Any USB/Ethernet controller suggestions?

[A_Camera]

That would be bad advise.! The DQ542MA are Analog drives which is old technology. Yes they may work ok for you or others but that doesn't make them good drives to buy. There is no reason to use Analog drives these days because Digital drives are so cheap and the performance difference is very noticable.

Are you kidding? The OP replaces TB6560 drivers and talks about Arduino...

The DQ542MA may be old analogue technology but it is well working, reliable, runs cold, fast and quiet as well as cheap, and for most amateurs/hobby users, that is more important than fancy modern digital drivers. Maybe one day I will get some digital drivers just for the fun of it, but to be honest, I really don't believe it would show any difference in my case. My machine is as fast as it can get and is much better than most other stepper based machines with direct driven ball screws can do, so I really don't know where digital drives could make a difference. Just because something is "digital" it isn't automatically better...

Also, I am sure you know this, but how well your drivers perform also depends on the motion controller. There is no benefit of faster and more modern drivers if you are limited by the mechanical and electrical design of the CNC.

[JAZZCNC]

Are you kidding? The OP replaces TB6560 drivers and talks about Arduino...

No I'm not Kidding and the OP ask's for suggestions for Good drives and to advise he buys old Analog technology is bad advise IMO.

Like I say just because your using them and happy with them doesn't make them good. It just means you don't know any better. You've already proven this by saying you havent used Digital drives so can't possibly know the difference.

Also to claim your machine is fast as it can get and is better than any other stepper machine is just plain ridiculous when your using analog drives with 50Vdc drives. Digital drives running stepper motors with 70Vdc will blow any analog drive with motors running 45Vdc out the water on every level.
Even like for like on voltage Digital drives will make difference to both speed and smoothness.

Regards the Controller making a big difference then your correct. However this is also a area where Digital drives make a huge difference over Analog when not using good motion controller Ie: PP because they handle resonance and lower grade signals so much better.

This isn't about Digital is better just for the sake of it. The truth is, whether you care to accept it or not, is that Digital is better for several reasons and anyone who has had shity Analog drives will tell you this.

[A_Camera]

No I'm not Kidding and the OP ask's for suggestions for Good drives and to advise he buys old Analog technology is bad advise IMO.

Fine, but then why debate with me and not giving him better advise?

Like I say just because your using them and happy with them doesn't make them good. It just means you don't know any better. You've already proven this by saying you havent used Digital drives so can't possibly know the difference.

My own experience is just as valid as anybody else's, but if I am wrong, fine, explain why and where so we all can learn something. Saying that I am wrong does not help anyone.

Also to claim your machine is fast as it can get and is better than any other stepper machine is just plain ridiculous when your using analog drives with 50Vdc drives. Digital drives running stepper motors with 70Vdc will blow any analog drive with motors running 45Vdc out the water on every level.
Even like for like on voltage Digital drives will make difference to both speed and smoothness.

It doesn't help if in theory it can spin faster when in reality the limits of the ball screw is reached. Of course, if you just spin the motor milling air (or just spinning) then it may be smoother and faster but will you REALLY see any difference in real use? Will the difference REALLY be as much as the difference in price? I doubt that.

Regards the Controller making a big difference then your correct. However this is also a area where Digital drives make a huge difference over Analog when not using good motion controller Ie: PP because they handle resonance and lower grade signals so much better.

This isn't about Digital is better just for the sake of it. The truth is, whether you care to accept it or not, is that Digital is better for several reasons and anyone who has had shity Analog drives will tell you this.

"Shitty driver" is the TB chips based drivers, not the DQ542MA. Anybody who claims the DQ542MA is a "shitty driver" has no idea about what he is talking about. Yes, no doubt that the digital drivers are better, the question is just how much better. Dismissing my experience is fine by me, but if you want to help the OP then answer his questions. I'll be fine with my "shitty drivers" as long as they do what they are expected to do, run as smooth and fast as they do and are as reliable as they are.

[JAZZCNC]

Fine, but then why debate with me and not giving him better advise?

I didn't need to give OP any advise because the correct advice had already been given by others. Unfortunately thou not by you and thou you don't like to hear this it must be said for the benifit of others.

My own experience is just as valid as anybody else's, but if I am wrong, fine, explain why and where so we all can learn something. Saying that I am wrong does not help anyone.

Yes your advise if valid agreed to a point.! . . But to spout and I quote "My machine is as fast as it can get and is much better than most other stepper based machines with direct driven ball screws can do, so I really don't know where digital drives could make a difference."
without any experience of ever using Digital drives and probably with same amount of experience of other machines with same setup to me just cancels out any validity to anything you said.

