and when I checked they have the same motherboard although different cpu's.
Re: What software would be recommend?
As a matter of interest what bob are you using with the 5i25. Is it the 7i76?
Re: What software would be recommend?
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Clive S
As a matter of interest what bob are you using with the 5i25. Is it the 7i76?
At the moment got it connected to the cheap $5 PP bob but I've ordered 7i76 to swap over it might take me a little while to swap it over as it works lol.
My biggest issue is I'm stalling when cutting anything over 5m/min so I think I need to get 3nm motors for the X&Y, I only have 2nm direct drive, I have 10mm pitch ballscrew on now.