It doesn't help if in theory, it can spin faster when in reality the limits of the ball screw is reached. Of course, if you just spin the motor milling air (or just spinning) then it may be smoother and faster but will you REALLY see any difference in real use? Will the difference REALLY be as much as the difference in price? I doubt that.

How do you know you have reached the limit of the ballscrew.? I'm guessing your using 5mm pitch screw and I can tell you with 100% certainty thru lots of experience that 50V Analog drive with 3A motor, which will probably be running 40-45Vdc cannot get any where near the limit of 5mm Pitch screw that is correctly fitted. Even a 50V Digital drive with same voltage won't get near it's limit.

I suspect your going to quote ballscrews Critical speed in reply to this but I'm talking real world usage which is very different thing so don't waste your fingers.

"Shitty driver" is the TB chips based drivers, not the DQ542MA. Anybody who claims the DQ542MA is a "shitty driver" has no idea about what he is talking about. Yes, no doubt that the digital drivers are better, the question is just how much better. Dismissing my experience is fine by me, but if you want to help the OP then answer his questions.

No your the one who has no idea what he's talking about and here's why. The DQ542MA are just copies of original leadshine M542. Which in there day were just an average Analog drive, nothing special. As time went on Analog drives got little better with more advanced chopper circuits etc but still had limits/issues under certain setup/circumstances.
Jump forward several years and Digital drive arrived and even the early drives where major advancement from analog drives and when compairing to Cheap copies of Analog drive like DQ542MA where very big difference.

The current crop of Digital drives are light years more advanced than Analog drives with the end result being far superior performence gains in overall speed and much smoother performance at lower speeds and generally across the rull RPM range compared to Analog.
Combined then these make considerable difference in performance and I've seen machines with Old Analog drives which struggled to reach 1000 rpm instantly spin same motors at 1500rpm with smoother action and far less heating.

Now just to show I'm not just talking theory or got feeling in my water Digital may be better.! Watch these videos which I took to try and show others the difference Digital drives make. Also Just note that the videos don't actually tell the true picture or show the true difference in sound or smoothness. The same machine with only a drive change went from a maximum rapid speed of 8mtr/min to 15mtr/min.!! . . . And if you still think I'm bull shitting then I've got witness who can back this up in form of Clive S.

Anyone who's done there research on this forum will have seen that many many times I've expalined and shown why Digital is better. Every thing I advise is based on real world hands on experience, like wise If I recommend or call something bad it's based on me using or experiencing this product. Or I make it clear I've not used them but know from trusted sources that are good/bad.

Unlike you I would never put down or Dismiss something without first experiencing. Also I do get tired of repeating my self so please don't try giving me shit because I've not choosen to repeat my self but instead decided to try helping others by highlighting your Bad advise.

[A_Camera]

Jazz, those two videos are not very informative. No data about what "Clive Analog" or AM882 digital is using for motors, power supply or anything. Also, in my opinion, milling air is pretty pointless, if you want to show speed you should run rapid passes, not milling imaginary material. Yes, you say it went from 8m/min to 15m/min so that is good, but still not really say everything about the change, other than you swapped the drivers and the new ones are probably considerably more expensive than the old ones, but which were the old ones?

Yes, I am using 5mm screws and I am not sure you are right about me being far from the speed limit. Perhaps it is possible to drive them a bit faster, but 10m/min is a very good speed, no doubt about that.



Yes, in theory the speed limit is 35m/min for my Y screw (16mm dia, fixed one end 650mm apart, 5mm pitch, 7053rpm limit) but that is just the theory with an imaginary motor and no friction, no nut and a perfect screw, no eBay products, no vibration.

I have no doubt in my mind that digital driver is better than my old analogue driver is, but it is more a question of how much better and why than "it is better because I say so". ...and yes, I knew when I bought my DQ542MA drivers that they were copy of Leadshine drivers, so nothing new there.

There is also a difference in build quality. The machine in your video looks MUCH better build than most other machines I have seen, so of course, that is a huge advantage as well, but none the less, I KNOW that most eBay and DIY machines are not as fast as mine, even if I am not into the speed race and don't care much about bragging, but it is a fact that majority of DIY and eBay machines end up in the 4-5m/min maximum speed.

[magicniner]

Jazz, those two videos are not very informative.

Perhaps you might be informed by the fact that he builds high quality CNC machines for commercial customers? ;-)

[A_Camera]

Perhaps you might be informed by the fact that he builds high quality CNC machines for commercial customers? ;-)

Yes I know. Nevertheless those two video didn't say anything and was not very informative.

[Doddy]

A_Camera : Sorry - completely off-topic but I can't PM you - that video intrigues me - how have you terminated the braid on the CY cable? on your control box (I looks like a copper ferrule, in which case could you point me where you bought them? - or is it simply copper tape?) - If you can PM me to keep this thread from straying too far off topic?

[A_Camera]

A_Camera : Sorry - completely off-topic but I can't PM you - that video intrigues me - how have you terminated the braid on the CY cable? on your control box (I looks like a copper ferrule, in which case could you point me where you bought them? - or is it simply copper tape?) - If you can PM me to keep this thread from straying too far off topic?

PM sent.

[JAZZCNC]

Jazz, those two videos are not very informative. No data about what "Clive Analog" or AM882 digital is using for motors, power supply or anything. Also, in my opinion, milling air is pretty pointless, if you want to show speed you should run rapid passes, not milling imaginary material. Yes, you say it went from 8m/min to 15m/min so that is good, but still not really say everything about the change, other than you swapped the drivers and the new ones are probably considerably more expensive than the old ones, but which were the old ones?

They where never intended to be informative but purely to show difference Digital drives made compared to Analog. The spec is irrelavant in this case because nothing changed other than Analog drives where swapped for Digital.
However there was little more to it than just that.?
The machine was Originally built as favor to help new forum member who had very very tight budget. It was actually mostly built by Clive S using my design and little help from me regards machining etc and with spare component's we had laying around left over from previous builds. However the member Hit hard times and pulled out leaving Clive S with the machine which I then took over and upgraded to pass on to a customer. Hence why the videos are in different locations. This was the end result See pic.

The Original control box used the parallel port (Mach3) because of budget and was also housed in MDF box to save money. Obviously I couldn't sell it like this and won't use PP on anything I sell so new Control box was built. This gave me the perfect opertunity to see what difference individual components made.

So Orginal spec was 35Khz PP thru cheap BOB with leadshine M752 Copies(400Ms) spinning 3.1Nm 4.2a steppers with aprox 55-60Vdc. 10mm pitch screws.
This setup actually struggled to reach much past 4700mm/min.
So the first change was to swap out the PP for Cslabs IP-M 100Khz controller. This allowed the same setup to reach just over 6000mm/min before the drives couldn't handle the resonance and went into melt down. Next change was to adjust the Micro steps with the intent to move the resonance around, 800ms gave best performance of little over 8000mm/min before stalling occured.

The next change was the Am882 with 1600Ms which instantly transformed the machine into an Animal. The Max Rapid velocity with 1000s/s Acceleration was actually well in excess of 20mtr.min but it ran stable at 15000mm/min and would cut at this if required in certain materials, it happily surfaced the bed at this speed. The Actual Velocity and accelration was dropped to sensible 10M/min with 1500s/s acceleration for the customer who was new user.

Hopefully this level of detail meets your approval.

Note on the letters DM.!!. . Just because some Chinese Ripoff shop sticks DM on the front doesn't make them the same DM drives sold by leadshine nor does it mean they have same technology in them.
Leadshine DM are lower range of Digital drives the D identifies this. There Analog drives just used M. ie: M542 or M752. You will see loads of cheap knock off drives with DM or DQ before numbers but most are Analog not digital.
The AM and EM series are more advanced Digital drive and the AM have been superceeded by EM series and are just now becoming harder to find but still about. The EM are current and to be honest having used many sets there is very little difference between them. EM are Slightly smoother at lower RPM's but other than that no difference. So much so I've even mixed AM and EM on same machine, my own, and see no difference when using.

Whether you want to accept it of not the real truth is that Digital drives like the AM or EM are massive improvements on analog drives which transfers directly to very respectable performance gains even on the most well built machine with huge improvements in some cases because of there advanced resonance handling when using motors that are not exactly best quality.

Yes, I am using 5mm screws and I am not sure you are right about me being far from the speed limit. Perhaps it is possible to drive them a bit faster, but 10m/min is a very good speed, no doubt about that.

Yes for Analog drives I agree that's very good speed, mostly made possible by fact small machine and well made by your self. But just for the record my very first machine which used 5mm pitch screws would spin well above 10,000mm/min and that was with 1500mm length screws and Gecko Analog drives so your little machine still as lot left in it trust me.!

I KNOW that most eBay and DIY machines are not as fast as mine, even if I am not into the speed race and don't care much about bragging, but it is a fact that majority of DIY and eBay machines end up in the 4-5m/min maximum speed.

Yes build quality makes big difference but your observations are not a good indicator because it could be just case that the machine is dumbed down lower and doesn't mean it couldn't go much faster if required.
I've built many machine which could easily be tuned to travel at twice the speed I supply the user with, hence above machine, but in truth most are frighted to Jog or travel at these speeds and rarely can they cut at these feeds because they cannot clear chips fast enough.

That's me done with this topic now but to all those looking for drives then stay away from Analog drives, Even the cheapest Digital drives are better than Analog and the price difference is nothing.